Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-24-2012, 02:32 PM   #15
Rivet Master
 
InsideOut's Avatar

 
1956 22' Safari
Vintage Kin Owner
Conifer/Evergreen , Colorado
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 11,793
Images: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by utee94 View Post
So there are a couple of issues here, if you want to do a full floor replacement with the shell on.

First, the way to remove the bellypan, is to drill out all of the rivets all the way around the outside.

<snip>

So if you truly want to do a shell-on, and do the entire floor at the same time, then you might consider how to stabilize the shell in the meantime.
We were challenged with doing the floor replacement of our '56 Safari "shell-on". Yes, it may have been easier to remove the shell, but that wasn't a luxury we had, mostly due to lack of staging space and the 2 year duration of getting the floor and systems work done before everything was reattached. We had no place to store the shell if it had been removed and our work area was all outside, with the floor replacement spanning over the winter months.

FWIW, our belly skin wasn’t folded over the c-channel, but it really wouldn’t make a difference if it was. We left the belly, c-channel & skin all attached and didn’t remove any rivets initially at the perimeter (except around the wheel wells) or as needed for extra flexibility a portion at a time. The shell/belly was, as others have suggested, “free-floating” but it wasn’t a problem at all because as we removed the floor a portion at a time, we used 1x boards (actual size ĺ”) c-clamped between the c-channel & frame as temporary supports. Each outrigger ended up with a board by the time all of the old floor was removed. The c-channel spanned between the outriggers, which are only about 2' apart. Then we would remove the temp boards and replace with the new floor a couple sections at a time to get the new floor (marine plywood) in place. The skins actually flexed enough to facilitate getting the boards into place. Some places we have to loosen the next set of clamps, but it still stayed supported 2/3's at a time.

Another option we considered, but did not do, was to leave the banana wrap portion of the belly pan in place and only cut away the flat bottom part of the belly skin, about a foot inside the curve (towards the centerline of your trailer). This way you don't have to mess with the hidden rivets at the c-channel. You can leave the shell attached to the c-channel and yet allow full access to the underside of the frame - the curve parts of the belly are flexible except at the corners, but there aren’t any outriggers there, so you can temporarily tweak them to get to the 1-foot at the outriggers, if need be. While the old floor is removed, use 3/4" boards laid on the frame and held in place with c-clamps as we did. When done with the floor, put new flat sheets of aluminum for the belly pan overlapping the cut edge by a couple of inches or so. We didn’t do this because our belly pan did not need to be replaced - but if it had, we would have gne this route.

The beauty of either of these approaches is that the c-channel/shell retained the original shape and a whole lot of drilling out & replacing of rivets was eliminated. It also make getting the shell/c-channel/frame all lined up and centered as a unit – no chance of rivets misaligning when it all goes back together. Worked great for us…if you have any questions, either post or PM and I'll answer best I can.

Shari
__________________

__________________
Vintage Airstream Club - Past President 2007/2008
WBCCI #1824 - DenCO Unit Past President (2005)
AIR #30 - Join Date: 2-25-2002

RMVAC | WBCCI DenCO Unit | Sisters on the Fly | Tin Can Tourists
BIRDY - our 1956 Safari | 1964 Serro Scotty
InsideOut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 03:46 PM   #16
Rivet Master
 
nmbosa's Avatar
 
1959 26' Overlander
Nowhere , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 572
Quote:
Originally Posted by utee94 View Post
The other implication is that if you remove all of the hidden rivets holding the bellypan to the c-channel, and then remove all of the exterior rivets holding the shell to the c-channel, and if you do this all the way around your trailer, your shell will now be floating, unattached to the frame, floor, or anything else. Only friction will be holding it up, and I don't know that the Force of Friction will be enough to stabilize it.

I only did the back half of mine, so the front half remained stable.

So if you truly want to do a shell-on, and do the entire floor at the same time, then you might consider how to stabilize the shell in the meantime.

Good luck!
-Marcus
What Marcus has basically pointed out is that any full-floor replacement is for all practical purposes a shell-off project. It's just a matter of where the shell is stored during the work. Take a look at Someday59's blog. They hit a point where their shell began to fall off the frame. It can be done, but you just have to be aware of the fact that once the bellypan and floor is removed, the shell is airborne and can come crashing to the ground around your frame.

Norm
__________________

__________________
Norm and Mary
blog: Captain Wilson's Overlander
nmbosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 04:12 PM   #17
Rivet Master
 
pbearsailor's Avatar

 
1957 22' Caravanner
Port Hadlock , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 863
Mine was shell on as well. Mostly like Shari's option #2. I cut the belly pan off leaving about a one foot perimeter all the way around. I kept the shell supported by small pieces of 3/4" ply on the outriggers. My belly pan was replaced after the subfloor was in and holding tanks installed. It was bent over my c channel like many are and there were a bunch of hidden rivets.

I replaced the belly pan by drilling out the exterior rivets one section at a time to maintain the support for the shell. It was about the most frustrating part of the work that I did, especially trying to get a good smooth fit on the corners.

Mine had to be shell on as I just had no place to put the shell. If I ever did it again, I'd go shell off somehow and I'd flip the frame over to do the belly like it was done originally by the factory.

cheers,
steve
__________________
Forum Thread: First She Had to Take a Ride on a Boat

Blog: My 57 Caravanner
pbearsailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 04:13 PM   #18
3 Rivet Member
 
1957 26' Overlander
Victoria , British Columbia
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 124
How about this...

I am spacially challenged too and at this point I don't yet see any reason to take the shell off. I see advantages to that approach for sure, would do it if I had the space...

My belly pan will have to go for sure- it is in peices and the PO tore into to fix plumbing in 3 or 4 spots, and the outriggers have worn holes along the sides so after a thoughtful assessment last nigh I realized there is nothing there to salvage.

I also though of cutting the belly pan off at a foot as you described but I think that won't work because there are holes worn from the outriggers rubbing through...

So, would this work:

1--cut away the belly pan but leave 6" hanging down all around (like a mini-skirt)
2--remove the floor, install tanks and replace the floor in sections as described by you below, then
3--remove the rivets attaching outer shell to c channel
4--stuff a new belly pan in over top of the old belly pan, re-rivet to c channel.
5--go camping

So excited to get going on this!

Oh- one more question: I plan to just take the windows out one at a time, rebuild and refit them as time permits....There is no sequencing concerns, no depenacies--- I can just de-rivet, fix and re-revit, right? Best to polish them up in peices then reassemble and reinstall too I suppose?

Mark
__________________
Sparky57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 05:07 PM   #19
Rivet Master
 
pbearsailor's Avatar

 
1957 22' Caravanner
Port Hadlock , Washington
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 863
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky57 View Post
So, would this work:

1--cut away the belly pan but leave 6" hanging down all around (like a mini-skirt)
2--remove the floor, install tanks and replace the floor in sections as described by you below, then
3--remove the rivets attaching outer shell to c channel
4--stuff a new belly pan in over top of the old belly pan, re-rivet to c channel.
5--go camping


Mark
Maybe jumping the gun on going camping just a wee bit.

On the belly, that's close to what I did. No need to leave any of the old there as it'll just capture water and contribute to corrosion and it won't fit well inside the exterior skin as one more layer. You can get the old one off, just have to unbend the part over the C channel.

I just did a section at a time, like front curbside corner, and only drilled out the rivets for that part before sliding the new belly pan inside the exterior skin and the C channel. Really wanted to make sure my shell was totally supported. If you do it this way, the belly pan can be put off for quite awhile in your work, and really just has to be done before you put the inside lower skins back on.

One step at a time and one day at a time and it'll get done.

-steve
__________________
Forum Thread: First She Had to Take a Ride on a Boat

Blog: My 57 Caravanner
pbearsailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 05:19 PM   #20
Rivet Master
 
InsideOut's Avatar

 
1956 22' Safari
Vintage Kin Owner
Conifer/Evergreen , Colorado
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 11,793
Images: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky57 View Post
So, would this work:

1--cut away the belly pan but leave 6" hanging down all around (like a mini-skirt)
2--remove the floor, install tanks and replace the floor in sections as described by you below, then
3--remove the rivets attaching outer shell to c channel
4--stuff a new belly pan in over top of the old belly pan, re-rivet to c channel.
5--go camping

So excited to get going on this!

Oh- one more question: I plan to just take the windows out one at a time, rebuild and refit them as time permits....There is no sequencing concerns, no depenacies--- I can just de-rivet, fix and re-revit, right? Best to polish them up in peices then reassemble and reinstall too I suppose?

Mark
Sounds like it would work to me...we did basically that on one small section of belly we did replace. BTW, you can kinda get to most of the blind rivets with a sharpened metal paint scraper and hammer once the interior skins are removed. You can see them from the inside of the c-channel and slip the scraper between the skins then give 'em a whack.

Window-wise, it's much easier to polish them off the trailer...the screens are easier to change out too.

Shari
__________________
Vintage Airstream Club - Past President 2007/2008
WBCCI #1824 - DenCO Unit Past President (2005)
AIR #30 - Join Date: 2-25-2002

RMVAC | WBCCI DenCO Unit | Sisters on the Fly | Tin Can Tourists
BIRDY - our 1956 Safari | 1964 Serro Scotty
InsideOut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2012, 02:51 PM   #21
3 Rivet Member
 
1957 26' Overlander
Victoria , British Columbia
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 124
Ok- Thanks for all the advice. I am going to soap up the panels inside, pressure wash and tsp, maybe not in that order, then mark and label all the panels, take 1000 photos and then start taking them down for long term storage.
When I put them back up I think I will be just sanding and then priming painting over the zolatone paint job- it is in perfect condition, not a scratch or flake missing anywhere. Then the floor starts coming out.

BTW- I will be ordering tanks for the floor- at least one grey and one black...where's the best place to get such a thing? What are the best options- I was thinking a wash out valve and I plan on wiring in one of those electronic fill monitors. Anything else I should consider? I have 3 daughters, so I am thinking 2 grey water tanks....one big one for the shower, another for the sink area that is smaller. Thoughts?

Mark
__________________
Sparky57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2012, 03:20 PM   #22
Rivet Master
 
Someday'59's Avatar

 
1959 26' Overlander
Powder Springs , Georgia
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 641
Images: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmbosa View Post
Take a look at Someday59's blog. They hit a point where their shell began to fall off the frame. It can be done, but you just have to be aware of the fact that once the bellypan and floor is removed, the shell is airborne and can come crashing to the ground around your frame.
A scary few moments, indeed!!!

1959 Airstream Overlander, "Someday": Lessons Learned

I agree with Steve, too. If we did ours again we would try to find a way to do shell-off and flip the frame over to redo the belly. That way just seems so much easier.
__________________
~Lynnetta

my restoration & travel blog:
http://someday1959.blogspot.com
Someday'59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2012, 04:57 PM   #23
Rivet Master
 
Minno's Avatar

 
1972 31' Sovereign
Lexington , Minnesota
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,323
We did a shell on floor replacement on Little Girl. We did the rear two plywood sheets first to build confidence, and then the rest of the trailer at once. To support the shell, we clamped pieces of 1x4 (about 9 to 12 inches long) to each outrigger as we removed plywood. The edge of the 1x4 was slipped into the c-channel and it supported the shell. This kept the shell from becoming air born and falling off the frame. As we installed pieces of plywood, we would remove the 1x3 supports and slip the plywood under the c-channel. I also made a tool to help pull the sides back in together and seat the c-channel on the new plywood fully. If interested, you can see pictures of this process here, starting at post #30, and again at post #47: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f185...b-50967-3.html

Chris



__________________
Minno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2012, 05:39 PM   #24
3 Rivet Member
 
1957 26' Overlander
Victoria , British Columbia
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 124
Minno your scaring me! I am beginning to see that the shells are very light, can shift easily when detached from the floor, etc. I will be super cautious now.

So the C channel is held in place by elevator bolts, and the floor is also screwed to the frame in other spots too, so if I take all those bolts out then the floor should slide out.

So, I have to go slow, brace as I go, do a section at a time, go it!
__________________
Sparky57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2012, 06:16 PM   #25
Rivet Master
 
Minno's Avatar

 
1972 31' Sovereign
Lexington , Minnesota
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,323
Well, I meant to help you, not scare you!

One problem with doing it a section at a time - if you leave the shell and c-channel bolted to the frame right next to the plywood section you're replacing, you won't have any flex in the shell for sliding the new plywood into place. So, you'll at least want to remove the elevator bolts holding the c-channel to the next section of plywood. I did have one spot where the c-channel and shell dropped off the outrigger, and I used a bottle jack to raise it back up into place. My experience from that was that the shell will pretty much hold itself up, even if a 2 to 4 foot section slips out of place.

There are a few threads where the owners replaced the plywood floor by splitting it front to back over one of the main framing members. According to some folks, there are drawbacks to doing that type of floor replacement, as the theory is the floor isn't as strong as if you left the plywood in one piece. I mention it because it is another option for you to consider.

Chris
__________________
Minno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2012, 10:17 AM   #26
3 Rivet Member
 
1957 26' Overlander
Victoria , British Columbia
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 124
Bit and pieces

Here are some photos of the bits and pieces some of you were curious about. I will post more pics. I have more of all of those handles, and hinges too. Thinking it is all original, most of the trailer was untouched
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0675.jpg
Views:	113
Size:	292.6 KB
ID:	152009   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0677.jpg
Views:	108
Size:	322.5 KB
ID:	152010  

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0680.jpg
Views:	116
Size:	221.3 KB
ID:	152011   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0686.jpg
Views:	108
Size:	400.7 KB
ID:	152012  

__________________
Sparky57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2012, 10:29 AM   #27
3 Rivet Member
 
1957 26' Overlander
Victoria , British Columbia
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 124
more...

Here are a couple of the reading lamps- might keep these ones, they have a cool Canadiana feel to them.The medicine cabinet is in good shape, and there is a magazine rack just like the black metal patterned lamp. The material is the original curtains- plan on turning them into pillows or something. In strangely good shape and almost stylish.

I got all the plywood exposed yesterday in the trailer....nothing rotten really so now I am wondering why replace it.....but I think I will anyway. You only get one chance at this don't you?

As for the stuff - let me know if there is something you are interested in.

Mark
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0682.jpg
Views:	106
Size:	256.1 KB
ID:	152014   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0681.jpg
Views:	116
Size:	257.3 KB
ID:	152015  

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0679.jpg
Views:	104
Size:	305.5 KB
ID:	152016   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0674.jpg
Views:	105
Size:	455.9 KB
ID:	152017  

__________________
Sparky57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2012, 10:37 AM   #28
Rivet Master
 
Someday'59's Avatar

 
1959 26' Overlander
Powder Springs , Georgia
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 641
Images: 18
I would really love the round center light fixture!
__________________

__________________
~Lynnetta

my restoration & travel blog:
http://someday1959.blogspot.com
Someday'59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
1957, 1957 overlander


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
1967 Airstream Overlander eBay Watch Airstreams on eBay 0 02-21-2012 11:00 AM
1967 airstream overlander camper trailer eBay Watch Airstreams on eBay 0 02-20-2012 06:50 PM
1957 airstream 22' custom eBay Watch Airstreams on eBay 0 02-20-2012 06:20 PM
1966 Airstream Overlander eBay Watch Airstreams on eBay 0 02-16-2012 06:10 AM
Someday :: 1959 Airstream Overlander Someday'59 Airstream Registry Discussions 0 02-13-2012 12:32 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.