wiper arm length?

[Astrodokk]

I just replaced my wiper blades with new center pin hole blades (not just the inserts, but the whole blade assembly) from O'Reilly's (Kragen's).
They are held on by a very small diameter bolt and nyloc nut.
The old set are 20", so that's what I replaced with.
However, when being used, the driver side seems to be too long and actually hits the center windshield frame, and also goes a tad too far left past the curvature of the windshield for my liking.
I'm thinking about buying 19" or even 18" to avoid what's happening, but I think the wiper blades are supposed to be 20" as I've read here.
My question is, then, what is the length of the wiper arm? Mine may be a replacement that is too long for the wiper blades. It is a Travco brand arm. Any suggestions?

[PeterH-350LE]

Originally Posted by Astrodokk

.......
My question is, then, what is the length of the wiper arm? Mine may be a replacement that is too long for the wiper blades. It is a Travco brand arm. Any suggestions?

My wiper arms are 28" and I am using 20" blades. Your linkage maybe worn and it has a lot of play. The arms are real heavy duty, I doubt that anyone would ever replace them .

[Astrodokk]

Where would that linkage be located, under the cowl? I wouldn't know what it looks like. I guess I'll have to live with it or buy shorter blades next time to compensate.

[bkahler]

If I'm not mistaken the linkage is adjustable in that you can change the overall travel distance. I'm not home right now so I can't look at the wiper mechanism I have sitting on the bench. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable will chime in.

Brad

[Astrodokk]

Having the ability to adjust travel is good if I can figure it out. It makes sense to have designed it that way. I'll see if I can research more too.
Thanks.

[Smartstream]

The linkage is located under the cowling above the radiator. Open the access door and look up. You almost have to stick your head in the access to see it.

In reality the system is not adjustable. Using the pivot shafts http://www.amequipment.com/wp-conten...9/801-1037.pdf there are three positions that you can mount the pin that will change the sweep angle. This is a radical change that will not fix your problem. You can also change the length of the drive arm http://www.amequipment.com/wp-conten...9/801-1089.pdf this will also change the sweep travel. This can help but really what you are looking at is a lot of wear in a poor system. The link arms have a nylon bushing at the wear points while all the new systems use bronze bushings. The drivers side pivot shaft is located on the curve of the cowling so that linkage from the drive arm to the pivot shaft is not perpendicular to the pins driving it and the whole set up binds and has to flex on every sweep of the wiper. The old nylon bushings allowed for a little flex but the newer bronze bushings are much more rigid.

I built a new link using a ball joint linkage to accommodate the misalignment. You can read about it here http://www.airforums.com/forums/f311...y-75428-5.html in post #69. The fourth picture shows how severe the misalignment is between the pivot shaft arm and the link. The ball joint allowed me to tighten up the linkage and fine tune the position of the sweep.

Good luck, Dan

[bkahler]

Dan, I was poking around in the "What did you get for your Motorhome today?" thread on page 3 post 73 and noticed that your wiper arrangement is different than my 74 Argosy, our 84 310 and the 86 345. Our three vehicles had separate motors for each wiper arm. It appears your's has one motor with linkage between the two wiper arms.

Is this correct?

Brad

[Smartstream]

Originally Posted by bkahler

Dan, I was poking around in the "What did you get for your Motorhome today?" thread on page 3 post 73 and noticed that your wiper arrangement is different than my 74 Argosy, our 84 310 and the 86 345. Our three vehicles had separate motors for each wiper arm. It appears your's has one motor with linkage between the two wiper arms.

Is this correct?

Brad

Not quite Brad. The passenger side uses a 230 system like this, 230 Series Replacement Parts : AM Equipment
The motor/gearbox, link, and pivot are all mounted on a U-shaped bracket. The drivers side uses the the same motor/gearbox, and U-shaped bracket, they are a right hand and left hand set up. The difference is the pivot is moved to the left front corner and a 30" link is used to operate the wiper. It's the long link and pivot mounted around the front radius of the coach that was the problem. Had they mounted the drivers side pivot on the bracket in the center of the coach it would be so simple.

They also used a separate control switch on the dash for each wiper. I used this switch AM Equipment : Delay switch, for two coast to park motors, 12V [311-1026] - $87.36 to combine both wipers to a single switch with intermittent function.

I hope this helps.

Cheers, Dan

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by Smartstream

Not quite Brad. The passenger side uses a 230 system like this, 230 Series Replacement Parts : AM Equipment
The motor/gearbox, link, and pivot are all mounted on a U-shaped bracket. The drivers side uses the the same motor/gearbox, and U-shaped bracket, they are a right hand and left hand set up.

The Argosy is set up similar except it appears they are both the same hand. Both motor gearboxes are to the left when looking from the front of the motorhome. The pivots are both on the right side of the frame.

The difference is the pivot is moved to the left front corner and a 30" link is used to operate the wiper. It's the long link and pivot mounted around the front radius of the coach that was the problem. Had they mounted the drivers side pivot on the bracket in the center of the coach it would be so simple.

The 310 and 345 do not use the 30" long link. The motors are independent from each other.

I don't know if the Argosy used the 30" link or not because the linkages on both wiper assemblies are in shambles. No clips and the links were just hanging loose.

I measured the 310 and the wiper spacing is about 38-1/2". The Argosy is 40-1/4" spacing. I never noticed that before

So, I wonder if the Argosy is supposed to be setup like yours? Would you happen to have pictures showing how yours are connected?

I'm also confused as to why there are two motors on yours when they are tied together with a link. Seems like they would fight each other. Obviously I'm missing something

They also used a separate control switch on the dash for each wiper. I used this switch AM Equipment : Delay switch, for two coast to park motors, 12V [311-1026] - $87.36 to combine both wipers to a single switch with intermittent function.

All three of my motorhomes only had one wiper switch.

Brad

[Robfike]

Our '86 345 has a single wiper switch.
Two separate motors not connected to one another.

[Smartstream]

We seem to be having some terminology issues. What I'm calling the pivot is this Pivot Shaft Assemblies : AM Equipment Your 310 shows the pivot shafts at the lower left corner of each windshield glass. This is the same as mine. I believe your Argosy is the same but I can't tell for sure from the picture.

Anyway my passenger side wiper uses the 230 series drive with the motor/gearbox, link, and pivot shaft all mounted on the U shaped bracket. My drivers side has the same motor/gearbox mounted on a separate U shaped bracket right next to the passenger side set up near the center of the windshield. The difference is the drivers side pivot shaft is all the way to the left corner of the coach connected to motor/gearbox by a drive link that is approx. 30" long. There are two separate motor/gearboxes, links and pivots that operate totally independent of each other and are controlled independently by two switches.

The geometry of the drivers side is poor because the pivot shaft is not parallel to the gearbox shaft. Every sweep of the wiper will bind the bushings in the link that ride on these two shafts. If you have a single motor/gearbox driving both wipers you will have a bind on the left pivot shaft/link bushing. If you have two motor/gearboxes with the drivers side being mounted at the left corner on a single motor/gearbox, link, pivot shaft, U shape bracket it would eliminate to misalignment.

I hope this clears up how my wipers are set up. Apparently Airstream used some different drive setups and switches but the pivot shaft/wiper arm mounting appears to be the same at the lower left corner of each windshield half. If your setup is different I would be interested in what they did.

Cheers, Dan

[bkahler]

Ok, to put it in my own words. Your passenger side wiper motor assembly is mounted just like all the other models including my 74 Argosy.

However your drivers side motor/gearbox assembly sits close to the passenger side motor/gearbox and uses a long 30" link to connect to the pivot assembly that is mounted in the same location as my Argosy. The reference distance for your pivot would be about 40-1/4" from the center lines of each pivot assembly.

If this is correct then your arrangement is definitely different that the 310 and 345 which have separate motor/gearbox/pivot assemblies located 38-1/2" apart.

Yours is also different than my Argosy which has the drivers side motor/gearbox/pivot assembly mounted as one unit and is located at the far right of the engine compartment.

Here is how the 310 drivers assembly is mounted.



And here are some pictures of the Argosy drivers side mounting.



As near as I can tell the only difference between the Argosy and the 310 is Airstream moved the 310 drivers side motor & pivot assembly about 1-3/4" towards the center.

I haven't tried to take the drivers side motor assembly out of the Argosy yet, will have to do that tomorrow if it doesn't rain. I have a hunch it's going to be a bear to get the back side nut off. From what I could feel when reaching up on top of the mounting flange it feels like they used studs instead of bolts. If that's the case at least I won't have to try and get a wrench up on top.

Hope this all makes sense!

Brad

[bkahler]

I was browsing the 74 Argosy motorhome owners manual and ran across the following description of the wiper controls.

Per the manual:

The windshield wiper and washer controls are located to the left of the steering column on the instrument panel.

Electric: Each wiper blade is controlled by a separate switch. Both controls are two speed. To activate windshield washer press knob marked wiper-washer.

Hydraulic: Both blades are controlled by a single switch. This switch has a variable speed control. To activate windshield washer, depress rocker switch marked "washer".

Now, my controls don't match this description at all. I have the typical wiper washer arrangement that you would see in a typical mid 70s Chevy pickup and both of my wipers are electric.

Next weekend I'm going to have to dig into the wiring and see just what I have.

Brad

[Smartstream]

Originally Posted by bkahler

Ok, to put it in my own words. Your passenger side wiper motor assembly is mounted just like all the other models including my 74 Argosy.

However your drivers side motor/gearbox assembly sits close to the passenger side motor/gearbox and uses a long 30" link to connect to the pivot assembly that is mounted in the same location as my Argosy. The reference distance for your pivot would be about 40-1/4" from the center lines of each pivot assembly.

If this is correct then your arrangement is definitely different that the 310 and 345 which have separate motor/gearbox/pivot assemblies located 38-1/2" apart.

Yours is also different than my Argosy which has the drivers side motor/gearbox/pivot assembly mounted as one unit and is located at the far right of the engine compartment.

Here is how the 310 drivers assembly is mounted.

Attachment 174634

And here are some pictures of the Argosy drivers side mounting.

Attachment 174633Attachment 174635Attachment 174636

As near as I can tell the only difference between the Argosy and the 310 is Airstream moved the 310 drivers side motor & pivot assembly about 1-3/4" to wards the center.

I haven't tried to take the drivers side motor assembly out of the Argosy yet, will have to do that tomorrow if it doesn't rain. I have a hunch it's going to be a bear to get the back side nut off. From what I could feel when reaching up on top of the mounting flange it feels like they used studs instead of bolts. If that's the case at least I won't have to try and get a wrench up on top.

Hope this all makes sense!

Brad

I've been busy putting up some firewood for a couple of days but finally got a chance to take some pictures. I have to say this is one of those times I stand there scratching my head wondering what the hell were they thinking?


What you have is the way it should be. The wiper drives self-contained and mounted right where they should be. Here are some pics of mine.

Here you can see the two motor/gearbox drives side by side. The one on the left is the passenger side with the short link connected to the pivot shaft. The picture is taken looking up. The one on the right uses the long link to connect to the pivot shaft.



This is the link connecting to the pivot shaft. You can see the misalignment due to the way the pivot shaft is mounted.



This is Tin Crumpet's 280 that is stored at my place. It is also a 1982 and you can see the two motor/gearbox drives are mounted together in the center of the coach.



Here is the end of the link at the drivers side pivot shaft. Airstream did bend the link in an attempt to accommodate the misalignment but as the pivot shaft swings through it's arc the alignment angle constantly changes.



It's amazing that Airstream had it right on the early coaches, changed to the Mickey Mouse set up and then went back to the correct set up. Reading your next post they also apparently could not decide how many switches were needed to operate the wipers.

I guess if it wasn't for this kind stuff we wouldn't have much to talk about here.

Cheers, Dan

[bkahler]

Dan, thanks for the pictures. As they say a picture is worth a thousand words

The version you ended up with definitely appears to be the poorest design of the three designs that we know of.

As a followup to my post about the wiper switches in my Argosy I've uploaded a picture of the left side of my dash (no it's not pretty!) and the page from the owners manual describing the dash layout. As you can see the switches are nowhere close to being the same.



The one thing I'm still wondering about is why Airstream moved the later drivers side wiper motors 1-3/4" towards the center as compared to the Argosies. Was it ease of maintenance? I doubt it. More than likely there were issues with the arm being mounted so far around the curve of the glass.

It seems to me they would have been better off mounting both of them in the center and have the wipers sweep in opposite directions. Just a thought.

Thanks!

Brad

[Smartstream]

Yeah Airstream did a lot of unusual stuff. One reason I can think of for the change of location for the drivers wiper is the longer connecting links are not available in a lot of different lengths. I suspect they had to move it to be able to use an off the self link. Yes the center mount for both wipers would have been so simple and could have been done with one motor instead of two. I'm still scratching my head.

By the way if your wipers do not have an intermittent function, that switch is available and a great function to have.

Cheers, Dan

[bkahler]

Originally Posted by Smartstream

...By the way if your wipers do not have an intermittent function, that switch is available and a great function to have.

Cheers, Dan

According to the knob on the dash it looks like it has an intermittent function. However since I've never had a battery in the coach to test things I don't know. But then again the wiper actuating assemblies are all busted up so the most I would see is the motor gearbox shaft turning

One of these days I'm going to have to isolate all of the loose wires and then hook up a battery. Gotta happen one of these days so maybe over the Christmas holidays

Brad

[bkahler]

Well, I stand corrected on the number of wiper switches in my Argosy. I took a few minutes to look closer at the wiper and washer switches on the dash and realized that I really do have two separate wiper on/off switches. One switch is a two position (low speed, high speed) and the other switch is also a two position (low speed, high speed) but can be pushed in to activate the washer pump.

The knobs don't look anything alike. To top it off under the left switch it says Wiper and under the right switch it says Washer

I don't believe the Argosy wiper motors are the coast to park style but I'm not certain of that. When comparing the Argosy wiper motor to the 345 wiper motor the wiring is somewhat different. See attached pictures.



My plan is to scrap the two Argosy wiper motors and install the 345 units. I also will use the same wiper control switch that Dan used. I am a little bummed about the wiper switch. The price went up $13 from the time Dan posted the link to when I checked it again today

Brad

[Smartstream]

Brad I believe those are both coast to park motors, the dynamic park uses 4 wires. Check this page http://www.amequipment.com/wp-conten...9/801-1056.pdf In the lower right hand corner is the coast to park.

If your motors run, don't scrap them, carry in your spare parts box. Trying to find one of those from the local NAPA while you are standing in the rain isn't likely to have a happy ending. Ask me how I know. That event was the beginning of my entry into the world of wiper systems.

There is a world of information on the AM Equipment site but you really have to search for it. If you can weed your way through it they have a pretty good explanation of the terminology and how these systems work. Butch on the sales desk is an encyclopedia but the guy is really busy.

Cheers, Dan

[bkahler]

Well I bit the bullet and ordered a replacement pivot assembly and the dual wiper delay switch. The website prices kept going up so if figured I better order before the got out of my price range.

Dan, thanks for posting the AM Equipment links, they do have a lot of good information there.

Brad