What The Heck!! Is This Right?

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by 53flyingcloud

Oh, I get it..
GMC is Gov't Motors Corp..

Don't be surprised if the GMC truck line is put to rest after this fiasco is over.

Do 'ya ram it or just get out of the way?

[Minnie's Mate]

Will the feds let GM go under after taking it over, so to speak? Will the feds put over 100K of its citizens out of work? I doubt it. They will just fork over more of our tax $$$'s for bailout round two so they can end up socializing the auto industry. I think Crystler is so far gone is the reason they are forcing them to sell out to a foreign company. Never thought I'd see the day our government would force the sell of a US company to a foreign one. Well, I guess when they are too far gone, it's the only way to save face.

[Gene]

No one else wants Chrysler, even GM turned it down. Only Fiat has enough money to buy a shell of a company so it can get access to its dealer network. Cerebus got it from Daimler for pretty much nothing just to get rid of it.

Gene

[Lily&Me]

Originally Posted by jcanavera

I wonder if Thor got out of the finance side? I got a letter from them that my payment is now going to GE....although it is being mailed to the same address.

Jack

We got the same letter from Thor, who financed us for 6.99% with 10% down in 2007. We wanted to refinance now to get a better interest rate, after some phone calls eventually spoke with GE who told us they had "acquired" Thor financing. To make a longish story shorter, Prairieland Credit Union here gave us 5 1/2%, signing the papers this am, takes several years off the loan.

We had thought about making double payments at some point, to pay the AS off early, determined that the tax deduction on the loan interest was more beneficial to us as we have our home paid off and being able to itemize deductions is biggie.

We were told many years ago by a financial advisor that the basic rule of thumb is to use your own money for things that appreciate in value and others' money for things that depreciate, which we generally live by and has served us pretty well. Keeping your credit rating up is critical, and good financing is out there even today.

[Ganaraska]

Originally Posted by doug&maggie

We got the same letter from Thor, who financed us for 6.99% with 10% down in 2007. We wanted to refinance now to get a better interest rate, after some phone calls eventually spoke with GE who told us they had "acquired" Thor financing. To make a longish story shorter, Prairieland Credit Union here gave us 5 1/2%, signing the papers this am, takes several years off the loan.

We had thought about making double payments at some point, to pay the AS off early, determined that the tax deduction on the loan interest was more beneficial to us as we have our home paid off and being able to itemize deductions is biggie.

We were told many years ago by a financial advisor that the basic rule of thumb is to use your own money for things that appreciate in value and others' money for things that depreciate, which we generally live by and has served us pretty well. Keeping your credit rating up is critical, and good financing is out there even today.

Your financial advisor is nuts. It is smart to go into debt for things that appreciate, dangerous to go into debt for things that depreciate. Think it over.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by Ganaraska

Your financial advisor is nuts. It is smart to go into debt for things that appreciate, dangerous to go into debt for things that depreciate. Think it over.

Exactly what I was told last month, that's why were paying out early.

[HowieE]

Originally Posted by Ganaraska

Your financial advisor is nuts. It is smart to go into debt for things that appreciate, dangerous to go into debt for things that depreciate. Think it over.

He is NUTS is a polite way of putting it.

That is why we are in this mess and have millions of people upsidedown in auto, boat, and trailer loans.

A good financial adviser would have told you, if you can't afford to pay cash for a depreciating asset you can't afford it. But that is not the American way.

[Lily&Me]

Hmmmmmmmm. Some very strong feelings on this matter! I do see what you are saying, don't agree there is only one way to do this.

We are 60 and in our second full year of retirement, have a paid for home, a nice chunk of money with Edward Jones and our only debt is our AS Interstate---so we have apparently made some pretty good decisions with our money over the years. We have excellent credit, have had loans for cars/appliances/carpet, etc., all of them at 0% financing for the past 10 years or so. We get the use of the purchased item while making a monthly payment---everything then paid off before or by the time due. It has worked very well for us. We would NEVER have pulled out cash to pay for our Interstate.

[Gene]

0% financing is wonderful. Each payment, because of inflation, is less in real dollars than the last one. You have make sure you are not paying more for the item because of the financing deal. Sometimes auto companies offer 0% or a rebate—I usually take the rebate in that case.

In a depression or severe recession, when there is deflation over a period of time, then debts can be more expensive to pay off with each payment when income drops and debt payments stay the same. This happened in the Great Depression, the Long Depression (after Civil War) and various Panics prior to WWI. Without serious government stimulus, deflation will occur and even more people will default on loans.

There are different ways to deal with credit and it depends on individual needs and financial standing. Mortgage interest can be useful if at a low rate because it does allow the itemized tax deductions. When you have medical expenses that you can't deduct unless you have other deductions, mortgage interest can help get past the thresholds, for example. It takes some understanding of how the tax code works to take advantage of these things.

Gene

[Lily&Me]

Wow! Thank you, Gene. Your depth of understanding here far exceeds ours, but we ARE careful and don't allow ourselves to be screwed (pardon). We are very middle-income, were both raised by "Depression kids" and have a generally frugal approach to life---although we like a nice home and a nice travel home , we stay small so we can have nice and still live within our means. We have maintained a very good level of savings the past 15 years or so, the ability to pay off immediately in cash any debt we have taken on, should the need arise, and have never defaulted on anything.

[Minnie's Mate]

Way to go D&M! BTW, houses are considered assets that appreciate...until last year when the average house lost 19.8%. I guess nothing is depreciation proof. I guess that means no one in America except the super wealthy can afford to own a house anymore.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Oh great another pizzen contest.

The operative word here is....ZERO%.

Why pay interest on something thats worth less and less every day? Pay it off if you can.

[Bluto]

Well, It just looks like it is still not the right time to finance a new trailer.
Just to speculate a little, I think that the interest rates will come down a little more on items like RV's and TT's in the next few months. When that happens I'll be ready to jump on a good deal and I'm pretty sure the dealerships that are still standing will want to deal at that time too. Also, by then the 2009 model will be an old model year as the 2010's will start to roll of the line in Jackson Center. I have a 2009 in my site.

[Motoman]

Originally Posted by 53flyingcloud

There was a time when Airstream did offered a RV loan program but, the requirements was extremely tight and, YOU had to have a outstanding credit rating. My experiences: There were only a very, very small handful of people who would fitted that profile.
Good Luck 2 you~ it can be done..
53FC

Our experience with Airstream was that THOR had financing at reasonable rates, one buying a new 22' CCD in 2004 from a dealer in CA and the second one buying a used 25' CCD from a dealer in TN. Both were 15 year terms with a reasonable amount down.

THOR probably won't loan on a private Airstream purchase but the loan terms might make purchasing from a dealer more attractive than buying from a private party.

[Gene]

Will there be many 2009's to buy? Production was down last year and the factory was closed a lot—something like from the latter part of December until late February. Have they brought down inventory?

Generally, inventory from all manufacturing piled up in mid 2008 and by late 2008, factories were slowing down production or closing, the same as Airstream. At some point inventory is worked off, prices start to rise and slowly, ever so slowly, a few people are hired back and production starts to increase a little with the manufacturers hoping to keep prices up to make up for all their losses. Recovery does not blast forward. The stock market will go up before anything else does, but whether this present upward trend is real or not—ask me in 2010.

So the sweet spot to buy may be now, maybe later. The thing to watch is inventory, both nationwide and for Airstream. Buy before inventory has gotten really low because low inventory increases prices.

Gene

[StevenG]

For a good deal, timing is everything, as is the desire (desperation?) of a dealer to sell, whether a tv he's paying interest on to the bank(?) to carry his inventory, or an Airstream. My wife and I have quit buying anything not essential, and are busy paying off all debt. Things are going to get worse.

Steven

[Lily&Me]

Originally Posted by StevenG

For a good deal, timing is everything, as is the desire (desperation?) of a dealer to sell, whether a tv he's paying interest on to the bank(?) to carry his inventory, or an Airstream. My wife and I have quit buying anything not essential, and are busy paying off all debt. Things are going to get worse.

Paying off debt is very wise, especially if you don't otherwise have the immediate ability to do so should everything go to hell in a handbasket. We believe that having good, established credit is a very important life tool, but also that you MUST live within your means. Credit checks have become aroutine part of employer pre-screening.

There is an excellent book out there entitled "The Millionaire Next Door", which every adult should read. Many good tips on handling your own money, how people amass real wealth, etc.

[Ganaraska]

There is another angle on this business. If you follow the financial news you know the stock market is way up on reports of large profits by banks and mortgage companies. Thanks to the way they have been screwing their customers with record high interest rate spreads (meaning, they are borrowing for 2% or less while soaking their customers with high interest rates).

Experts say this rise in stock prices is bogus because the banks are still broke and the assets in their vaults are still worthless. One quarter's profits mean nothing when they are bankrupt to start with.

This may be one last attempt to juice up stock prices so the big boys can bail out before the market collapses completely.

So if you have any money in the stock market this may be your last chance to get out and get the cash. You have been warned.

[Gene]

One of the reasons for the rise in the stock market is the US accounting board relaxed the mark to market rule. Mark to market means assets have to be valued at their actual value instead of some hoped for value. The banks put great pressure to get this done. On paper it looks like a compromise, but looks to me to be full of loopholes.

So the US banks' financial statements look better, but they aren't. Does this feel familiar? Because it makes things look better, people are more likely to buy stocks. This is all messy, but it does appear things may be getting a little better, though job losses and dividend suspensions won't stop for a while.

Note that in the past month when the market has gone up, trades have been much higher than on days when it has gone down. This is the reverse of what happens during a downward period. No one can say what will happen in the future—is this a dead cat bounce or the beginnings of a long term market recovery. If the latter, getting out now will mean losing money for most people.

I don't know that the NYSE has had a complete collapse since it started under a tree in the 18th Century. That would mean the total collapse of just about every corporation with publicly traded stock and perhaps dissolution of governments. Then all that money taken out of the markets would be worthless and trade would cease. Gold would drop too. Bartering would be the only way to survive. I don't think that's happening.

Gene

[Ganaraska]

It may not have collapsed in the last year and it may not have collapsed in 1929 - 1932 when the Dow lost 80% of its value. But I'm glad I went to cash last fall. And I'm not planning on getting back in till next year or until the bezzle is out of the market.

My guess is that this is a bear market rally. It may end Monday or it may go on for a few more weeks but I will be the most surprised guy in the world if the averages don't test the lows before fall.