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Old 09-20-2011, 06:25 AM   #61
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Rednax,
I would like to re-inerate what Gene said, when you compiled this list you did not take into account that oil change/service are done on gas every 3000 miles or 6 months, but on diesels they are done every 7500-10,000 miles which means you have 3 changes on gas to every 1 of a diesel and those figures are not reflected in your graph. Also the injectors do not need changed every 100,000 miles unless they are showing wear, they should however be checked at 100,000 miles and then the mechanic can tell when they need checked again such as next oil change or sooner. I have only 1 that I actually had to change the injectors at 110,000 and that was because it was a fleet maintainace vehicle and was used under seveir/heavy conditions, other than that most I have had lasted until just over the 200,000 mile range.

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Old 09-20-2011, 06:35 AM   #62
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Rednax,
I would like to re-inerate what Gene said, when you compiled this list you did not take into account that oil change/service are done on gas every 3000 miles or 6 months, but on diesels they are done every 7500-10,000 miles which means you have 3 changes on gas to every 1 of a diesel and those figures are not reflected in your graph. Also the injectors do not need changed every 100,000 miles unless they are showing wear, they should however be checked at 100,000 miles and then the mechanic can tell when they need checked again such as next oil change or sooner. I have only 1 that I actually had to change the injectors at 110,000 and that was because it was a fleet maintainace vehicle and was used under seveir/heavy conditions, other than that most I have had lasted until just over the 200,000 mile range.

Sarge
The last gas truck I had, an '07 GMC 5.3 Liter, GM recommended, and the in vehicle computer said to change the oil at 10,000 miles if you used synthetic oil. The same is true of the Duramax Diesel if you use synthetic oil.

So, same oil change interval, three times the cost. And then there's the fuel filters you have to buy and change on the Diesel truck that is not required on the gasoline truck.

Diesel trucks cost more to maintain than gasoline trucks.
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Old 09-20-2011, 06:57 AM   #63
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Understanding the various views on tow rigs, and it will still come down to a persons style some area's of the country like to Cad SUV, or range rover,or Lincoln. because a neighbor has one or it is a status symbol. I came across 2 guys couple years ago that had identical trailers 34 ft classic customs, being pulled with top of the line burb.s both black in color one was the pres of the wbcci state and other the treasurer. than there is another group that likes the look of their tow rig they purchase because it fits what they see themselves in , Than a group which many has posted here research for the best mpg, weight cap, reliability.
I like a group not many talk about, The Wow group, wow I cant afford that payment, wow I cant afford the repair. I have a friend who has a new Ford F350 he just spent $3,000 on a banks conversion hope to get a bit more power and mpg. His truck is 1 year new the banks is 2 months new. He had an issue last week bad fuel the truck was towed to a shop had to purge the system flush and replace glow plugs and a sensor total coast $1,300. I had a similar incident last year in New Mexico. I had it towed had the fuel dumped and restarted cost ,$125. that is a good example of why I have my older Truck and no payment I can save that money and use it to travel to all them places I have never been before and I look good going down the road I am not the fastest who wants to pull 80mph anyway 10mpg is just fine service on this old diesel I can do it all myself with out the shop fee's. this is my group and these days I would rather save a buck and still have the reliability and not worry about being stranded on the highway awaiting a wrecker.
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Old 09-20-2011, 09:48 AM   #64
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We tow a 30' Classic with a 2010 one ton RAM dually. ( we once owned a fiver, then saw the light!)

Have towed about 10,000 miles since we received "Brutus" the AS, in March. We can tow uphill at highway speeds ( rarely over 65mph for safety reasons) without missing a beat.

If I were to purchase a new truck, I would buy a one ton SRW. I endorse the extra cargo carrying capacity for all our extra "stuff" in the covered bed of the truck. Someone told me to always buy more truck than I thought we would need, because eventually I would need it!!!! That advice has come true.

Ps....last week we drove the "Going to the Sun Road" in Glacier NP with the dually. Lots of road construction. Narrow roads. The ranger said I "should be ok"??!! That was a "pucker factor" drive. Won't do that again. SRW=ok.
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Old 09-21-2011, 12:41 PM   #65
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I didn't say anything about frequency of oil changes (I think) as I may have been misquoted in post #61. Anyway, Toyota has been recommending 5,000 miles as when to change the oil. I would think that with the closer tolerances in modern engines, less carbon and contaminants get into the oil and that's why the increase from 3,000 or 3,500 to 5,000 miles.

I don't recall they said anything about synthetic oil, but I would think that though that oil lasts a long time, you get the same contaminants in real or synthetic oil.

Zigi, we drove part way up the Going to the Sun Road a couple of years ago. Since I was sure it was going to fall off the face of the mountain, I'm surprised it is still there. I have had no desire to return.

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Old 09-21-2011, 01:05 PM   #66
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I use Mobile1 in my Tundra and the dealer recommends oil changes every 7500 miles.
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Old 09-21-2011, 01:13 PM   #67
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In use Mobil 1 also and never asked the dealer.

Richard, how do you deal with the "maintenance" light that comes on at 5,000 miles? I guess it is a good idea to warn you, but I could live without it and the bells that go off when I open the driver's door when the key is in the ignition. I always forget how to turn off the light when I change the oil and have to look it up in the owner's manual, further annoying me.

One of the other perplexing things that come with our Tundra are two light switches that say "door" on them. They turn on or off various lights that come on (or don't) when the door(s) are opened. I'm sure the manual would tell me the difference, but why would I remember that?

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Old 09-21-2011, 01:22 PM   #68
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You can reset the light when it comes on.

Get the odometer on trip "A"
Turn off the ignition
Press and hold the trip button
Turn the key on (not start)- Keep holding button
Light will flash - keep holding button
Turn off key - release button
Start truck - no maintenance light
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Old 09-21-2011, 01:24 PM   #69
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There are 2 switches like you stated. One for the interior lights and one for the light in the cargo area. The alarm system I have requires that they both be activated by the door for some strange reason...

Since I added the cap, the cargo light is pretty useless.

We can compare notes next month in Albuquerque...
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Old 09-21-2011, 01:28 PM   #70
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True. Richard, I'm surprised you can remember that. I'm worried about you collecting too much trivia in your head.

A piece of black electrical tape on the dash when I light comes on that you don't want to look at is something I did on a car a long time ago. The light just liked being on. Like the gas gauge light, I just try to ignore it, but it stares at me.

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Old 09-21-2011, 01:43 PM   #71
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Gene,

Try putting the black tape on your glasses...works every time!

Bob
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Old 09-21-2011, 01:47 PM   #72
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Gene,

Try putting the black tape on your glasses...works every time!

Bob
Or the economy ski mask—the one without eye holes.

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Old 09-21-2011, 01:56 PM   #73
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Or the economy ski mask—the one without eye holes.

Gene

Gene,

Last resort, let Barb or Sandra drive....they wouldn't see it anyway.

Bob
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Old 09-21-2011, 05:01 PM   #74
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Hey Steve. I don't know where you buy your stuff but $40 for a fuel filter ????? I don't pay anywhere near that. I could probably get a case for that. I pay about $6 for a oil filter and probably about the same for the fuel filter. And I use only Baldwin's. Easy change for both too. I have a Dodge and it works well for me. Try doing an oil analysis and I bet you'll find you can extend your oil change interval a lot. That will offset the cost of using synthetics. Don't try and skimp on the fuel filter though. I always carry one with me so if I have a problem I can change it wherever I happen to be. Just in case I get a bad load of fuel. I have nothing against gassers at all but I do love my diesel for towing.
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Old 09-21-2011, 05:05 PM   #75
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Here's one of the places that sell the good fuel filters:
ACDelco TP3012 - ACDelco Fuel Filters - Overview - SummitRacing.com
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Old 12-27-2011, 03:22 AM   #76
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Gasoline = $3.47 per gallon
Diesel fuel= $3.69 per gallon
Diesel fuel addative need to lubricate the injector pump since the EPA mandated ultra low sulphur Diesel= $13.00 per gallon....not required with a gas truck
Diesel oil change=$56 if I do it myself
Gas oil change= $26 if I do it myself, and the miles between change is the same as I use sythetic in both.
Diesel fuel filter= $40...not required with a gas truck.
Diesel truck fuel mileage= 12 towing, 21 empty
Gas truck fuel mileage= 11 towing, 19 empty

Rednax, I sure wish you would tell us where you bought that Diesel calculator...I need one to make my Diesel less expensive.
I noticed on your list you do not have fuel filter on gas, they have fuel filters as well and need to be changed every oil change and possibly once more between as gas has a tendency to have more crud in it as well as a smaller filter and catches more.
The fuel additive cost on new diesels by far comes back in savings on fuel and emissions, so it really is not an added cost in the overall numbers. There is already a bypass kit out so you dont have to buy it if you dont want to.
Also you do not list that diesel lasts twice as long as gas engines do.
Granted your savings are up front on gas, and on the back end for diesel on some of it, but overall savings on an average ownership of 3-7 years will always be better on the diesel.
I am to understand that under the new emissions law that goes into effect in 2012 (thanks Obama) you will be required to have the DP stuff on the new engines, on older diesel by 2013, all engines by 2014.

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Old 12-27-2011, 04:06 AM   #77
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Did anyone read thru all that to see if Rednax even addressed the increased cost of oil changes, and fuel filters?
Steve many of us are still wondering where you get your prices from? Yes diesel oil change is a little more but you are also compairing 6 qts to 1 gallon not a fair compairison, as far as the fuel I have neve paid more than 1/4 of the price you claim. In fact I can only find on the highest cost filters less than 2.00 difference between gas & diesel filters, but again you are refering to a heavier filter for diesel.

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Old 12-27-2011, 04:17 AM   #78
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I was alittle curious also. My 7.3 fuel filter is $25.00 .I cant recall the oil filter,around $12 bucks I think and the air filter about the same. My my engine takes almost 4 Gallon of oil.My engine has 90 k miles its never had any fuel additives. I change oil and filters every 10k miles just like the big trucks out on the highway. I have seen them go a million miles before being torn down.
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Old 12-27-2011, 04:22 AM   #79
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[QUOTE=REDNAX;1046744]This is long, but it may help.

"Million-mile"? Granted that a B50 life -- MTBO, Mean Time Between Overhauls -- Ford or GM is 250k miles, while a Cummins is 360k. This isn't partisanship, but the way the engines were designed. The number of TSB's on Ford/GM diesel engines indicates (not suggests) that this is the case (beyond other references). It may be that a Dodge doesn't ride as well as a GM (acknowledged as best, perhaps) but that does not mean that one cannot go to the aftermarket to improve this. Again, with a lower overall cost, one can afford to make some changes. Without cpm penalty in comparison to other brands is the salient point.

Texas is indicated as being the "home" of diesel powered pickup trucks, that availability, spec, etc, are harder to find elsewhere. This is true. And South Texas is the state epicenter. One does not find GM trucks in commercial service nearly at all (only RV'ers), and Fords (due to their incredibly poor reliability record for nearly ten years) are not often used to "tow heavy". It is Dodge, again, and again, and again that is selected by individual and small fleer owners to tow heavy loads commercially: an 8k-lb empty 40' GN trailer with a 15k-lb load on it is common in oilfield hotshot. A 3-400k-mile truck at 3-5 years of age.

One has the opportunity to ask owners. Some are actually quite conversant with business numbers as regard a vehicle. Many are not. But trucks out-of-service due to unscheduled repairs & maintenance (a business killer) are quickly sold or traded. Dodge is the one to have. This may change as time goes on, but it has been reliable choice for many, many years now.
-------------------------------------------
Red; I agree with most of what you say right up to where you got on the Dodge band wagon and as usual the numbers are not in par with reality but opposite. Fact is and you can ask any true dodge person the last good truck dodge made was all the way back in the 80's and being a ford man I agree with them as the 89 Dodge Ram was the truck to beat even the military kept the 70's & early 80's ones around as long as they could. Dodge changed their trucks in the 90's and they have not been good since and all your dodge finantics will tell you that. As far as which truck is used more nowadays, drive by constuction companies its fords, look at what is being used on road maintaince Ford, Look at what is being driven by hotshot drivers majority Ford, Look at the stats Ford has had the best truck for 10 years as per JD Powers, truck mags.
But this is a debate that will never end and could be argued until the end of time or vehicles which ever comes first.

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Old 12-27-2011, 06:15 AM   #80
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Eagles & Hummingbirds....

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