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Old 03-08-2010, 11:07 PM   #281
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Our Online Shop
This is his website. Learn the Art of Traditional Sheet metal Work.
Bodywork Restoration Tutorial
I'd like to know what you think after looking at the web site.
Don
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Old 03-09-2010, 08:34 AM   #282
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Hi Don,

I was wading through this thread when I came across a weight and balance question:

"I am not a math person. And I often wish I was. My bigest question is how does one make all these weight and placement changes and keep the tongue weight in the right envelope. I would be willing to learn the math, if there is someone out there who would be willing to share formulas and the time."

To my mind an Airstream is essentially a big lever. The wheels are the fulcrum. This link has a calculator that can help you determine the weight and balance of your layout.

http://www.engineersedge.com/calculators/levers/page_levers_1.htm

Hope this helps people out. By the way I am a newbie so if I am way off base here let me know.
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Old 03-09-2010, 09:55 AM   #283
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JFerguson, You are right on. I've been asking myself this question. Several years ago I was pulling a car trailer with a pickup truck on the trailer. We had loaded the truck with the truck facing backwards. This put the weight on the trailer in the wrong place. We were crossing a bridge on the San Francisco Bay. When the wind decided to teach a lesson. To keep this short. I knew I was in deep trouble when I could read the sigh painted on the door of the truck on the trailer in my rear view mirror. All traffic slammed on their brakes. I was luck and got our vehicle stopped in the middle of the bridge. When I looked around there was not another car on the bridge. Both lanes of traffic had seen the event begin and stopped their cars. By the time I'd got my vehicle under control the bridge was clear of traffic.
I was very lucky!!! The lesson of this story. Weight and balance is most important. Tongue weight is the key. Maybe their should be a special thread with "How to manage Tongue Weight- Weight and Balance. Thanks for the great heads up.
Don



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Originally Posted by JFerguson View Post
Hi Don,

I was wading through this thread when I came across a weight and balance question:

"I am not a math person. And I often wish I was. My bigest question is how does one make all these weight and placement changes and keep the tongue weight in the right envelope. I would be willing to learn the math, if there is someone out there who would be willing to share formulas and the time."

To my mind an Airstream is essentially a big lever. The wheels are the fulcrum. This link has a calculator that can help you determine the weight and balance of your layout.

http://www.engineersedge.com/calculators/levers/page_levers_1.htm

Hope this helps people out. By the way I am a newbie so if I am way off base here let me know.
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Old 03-09-2010, 09:59 AM   #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Bambi View Post
Our Online Shop
This is his website. Learn the Art of Traditional Sheet metal Work.
Bodywork Restoration Tutorial
I'd like to know what you think after looking at the web site.
Don
Thanks Don ... as a kid, I always wanted to know how stuff was made. I usually got the answer "by a machine" ... I think to shut me up and hide the fact that my parents didn't know. Thats why I love these kinds of instructional videos but I realize that the guy with 30+ years experience makes it look easier than it would be for me.
Bought the DVD ...
Bob
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Old 03-09-2010, 10:12 AM   #285
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Howdy Bob, You are right on about the guy making it look easy. I don't have 30 years of experience doing what he's doing. And I don't have 30 years left to learn. But that has never stopped me before. I'm having some luck with his technique. I've added a step to the process of using the "spoon" to work out the dents. I've taped a large sheet of clear heavy plastic sheet over the work area. It keeps the Aluminum free of the scratches during the process. I know I probably won't get a perfect surface. But It will be better that what I started with. If you like I could put some pictures on to show what progress I'm having.
Don
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Thanks Don ... as a kid, I always wanted to know how stuff was made. I usually got the answer "by a machine" ... I think to shut me up and hide the fact that my parents didn't know. Thats why I love these kinds of instructional videos but I realize that the guy with 30+ years experience makes it look easier than it would be for me.
Bought the DVD ...
Bob
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Old 03-09-2010, 10:16 AM   #286
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Originally Posted by NorCal Bambi View Post
Howdy Bob, You are right on about the guy making it look easy. I don't have 30 years of experience doing what he's doing. And I don't have 30 years left to learn. But that has never stopped me before. I'm having some luck with his technique. I've added a step to the process of using the "spoon" to work out the dents. I've taped a large sheet of clear heavy plastic sheet over the work area. It keeps the Aluminum free of the scratches during the process. I know I probably won't get a perfect surface. But It will be better that what I started with. If you like I could put some pictures on to show what progress I'm having.
Don
You have to ASK if anybody wants to see pictures? Heck yeah! I bet EVERYBODY wants to see pictures!
Bob
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Old 03-09-2010, 10:53 AM   #287
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Dent repair

This is the dents on the rear curb side of my trailer. These are the dents I'm working on to begin with. The first part is to study the dent and decide where the damage started. Two thoughts on that. One a PO was backing up and ran into some shrubs. And or someone was pushing the trailer by hand and creased the metal by pushing it inward. The creases in the metal indicate the result of a "poping in" force. I'd be interested in anyone else having a thought about what caused these dents. How the dents were formed and the direction of force is the first step in dent removal. I'll include some more pictures on my progress this evening.
Don
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:01 AM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Bambi View Post
This is the dents on the rear curb side of my trailer. These are the dents I'm working on to begin with. The first part is to study the dent and decide where the damage started. Two thoughts on that. One a PO was backing up and ran into some shrubs. And or someone was pushing the trailer by hand and creased the metal by pushing it inward. The creases in the metal indicate the result of a "poping in" force. I'd be interested in anyone else having a thought about what caused these dents. How the dents were formed and the direction of force is the first step in dent removal. I'll include some more pictures on my progress this evening.
Don
Looks like one big dent in and many hits from the inside trying to bang out the dent out ... does the damage reach the end cap? Does the guy on the DVD show how to shrink aluminum?
Bob
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Old 03-09-2010, 12:58 PM   #289
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Dent repair 2

Here are two photos on the dent work. The first is the original series of dents. The second is the work done on the dents so far. Apx. 3 hours work. There are some other area in this work section I'll show soon. I've tried to use lighting that magnifies the dents. This is helpful in the evaluation of the dent.
Xbob, yes the video talks about shrinking. Basically that is done by working the metal. I believe that is because aluminum is a metal that works easily.

Also the next series of photo will show some errors I've made so far and what I think is needed to prevent these problems.
Don
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Old 03-09-2010, 04:13 PM   #290
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I knew an expert autobody man when I was just a little Viking, 10 years old. He would use a lead hammer and shaped dies to return sheetmetal to its original shape. Stretching and shrinking is also done on auto bodies, but its necessary to get to both sides of the part at the same time or have a helper with ESP so he can put the die in exactly the right place for you to hit it. Most bodywork done now is "cut & paste". The art has mostly gone out of the bodywork profession it seems.
Rich the Viking
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Old 03-09-2010, 04:19 PM   #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Bambi View Post
Here are two photos on the dent work. The first is the original series of dents. The second is the work done on the dents so far. Apx. 3 hours work. There are some other area in this work section I'll show soon. I've tried to use lighting that magnifies the dents. This is helpful in the evaluation of the dent.
Xbob, yes the video talks about shrinking. Basically that is done by working the metal. I believe that is because aluminum is a metal that works easily.

Also the next series of photo will show some errors I've made so far and what I think is needed to prevent these problems.
Don
Always open for comments and input from others in this forum.
If you haven't discovered this yet. If you click on the pictures that are posted, you will get an enlargement.
Wow! The improvement is striking!
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Old 03-09-2010, 07:05 PM   #292
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Rich, you are so correct about the cut an paste approach to things. One of the thinks I have enjoyed about the forums is there seems to still be a group of people who pride them selves in the Artistic approach. The competition of business today makes cut and paste a necessity. A good example is the TV program "Overhaulin" Foose and his teams are rear artisans in the modern sense. However when time is the essence a new part is used. I am an artist, and that's my fault, and I dream that someday in the future I will get to run my hand over the shell of the 55 with pride.
Maybe the "ART" has always been up to the individual.
Don
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I knew an expert autobody man when I was just a little Viking, 10 years old. He would use a lead hammer and shaped dies to return sheetmetal to its original shape. Stretching and shrinking is also done on auto bodies, but its necessary to get to both sides of the part at the same time or have a helper with ESP so he can put the die in exactly the right place for you to hit it. Most bodywork done now is "cut & paste". The art has mostly gone out of the bodywork profession it seems.
Rich the Viking
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Old 03-09-2010, 07:05 PM   #293
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Written prior to Don's previous post. But it is a point to those who are freshly starting to do a restore.

I know (or think) that you are working the dent as a challange. You are working a flat panel that is easily (relative) to replace.

I have thought about this many of times. Is it better, cheaper, less time consuming to just buy and replace aluminum than it is to scape paint, buff and repaint?

In this case, minus all the fun of learning and accomplishment, if you were to analyze the work and effort and the final product compared to a fresh sheet of aluminum, is it worth it? This is not really a cut and dry question. More of a sit around and have a drink and talk about it type thing. (at least to me)
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Old 03-09-2010, 07:08 PM   #294
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FC7039, I know you are right. My wife says I have a problem. I'm sure she is correct.
Don
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I know (or think) that you are working the dent as a challange. You are working a flat panel that is easily (relative) to replace.

I have thought about this many of times. Is it better, cheaper, less time consuming to just buy and replace aluminum than it is to scape paint, buff and repaint?

In this case, minus all the fun of learning and accomplishment, if you were to analyze the work and effort and the final product compared to a fresh sheet of aluminum, is it worth it? This is not really a cut and dry question. More of a sit around and have a drink and talk about it type thing. (at least to me)
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