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03-24-2016, 10:11 AM
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#1
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1 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 26
Nashville
, Tennessee
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 16
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Update insulation or leave it as is?
While I have seen this covered, all situations are different. No, we will not be stationary, so building a structure to keep our trailer warm/cool is not an option and we are not able to move north and south with the seasons, at least for some time.
We will be full-time this fall in our 26' 1975 Argosy. Currently, all cabinetry has been removed and someone restoring one to original has taken those parts. The tub and bathroom sink are out for painting and replacement. Basically, the walls/floor/plumbing/wiring are all there and intact.
We only have so many weekends to work on this crazy project that will include building cabinets/beds/wardrobe...well, everything. PLUS, we are installing solar. Yep, the plate is full.
That being said, we are in Nashville, TN and it gets hot. 100 for a week is standard at least the past few summers and we had plenty of snow too. We will be here for at least one more year and then we want to be able to move around. I SO dread the idea of taking out all those rivets to get behind the walls but if it will make a huge difference in the long run, now is the time. This will be our home and we want to do it right...quickly, but right.
Thanks for any input this knowledgeable group can offer up.
Karyn
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03-24-2016, 10:36 AM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1973 21' Globetrotter
Houston
, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,314
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You only have 1.5" of wall thickness to work with. The fiberglass you have there now gives you about R6. There are all kinds of replacement insulation a out there, with various advantages, but at the end of the day, they will all end up around R6 or R7 just due to the wall thickness and aluminum ribs.
One good reason to futz with the insulation is if you have a rodent infestation in your walls, and you need to remove the mice skeletons and feces.
The best reason to leave it alone is
that you don't have the time to do it. It is a major project.
When the temps hit 100 degrees, try to find a parking spot in the shade, put reflectex between your windows and screens, and install the biggest AC unit (15000 but) you can.
Good luck!
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03-24-2016, 11:03 AM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1999 34' Excella
Currently Looking...
Hillsboro
, Texas
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 6,406
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I coated the roof with HyTech coating. It reduced AC and Heating needs significantly! As the roof is about 1/3 of the external surface area, something to consider. AS does paint the roof.. as they are aware of the value.... but the HyTech coating, being a ceramic insulator really is impressive. You can put your hand on it in the heat of summer with no discomfort.. don't try that when the sun is broadside on the AS...
__________________
Peace and Blessings..
Channing
WBCCI# 30676
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03-25-2016, 09:41 AM
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#4
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1 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 26
Nashville
, Tennessee
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 16
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Ok, I guess I will just leave it alone and work on the external fixes I can make. Honestly, I was hoping for that answer!! The entire thing is currently white anyway, so hopefully that will help...though we don't like the color at all.
Karyn
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03-25-2016, 12:30 PM
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#5
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2 Rivet Member
1963 22' Safari
Vail
, Arizona
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 24
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Is it considered acceptable in the Airstream Community to just paint the whole skin with something like Hy Tech?
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03-25-2016, 01:12 PM
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#6
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Rivet Master
1973 21' Globetrotter
Houston
, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,314
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The original poster's trailer is an Argosy, which is completely painted from the start.
Most of us would not encourage completely painting a shiny aluminum Airstream trailer, though some do anyway. End of the day, its your trailer, you can do with it as you like. But if you have a future resale in mind, painting the exterior of an Airstream is one of the worst things I can think of.
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03-25-2016, 01:42 PM
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#7
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Rivet Master
1977 31' Sovereign
1963 26' Overlander
1989 34' Excella
Johnsburg
, Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,944
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White roof makes sense. Even Airstream does it now. Special paint may help a little. Do not use house paint, as it chalks and makes white streaks down the side. Koolseal seals some minor leaks. Two tone the sides to your desires. A good awning and shade cover will help keep it cooler in the summer.
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03-25-2016, 02:40 PM
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#8
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:SPACE A" S/O 11 Air19745
2006 34' Classic S/O
Fort Worth
, Texas
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,766
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If you are going to put on solar why not get AM Solar or Lew to send you six 100 watt panels and their stand-off, but level panel brackets. Then it will cool the panel and provide roof shade too. With their 3,000 watt inverter/charge you can run your air on a 2,000 watt genny. Add Lithiums and you could run the A/C on them for a while. Ask Lew about it. I sure like mine and he did a superb job. Expensive, yes, but it is the best add on since the tow vehicle. Cheaper too, but maybe not as necessary.
guskmg
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03-26-2016, 10:50 AM
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#9
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3 Rivet Member
1989 32' Excella
Sharon Springs
, New York
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 172
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One of the first things I did with my old AS was to paint the roof white (just like the new AS units on the lot). Didn't use any special paint, just white roof coating out of Walmart's, $20 and it was done. I'll do it every year if needed as part of checking/sealing the roof. Other upgrades include upgrading the A/C to 15k as the OEM 13.5k is over 25 years old anyway, new vent fans, new window curtains/shades and tinting the windows that need a redo. I'm lucky as I have awnings all around the trailer(4) so that would help you as well if you have them already (pricey to buy new). I wouldn't put the effort into re-insulation(unless tearing out the interior walls anyway), you have or will have enough work to do already. Another option I looked at is a swamp cooler, but it appears that they work best in areas of lower humidity.
Good Luck
JDB
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03-28-2016, 09:36 AM
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#10
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1 Rivet Member
1975 Argosy 26
Nashville
, Tennessee
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 16
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I have been wondering if we would be better off going with the hard panels for the shade or the curved ones for the low profile and sleeker look. I wonder how much of an advantage the shade would provide opposed to fixed curved ones. SO many decisions to be made. It is interesting to think that we could run the AC with our smaller generator in conjunction with the solar. We have no real desire to get a larger generator so is a very 'cool', ha ha,option
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06-05-2019, 04:08 PM
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#11
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Still Dreaming
1971 29' Ambassador
Sulphur Springs
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 125
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This is a double post, but this seems like the place to post it.
I have some history with HYTECH roof coating. I bought into the NASA technology line and painted a double-wide roof with it, It is very nice paint. It adhered well and was VERY bright. So for reflectiveness (I'm not sure that is a word), it gets very good marks.
The R rating thing just gnawed at me, however, so I did a simple test. I painted part of my hot water pipe as it leaves the heater, two coats. Then I checked the temperature with an IR thermometer. There was ZERO difference between the temp of the unpainted section of pipe and the painted section.
This means that the paint has NO insulating value.
Don't get me wrong, it is nice paint, with great reflectivity, but don't expect ANY insulation from the magic ceramic balls!
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06-05-2019, 04:36 PM
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#12
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Rivet Master
2012 25' FB Eddie Bauer
Vintage Kin Owner
Virginia Beach
, Virginia
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manning G
This is a double post, but this seems like the place to post it.
I have some history with HYTECH roof
There was ZERO difference between the temp of the unpainted section of pipe and the painted section.
This means that the paint has NO insulating value.
Don't get me wrong, it is nice paint, with great reflectivity, but don't expect ANY insulation from the magic ceramic balls!
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Isn't there actually a difference between insulation and blocking sun? One simmer I notoced a neighbor put up bamboo matchstick blinds outside his screened windows, and he showed me with a thermomerer that a lot less heat penetrated into the room than when blinds were used on the inside. Reflecting back solar glare heat before it penetrates could be absolutely tested. Paint one half of a largish sheet of aluminum with the magic ball paint, let ot sit in the sun, then measure the temperatures on each side.
An awning blocks Light, yet it is 10 degrees cooler than clear sunlight.
__________________
Today is a gift, that's why they call it the present.
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06-05-2019, 04:58 PM
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#13
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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Airstream's are three season trailers. You can compensate for hot weather by airconditioning. The best method would probably be adding a second unit. That will allow you to turn on the additional unit when you get into extremes. Over sizing a single unit can have its issues, due to the fact that while a single larger unit may be able to cool the trailer down, it may not run long enough when temperatures are at an extreme, to remove the humidity which gives you that cold clammy feeling.
Where you really have to deal with is winter cold. Part of that issue is supplying fresh water, dealing with moisture condensation inside, and finally making sure you can keep internal water lines from freezing. The existing gas furnace systems can do a pretty good job there, but you will use a lot of gas. I remember using half a tank of gas (15 lbs) in 48 hours, on a cold windy October while staying in Springfield Illinois. You can use electric heaters to augment or instead of using your furnace, but you have to be cognitive of the fact that the heat without the furnace blower may not penetrate all the areas where piping is located. You might have to have an auxiliary 100 lb. propane tank that can sit next to your trailer to keep you from having to get weekly refills.
So truly the answer is insulation and things like window coverings to add a thermal barrier. I can tell you there is nothing more uncomfortable that having the furnace reach the set point, and within minutes feel the cold coming off those walls.
Personally if was my intent to live full time in a trailer in climates that can get very cold, I'd probably look for a manufacturer that can build a trailer that has a winter pack, or insulation option.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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06-06-2019, 07:39 AM
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#14
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Living Riveted since 2013
2016 Interstate Lounge Ext
Green Cove Springs
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 8,201
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Folks keep saying this because it's true: the best climate control equipment in your Airstream is the wheels under it and the vehicle you pull it with. Airstream is a 3 season trailer, so take it where the climate allows it to perform well for you. Don't punish yourself by trying to live in your Airstream during extensive periods of sub-freezing temps.
If you must spend a winter in a cold climate, winterize and store the Airstream, and buy or rent a home there.
Regarding that reflective paint, yeah it's a reflector of heat, not an insulator. It's only going to deliver a benefit when out in the blasting sun, where it can reflect those infrared rays back into the sky instead of allowing them to heat the skin of the trailer. It's the same principle as picking a white tow vehicle vs a black one, or a light-colored roof instead of a dark one. The more solar heat you can reflect before it heats your trailer the better.
__________________
Rocinante Piccolo is our new-to-us 2016 Interstate Lounge 3500 EXT
(Named for John Steinbeck's camper from "Travels With Charley")
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