catalytic converters wanted

[Keyair]

Surprise:
FYI.
Note that from the book, there is a #1 notation next to the ignition timing spec...
That means that the Vacuum advance should be disconnected and the line plugged for the timing setting/check.

My link to Using Gas analyzer reading does work.... its just slow or redirects...
Using Gas Analyzer Readings

Here is what it says about High Co readings...

1) High Carbon Monoxide (CO) readings usually indicate a fuel mixture richer than ideal (rich mixture - air fuel ratio below 14.7). In general CO is an indicator of combustion efficiency. The amount of CO in a vehicle’s exhaust is directly related to its air-fuel ratio. High CO levels result from inadequate O2 supply needed for complete combustion. This is caused by a too rich mixture - too much fuel or not enough air (AFR readings below the optimal 14.7, Lambda below 1.0). Circumstances that can lead to high CO emissions:

* Low idle speed
* Improper float settings in carbureted vehicles
* Dirty or restricted air filters
*Excessively dirty or contaminated oil
*Saturated charcoal canister
*Non-functioning PCV valve system
*Improper operation of the fuel delivery system
*Improperly functioning thermactor system

[dadstoy]

Originally Posted by Keyair

Surprise:
FYI.
Note that from the book, there is a #1 notation next to the ignition timing spec...
That means that the Vacuum advance should be disconnected and the line plugged for the timing setting/check.

That's true, but don't disconnect it for the smog test, which I was assuming Surprise was referring to.

[Keyair]

Originally Posted by dadstoy

That's true, but don't disconnect it for the smog test, which I was assuming Surprise was referring to.

I got ya Dean, I also read his other thread about setting the timing but wanted to point it out here and reference the "Smog Bible".

[perryg114]

Check to see if the vacuum diaphram on the distributor is even working. Many times they get a hole in them and won't work. This could mean your timing advance is retarded too much causing high CO numbers under load. The easy way to tell if the diaphram is working is to hook it to a hand operated vacuum pump. If it is working the engine RPM will change when you pull a vacuum. If it does not change, then the diaphram is bad. I would do a compression check on all cylinders. They should be above 100 psi and no more than about 20psi difference between any two. If you have over 140psi then you probably have a carboned up engine or one that has a higher compression ratio than a stock engine. Start with the basics. You may not have malfunctioning emmissions control systems but an out of tune engine.

Perry

[Surprise]

Ok, getting some great advice from you guys, lets see if I can answer some technical questions for ya. It looks from the pics mine is a federal model. No vacuum canister, no egr. Compression is good, no leaks anywhere, vacuum or exhaust gasket. Carb is rebuilt correctly (new acclerator pump, properly set float, etc). Oil is clean, as is the air filter, pcv valve too! I'm thinking dadstoy is correct with the smog pump system being the culprit! I'll remove it piece by piece and inspect it next.

[Surprise]

[Surprise]

Sorry for duplicate pics. My smart phone is too smart for me!

[Surprise]

On a side note, my wife is complaining that I spend to much time on these forums when she's trying to talk to me. How do you fix that? Haha!

[vswingfield]

Originally Posted by Surprise

On a side note, my wife is complaining that I spend to much time on these forums when she's trying to talk to me. How do you fix that? Haha!

Send her a PM telling her to PM you.

[Keyair]

Originally Posted by Surprise

On a side note, my wife is complaining that I spend to much time on these forums when she's trying to talk to me. How do you fix that? Haha!

Improve your tuning-out skills... Fit her with a muffler... LOL, just kidding... thats what you do with an Ex-wife... or a soon to be...

Just explain that without all this knowledge she will need to help push it if it breaks down...

[Keyair]

I am interested to know if as far as you know your Quadrajet is the Original?

Some trivia...
I compared your carb number of 17080212 0964 CWP with the one I have.
I got mine on Ebay, and it is .....17080212 3044 CWP.



These numbers break down into this...
17080 = Carb built in the 1980's
Last 3 digits..
2= Federal 4 barrel carb
1= For Chevy
2= For an Automatic transmission

As you can see it is exactly the same carb number, the only difference is the 4 digit number in the middle which turns out to be the production date... Yours is 096th day of 1984(April 6th 1984)... and mine is 304th day of 1984.

I rebuilt my carb myself and have not fitted it yet....

[perryg114]

Why is Arizona concerned with emmissions anyway. They population density is pretty low.

Perry

[azflycaster]

The Phoenix Metro Area has a population of 4.1 million people and sits in a valley. Air quality is a very big issue here.

[Surprise]

It's most likely the original carb. I bought from my wifes grandparents and they were original owners. They saved every receipt since new.
The Phoenix area pollution is pretty bad! The city sits in a bowl type area with mountains trapping air movement. We are the 5th or 6th largest city in America if you count metropolitan area! We're also about 20 years behind in public transportation for such a large city.

[Surprise]

I rebuilt mine myself as well but yours looks spectacular, Keyair!

[Keyair]

Originally Posted by Surprise

I rebuilt mine myself as well but yours looks spectacular, Keyair!

Thanks, but the proof of the "spectacularness" will be how it runs....
This was my first Quad rebuild... SU's are easier!
I thought black would look cool on my planned Edelbrock manifold swap.


Here it is all together with the refinished Banks Airfilter..


FYI, a common issue with these is leaks...
These later models generally do not leak from the welch plugs in the bottom of the carb, but it is possible..
Here are mine...


Mine needed throttle plate bushings too.




I just found and read an article where it points out that the top plate is a common warpage place leading to air leaks..
The most common reason for the top plate warpage, is overtightening of the air filter center bolt, or the airfilter leveraging the carb thru the mounting bolt...
Now, the is no bigger of heavier airfilter system than the cast aluminum Banks top...
Add to that the posibility of contact between the filter and doghouse, and we could have double trouble... On my M/H there is/was a very clear imprint on the doghouse insulation from the filter... and my setup is taller than stock, so will have to be careful.



All of this can lead to odd running.

[Surprise]

yes, I've had to rebuild several carbs that were leaking from the Welch plugs. I use JB Weld to seal them up

[Keyair]

Any updates on your issue?

[perryg114]

FYI smaller is not better with air cleaners. If the element is smaller it means either less air or more dirt or both. A small restriction on the intake make HUGE reductions of HP and air into the engine.

Also bringing in fresh air that has not gone through the radiator will increase HP as well. Sometimes all those ugly hoses leading to the big ugly stock air cleaner HAVE A PURPOSE.

Perry

[Phoenix]

We used to have a 1978 Chevy crewcab pickup ("Hal") that had a 454-V8 in it. If you haven't already fixed this problem, I suggest that you take your vehicle to "Phoenix Carburetor and Radiator Exchange" at 9120 N. 7th Street in Phoenix. They rebuilt Hal's carburetor several times in the 20-some years we owned him, and he always passed emissions.

If necessary, they'll tune the carb to pass emissions and then retune it after it passes all tests.

Also, they recommend rebuilding the existing carburetor instead of replacing with a rebuilt model from AutoZone, Pep Boys, etc.. This engine has been around for a long time; and there are a lot of carbs that look similar, but differ slightly, which makes them extremely difficult to tune to your engine.

Years and years ago, I had wasted a lot of time fiddling with carb problems, until someone steered me to them. And, it was easier (and cheaper) to just have them do the work; especially, since they guaranteed Hal would pass emissions.

Just a warning, this is a Phoenix landmark that dates back at least to 1980 (and probably back to the 50's). You won't find a spotlessly clean shop with an espresso machine in the waiting room. It's a small shop that all of the old timers know about, whose walls are lined with old carburetors and parts in cardboard boxes. I think the counter people are the owners, and everyone is covered in grease up to their elbows. However, this shop is fast, dependable, and busy.

==========

Note: You do NOT need catalytic converters. This is probably an idle adjustment, since Hal only got idle tests when we had him emissions tested.