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03-24-2017, 02:57 PM
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#1
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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Wiring
A word of caution to help you all with 2017 Classic. If you remove the lower front panel on the dinette seat closest to the refridgerator you close it and quite possibly never move the trailer again.
We have finished our winter in FL and I was removing seats and drawers to vacuum up fur from our two Labradors. I finished except this dinette seat and removed the panel, I've never seen such a wiring nightmare in anything I've looked at. Plug ins, light gauge wires, heavy gauge wires you name it all piled and stuffed in this area.
Now, our Classic was used in all kinds of weather, from 18 degrees to 95; blazing hot sun, heavy rain and high winds. Everything worked, a few glitches, but all worked. Comfortable and fun to use.
__________________
2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-24-2017, 03:10 PM
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#2
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4 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Green Cove Springs
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 479
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paiceman
A word of caution to help you all with 2017 Classic. If you remove the lower front panel on the dinette seat closest to the refridgerator you close it and quite possibly never move the trailer again.
We have finished our winter in FL and I was removing seats and drawers to vacuum up fur from our two Labradors. I finished except this dinette seat and removed the panel, I've never seen such a wiring nightmare in anything I've looked at. Plug ins, light gauge wires, heavy gauge wires you name it all piled and stuffed in this area.
Now, our Classic was used in all kinds of weather, from 18 degrees to 95; blazing hot sun, heavy rain and high winds. Everything worked, a few glitches, but all worked. Comfortable and fun to use.
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I did that day 1. Amazed at what a rats nest it is. Even lower end boats are now using conduit or at least some sort of organized loom for the wiring. I found several parts that should have been screwed down for security that didn't even have a screw in the vicinity. I had a Cat 5 cable that one of the walls was mounted on top of, crushing it. Think the guy putting in the wall might have moved it out of the way...not so much. Devil's in the details.
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Breathe In, Breathe Out, Move On
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03-24-2017, 03:22 PM
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#3
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mojoe7009
I did that day 1. Amazed at what a rats nest it is. Even lower end boats are now using conduit or at least some sort of organized loom for the wiring. I found several parts that should have been screwed down for security that didn't even have a screw in the vicinity. I had a Cat 5 cable that one of the walls was mounted on top of, crushing it. Think the guy putting in the wall might have moved it out of the way...not so much. Devil's in the details.
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Found same. Took a bit of time, screwed down those items which should have been. Organized the wires, but lots more if I decide to do it.
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2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-24-2017, 05:20 PM
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#4
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Rivet Master
2016 30' Classic
Lorton
, Virginia
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 689
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Airstream mainly pays attention to the things in plain sight. The work behind the scenes is cringe-worthy.
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03-24-2017, 05:21 PM
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#5
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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That is being kind zyban
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2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-24-2017, 05:28 PM
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#6
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Rivet Master
2016 30' Classic
Lorton
, Virginia
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paiceman
That is being kind zyban
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I am actually surprised more Airstreams don't burn down. What I like to call "systems"; electrical, plumbing, HVAC, etc are abysmal on Airstreams. I've corrected multiple electric straight up fire hazards on my 2016 Classic. My furnace ducts had holes everywhere, kinks, ducts not even connected to the heater. I've also repaired multiple leaks in the plumbing system.
Virtually every single "systems" component on my unit in an access panel or hidden away was either improperly installed, crushed, not tightened, screwed down Et al. When I see people report how much better AS quality is versus other brands, I get a good laugh.
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03-24-2017, 05:31 PM
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#7
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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Actually I am surprised the wiring as I found is legal
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2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-24-2017, 05:38 PM
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#8
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Rivet Master
2016 30' Classic
Lorton
, Virginia
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paiceman
Actually I am surprised the wiring as I found is legal
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I don't even think there are codes for building RV's. Maybe local codes.
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03-24-2017, 05:45 PM
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#9
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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Probably not, I might look into it - DOT
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2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-24-2017, 06:41 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
2008 22' Safari
Spicewood (W of Austin)
, Texas
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 2,922
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As an aircraft maintenance guy I am appalled at the rat-nests hidden behind and below cabinets in my Airstream. Electrical, plumbing, and other systems are completely disorganized, ...obviously installed totally devoid of pride-of-workmanship.
I first became aware of the RV industry's haphazard construction habit when I flew a wealthy client to visit the NEWELL factory in Oklahoma, where they assemble Million-dollar and UP motorhomes.
When I saw the ordinary automotive wiring, connectors, and electrical-taped twisted-wire connections scattered about behind walls and beneath floors I was shocked at the poor workmanship, especially on such expensive equipment.
Alas,... it's industry-wide. I hope we all will express our dismay at this disregard for care to Thor.
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03-24-2017, 07:20 PM
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#11
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Rivet Master
2016 30' Classic
Lorton
, Virginia
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 689
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Even with the horrendous systems quality of Airstreams, I still like mine. Yes, they are overpriced and the quality isn't that good, but you simply cannot beat aluminum, iconic shape and all those beautiful windows that let light in.
I look at all these huge 5th wheels and Class A's surrounding me, like massive rolling caves.
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03-24-2017, 07:38 PM
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#12
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Rivet Master
2004 28' Classic
Monument
, Colorado
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,565
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Found the same thing in my 2004 Classic when I put in a new battery system. Spent probably 2 hours just cleaning up the wiring mess. As I did other upgrades, I also found a huge mess under the carpeting when I removed it to put down cork flooring. Aluminium shavings, saw dust, wiring insulation bits... Reminded me of working construction back in college when guys would throw beer cans and cigarette packs into the walls before sheet rocking. But I still love the AS...
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DaveP
2004 Airstream Classic 28 "Willard"
2023 Ram 3500 4x4
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03-24-2017, 08:43 PM
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#13
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4 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Green Cove Springs
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 479
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They don't even bother to vacuum up the debris and sawdust behind and underneath the cabinets and furniture. I found wire clippings, wire nuts, loose screws plus copious amounts of dust. Like they just make their cuts and connections and whatever falls on the floor stays there if it is not readily visible when fully assembled.
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Breathe In, Breathe Out, Move On
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03-25-2017, 05:43 AM
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#14
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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Found same mojoe7009. But like others we still like our AS, which is one of many reasons they don't bother doing it right or cleaning up.
__________________
2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-25-2017, 06:50 AM
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#15
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill
, Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,014
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The days of Pride in Workmanship are gone. It is Cover it up and get it out the Door.
Doesn't matter if it is a $20K or a $120K unit.
No thought is given to accessibility or maintenance.
Buyer. Beware.
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03-25-2017, 06:57 AM
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#16
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Rivet Master
2013 31' Classic
billings
, Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,570
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I bought a new Kenworth a few years ago, after a few days I opened the dash panel up to see what was back there, WOW ,you haven't seen anything like this,wires all tangled up going every which way, a real rats nest. Very few hot wires, they are for grounding the relays from the grounding switches, 1.4 million miles later never a problem..no worries...leave it alone..
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03-25-2017, 07:00 AM
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#17
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Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
Upper St Clair
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,943
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tj, I'm actually leaning in that direction. 65 days completed, home yesterday all functions working. I think I'm just going to ignore the best.
__________________
2020 28' Twin Flying Cloud
2021 F350 6.7 King Ranch
USAF Master Training Instructor (TI) & (MTI)- 68-72
Volunteer K9 Rehabilitator & Trainer
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03-25-2017, 10:01 AM
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#18
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Rivet Master
2008 22' Safari
Spicewood (W of Austin)
, Texas
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 2,922
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The aircraft mx industry has an axiom.... No panels or assy's are closed-up until a final inspector views and OK's it. This prevents the person doing the actual work overlooking his own mistakes or sloppiness. The workman knows his work will be inspected by a supervising inspector...which results in better work because the workman cannot simply stuff the wires into the compartment and close it up from view. Chips, saw dust, clippings and disarray are discouraged by that final inspector.
Airstream would do well to copy that procedure with instructions for inspectors to not accept sloppy or messy work product. The advantage to AS would be fewer production problems and warranty issues. (And a better reputation than the one they are presently acquiring in the marketplace.)
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03-25-2017, 11:00 AM
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#19
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Rivet Master
2016 30' Classic
Lorton
, Virginia
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 689
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From what I've seen, most companies will always go for short turn profit gains and less quality over longer term profit gains and reliability. 15 years down the road it will be another management teams problem cleaning up the mess.
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03-31-2017, 12:15 PM
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#20
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Reads a lot
2017 30' Classic
Titusville
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,209
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Why did I read this? Now I know about another potential problem. Geez! Frankly I am just not even going to look at it. Ignorance really is bliss. If it ain't broke.....
Lauri
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Lauri
She Believed She Could so She Did.
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