Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-05-2018, 11:06 AM   #29
Rivet Master
 
Magnet18's Avatar
 
Churubusco , Indiana
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 887
I thought 3wd67rg's picture showed the profile pretty well

I remember davejay saying he used big zipties somehow, but he never posted pictures and I never really understood what he meant
__________________

__________________
1983 Airstream 310 Class A Motorhome
-Rob
Magnet18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 11:25 AM   #30
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnet18 View Post
I thought 3wd67rg's picture showed the profile pretty well

I remember davejay saying he used big zipties somehow, but he never posted pictures and I never really understood what he meant
Here's some sketches of the profiles with dimensions. I got bored last night and got my dial calipers out and started measuring.

Click image for larger version

Name:	window-extrusion-1.jpg
Views:	28
Size:	215.3 KB
ID:	329186Click image for larger version

Name:	window-extrusion-2.jpg
Views:	25
Size:	201.5 KB
ID:	329187

I'm going to add a few more pictures or sketches tonight or tomorrow. I didn't feel like wandering down to my shop last night to finish up

I found a profile of a window track online that has possibilities but it's definitely not an exact match.

What needs to be determined is why Airstream created the profile that they did.

Brad
__________________

__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 11:59 AM   #31
Keen amature
 
martin300662's Avatar

 
1975 20' Argosy 20
Chestfield , Kent
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 2,596
Could you use regular twin channel tracks but cut back the second and third arms?

martin300662 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 12:10 PM   #32
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by martin300662 View Post
Could you use regular twin channel tracks but cut back the second and third arms?

That is similar to what I've been finding but depending on why the current extrusion is shaped like it is it may not work. The windows actually ride on the vertical uprights and not down inside the channel.

Tonight I'm going to set the window and screen in place and try to get some decent pictures of what the plastic strip is actually trying to do.

Bottom line is I'm doubtful that the extrusion you pictured or the one I found will actually work.

Click image for larger version

Name:	900638_l.jpg
Views:	25
Size:	32.4 KB
ID:	329189

Just to add to the discussion my guess is what Dave did was to use some of the really large tie wraps (i.e. 3/8" wide) and laid them on top of each other to the point they were high enough for the screen and window to slide on top of. If that actually works then maybe the easiest solution is to get a strip of delrin that is wide enough to fit inside the channel and just tall enough to match the tip of the V provided by the plastic extrusion. More later this evening.


Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 12:26 PM   #33
Keen amature
 
martin300662's Avatar

 
1975 20' Argosy 20
Chestfield , Kent
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 2,596
I am guessing the raised center not only gives the correct ride height but also a 'spring' rather than fixed base. If so a strip of plastic slightly wider than the bottom of the channel, with a crease down the center would work. Could also be a strip of fluoroplastic (Teflon) so it is slippery.
martin300662 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 12:45 PM   #34
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by martin300662 View Post
I am guessing the raised center not only gives the correct ride height but also a 'spring' rather than fixed base. If so a strip of plastic slightly wider than the bottom of the channel, with a crease down the center would work. Could also be a strip of fluoroplastic (Teflon) so it is slippery.
That's pretty much what I've been thinking. Unless it has to be springy for a reason, I don't see why Teflon wouldn't work. I might even be able to come up with a strip of Teflon or Delrin to try, although that won't happen tonight
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 05:53 PM   #35
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
The devil's in the details.

After looking closer at the window and screen sitting in the track it appears the window and the screen actually ride in the bottom of the V grooves. I've attached a sketch of what might work as an alternative.

Click image for larger version

Name:	20181205_185118.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	181.2 KB
ID:	329197Click image for larger version

Name:	20181205_185110a.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	128.2 KB
ID:	329201Click image for larger version

Name:	window-extrusion-3a.jpg
Views:	35
Size:	170.8 KB
ID:	329200

I think what Airstream was trying to do was to create a little bit of spring in the extrusions to allow for flex of the vehicle and window frames. I'm not sure if my idea in the sketch would work but it's the first thing I'd probably try.

Maybe Tony or Mike would have an idea on how to use a table saw to fabricate these from strips of nylon or delrin. The strip would start out being 1/2" square and then trimmed accordingly.

Hope his helps

Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2018, 08:36 PM   #36
Dazed and Confused
 
Isuzusweet's Avatar

 
Currently Looking...
1983 31' Airstream310
Hillsburgh , Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,443
Next year, once I get this Cancer monkey off my back, I plan on tackling my windows. I have everything I need to to this project. So once I take this apart I will have a better idea on what is needed to fabricate these inserts.

I have worked with UHMW stuff before, but would have to find some UV resistant stuff to make them out of. Ultra high molecular polymer plastic is the way to go; super inert, super slick and almost unwearable. I might even be able to get it CNC'd, but let me get one out first and see.

https://www.quadrantplastics.com/na-...-uv-resistant/

Actually it would be esier to have a shaper bit made up to fit the inside profile, run the UHMW sheet through the shaper then cut the molding on the saw.

Cheers
Sidekick Tony
__________________
Per Mare, Per Terram and may all your campaigns be successful.

ďItís a recession when your neighbor loses his job; itís a depression when you lose your own.Ē "Harry S Truman"
Isuzusweet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2019, 08:29 PM   #37
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
I got to brain storming (yeah I know, dangerous!) this evening and decided to take a crack at 3D printing the elusive window tracks for the Classic windows. There are some things the 3D printer can do pretty well, making long extrusions is NOT one of them. My printer has a max printed length of about 8". The window tracks are approximately 23.9375" long so in order to make something that would work it's going to have to be done in 3 sections that are 7.98" long. The sections would have to be screwed into place which means roughly four more screws per track.

Back in post #30 I had created a profile sketch of the window track I have on hand. So this evening I spent some time with Infusion 360 and came up with a rough drawing of what the original extrusion looked like in profile. Due to the nature of 3D printing there are a couple of areas that would be difficult to print without supports (supports are areas where the 3D printer adds material for something that will overhang and is later removed from the object). One is the upper lip that hangs down and the second is the V at the bottom. The bottom V might be printable without supports but the lip would need supports included. So the first attempt is with a flat bottom and no lip.

The first print looked good but after I applied some strong side pressure I was able to break the tall side wall where it joined at the bottom. So for my next iteration I tried to make the profile match the original profile as much as possible. That one turned out better but I was still able to break the side wall. My final attempt increased the side wall thickness by .020" and that seems to have worked.

Click image for larger version

Name:	20190123_221908.jpg
Views:	22
Size:	67.2 KB
ID:	332278Click image for larger version

Name:	20190123_221714.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	133.3 KB
ID:	332279Click image for larger version

Name:	20190123_221454.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	154.2 KB
ID:	332280Click image for larger version

Name:	20190123_221706.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	106.6 KB
ID:	332281

It appears I have the V at the bottom swapped from side to side so tomorrow I'll correct that tomorrow. With luck I'll be able to do a test fit in a spare window I have sitting in the shop in the next day or so.

If this works then maybe the long wait for a suitable replacement will be over

Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2019, 09:09 PM   #38
4 Rivet Member
 
shepherd57's Avatar
 
1985 32.5' Airstream 325
Lindsay , Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 450
Images: 5
I should be in KY around the end of Feb for a trail fit
shepherd57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2019, 03:37 AM   #39
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by shepherd57 View Post
I should be in KY around the end of Feb for a trail fit
Hopefully I'll have the design tweaked enough by then to where it actually works
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2019, 05:16 AM   #40
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
I probably should mention, this is not a fast process. A single 8" strip takes roughly 45 minutes to an hour to print. I can probably put up to eight of them on the bed at the same time however the print time would increase to approximately six to seven hours or so.

One other thing. It should be possible to glue the three pieces together to form one long strip. Supposedly Cyanoacrylate glue works for bonding PETG pieces together.

Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2019, 07:28 AM   #41
Rivet Master
 
Magnet18's Avatar
 
Churubusco , Indiana
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 887
Brad, awesome work!!

My first thought for strength would be to print it on-end on the z axis, to save trying to muck with supports, but I'm not sure what will be strongest

Also, this is ths perfect use of a printerbelt!
https://youtu.be/k-pmSmDDwY4
I'm wondering how hard it is to do a diy upgrade of my old printerbot... I've seen a couple of people do it :hmm:


Are you willing to send the files, or zip and upload here? I don't plan to pull a window out until it warms up, but since the pieces are small I might try some in-situ surgery
__________________
1983 Airstream 310 Class A Motorhome
-Rob
Magnet18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2019, 08:09 AM   #42
Rivet Master
 
bkahler's Avatar

 
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond , Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnet18 View Post
Brad, awesome work!!

My first thought for strength would be to print it on-end on the z axis, to save trying to muck with supports, but I'm not sure what will be strongest
I thought about printing on the Z axis as well but strength and warping worried me. It would be easy enough to try and I might try one this weekend just to find out.

I'm not convinced the little vertical lip at the top is necessary. Until someone can explain to me why it's needed I'm going to leave it out. Not having the lip at the top eliminates the need for supports of any kind. I'm thinking having slightly thicker side walls would help eliminate the need for the lip.

I've been looking at the profile of the original extrusion trying to discern why the shape is the way it is. There are some pretty funky grooves that don't make sense at the moment. The first thing I'm going to do is eliminate the V on the bottom and make it flat.

Quote:
Also, this is ths perfect use of a printerbelt!
https://youtu.be/k-pmSmDDwY4
I'm wondering how hard it is to do a diy upgrade of my old printerbot... I've seen a couple of people do it :hmm:
The printer belt is really cool! Do you know if there are printer belt businesses out there that will take a g-code file or an slt file and print them? The printer belt would allow for full length extrusions without resorting to gluing the pieces together.

Quote:
Are you willing to send the files, or zip and upload here? I don't plan to pull a window out until it warms up, but since the pieces are small I might try some in-situ surgery
My plan is once I have a suitable profile developed and I've made a couple of strips to put in my test window I will post the g-code files and the slt files here on Airforums and probably Thingiverse as well. More than likely I'll post the Fusion 360 files as well.

I hope these printed extrusions work, that would solve one of the many lingering problems Classic owners have

Brad
__________________

__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels, brake drums, windows & holding tanks left to sell)
bkahler is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Screen window insert for rear/sink window? MaineStreamer 2007 Safari 0 08-02-2015 11:09 AM
Front Passenger Slider Window Handle JudgesArgosy Argosy Motorhomes 15 01-14-2013 08:28 AM
I3500 Slider Door Window Leak RoadJager Sprinter and B-van Forum 9 09-26-2012 06:42 AM
Side window insert mouth012006 Upholstery, Blinds, Walls & Interior Finishes 0 04-06-2010 07:34 PM
Drivers slider window. Inland RV Center, In Commercial Listings 0 10-18-2005 04:09 PM


Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.