Anyone done an LPG conversion?

[Boom Sounds]

Hi guys,

We're going to buy a 270 or 280 and import it to the UK. However, I want to do a LPG conversion in the States before I ship it to England (petrol is 8 bucks a gallon over here!). Has anyone done this upgrade or know anyone else who has? Any information greatly recieved e.g. did it work OK, how much did it cost, MPG, where did they put the tanks, tank size, were any other mods required etc etc?

Hope you can help

thanks

Nick

[vswingfield]

You might consider a diesel. There is a 280 in the classifieds right now at:

http://www.airforums.com/classifieds...ct=3587&cat=12

Vaughan

[Boom Sounds]

Hi all,

OK - so no response!

Anyone know anyone who has done an LPG conversion?
Alternatively, can anyone suggest a good chassis mechanics on the West Coast who I could try for a quote?

thanks

Nick

[bhayden]

LPG conversions haven't been very popular over here. For a while there was a Federally funded fuel credit that brought down the cost of propane. I don't think that's in effect any more so given the drop in milage and the cost of propane it doesn't save any money, you have a drop in power and it's much harder find fuel. In fact, other than fleet vehicles virtually every propane job I've seen was set up to use gasoline or propane (dual fuel). The local school district had all there busses set-up to run propane but switched them back to gas. Sorry, not much help. I really think you'd be better off going with the diesel.

[bobkelly]

Nick---Be sure to check with the AS factory and the major AS dealers who are active on this site. Never know where a lead might come from.

Also, try C& G Trailer Service, in Bellflower, Calif. a suburb of Los Angeles. They have been in the AS business for 40 plus years and may be able to help. They return from annual vacation on Aug 14. 800-662-3790

[Boom Sounds]

Hi guys - thanks for the info. I should have made myself a bit clearer. I intend to do the dual fuel modification i.e. gas and LPG.

I've tried Jackson Centre who didn't have any leads. I'll check out C&G. Anyone any other ideas?

Do we think it is do-abale?
Any idea on size of tanks?
Cost of the conversion?

thanks

Nick

[vswingfield]

Originally Posted by Boom Sounds

Hi guys - thanks for the info. I should have made myself a bit clearer. I intend to do the dual fuel modification i.e. gas and LPG.

I've tried Jackson Centre who didn't have any leads. I'll check out C&G. Anyone any other ideas?

Do we think it is do-abale?
Any idea on size of tanks?
Cost of the conversion?

thanks

Nick

Hi Nick,

Check out IMPCO at:

IMPCO Technologies

They are the leading producer of gas to gas carburetors. Be aware that you will need to run on gasoline regularly to prevent the carburetor seals and pumps from drying out. Once that happens, it will barely run on gasoline at all. Voice of experience.

Vaughan

Vaughan

[Chuckles]

Nick, I am in the process of trying to size up some tanks to make it worthwhile. On the 310 space under is very limited if you go for about 200 ltrs/45-50 gallons. Any thing less does stretch the viability. At the present is means moving the air receiver and fitting one between the chassis rails and two in the rear corners. I am waiting for a price for the tanks with valves and connections etc.

I have the under-belly slide out storage midships so that a no-no.

Chuck

PS does anyone have the part numbers of the firestone rear air bags?

[Normin storm]

did you get your airstream converted to L.P.G

[Chuckles]

I have now been reconsidering my intentions on stretching the fuel dollar! going back to my original plans to go with the LPG (Propane) conversion on the 454 engine in my 310.
I have more or less ditched the idea of the Diesel conversion discussed earlier, as it would appear to be a little more involved in gear ratios than I had with a Range Rover conversion I did a few years ago. This all came about after I reassessed the tank-age for the engine propane. I can now fit a decent size fuel tank.

However to put yet another dampener on the subject, I had the following from Dick Patterson at SPRINGFIELD IGNITION, a guru when it comes to Qjets on the Olds engines found in GMC's This all came about as I need to replace my Qjet or get some serious replacements for it, and I contacted him on a friends recommendation (He has the GMC).

"...........My greatest concern is your planned move to dual fuel with propane and gas. Here are the main reasons for my concern---I was a GM dealer for 25 years- (1976-2001)-and we sold a lot of medium duty and heavy duty GMC trucks--- about 1980--fuel costs went way up--and truck operators began the switch to add propane conversions- to save fuel dollars--the results were a complete disaster---all the units we changed over -came back---burnt out valves -ring problems oil consumption etc-etc- propane is a very abrasive fuel when burned in a standard engine--there were trucks all over the country with the same service and longevity issues---so it was not the installation. The problem with dual fuel is that the 2 different fuels call for 2 different tune specifications-----for gas the timing and thermostat call for 195 F and a normal advance curve in the dist -like 32 -34 degrees total---on the other hand propane needs a much cooler motor temp with a 175 thermostat or less -blocked off heat /intake manifold crossovers-and almost no ignition advance.
Obviously you can’t satisfy both running conditions to be optimum-so the efficiency is the result of this huge compromise--the resulting mechanical failures were far more than the cost of fuel could have ever been. Having said that -perhaps today -there is better technology out there-but I still don’t know how you can overcome those basic dual requirements in a single application. .......... However based on my experience with a motor that was not originally designed or engineered to run on propane I would stick with gasoline and work to optimize the motor for max efficiency on that fuel.--your move to headers is a step that way.........."

As you can see there seems some doubt on service life.

So chaps, what is your view and if any, experience running the 454 on propane. any hints would be gratefully received

[Boom Sounds]

Hi Chuck,

It's an interesting dilemma and think we need to get to a concensus position on this question because it isn't well documented on the site.

I guess one of the key changes between 1980s/1990s and now is the number of LPG stations in the UK. I imagine those truckers were regularly running on gas then LPG - both for long distances. However, given the price of gas in the UK and the significant expansion in the number of outlets, I would envisage running almost entirely on LPG. So, if the vehicle is tuned well for this fuel, will it work/start on petrol? In fact, can you start direct from LPG - I've heard mixed reports on this.

These guys looks like they might be able to provide good advice/service.
LAS Motorhome Services - Casestudies

Has anyone in the US actually done a propane conversion for the 454 and has it worked? Nothing like real experience to help guide us on this one.

Keep me posted.

[Pick]

I know a guy who has lots of experience in converting vehicles to run on propane. His name is Marc Deluca and he is out of Coshocton, Ohio. See his website at: DeLuca Fuel Products for more information. I am running one of his propane fumigation systems on my Duramax diesel and am very pleased with it.

For every 33 gallon tank of propane I burn, I save $35 in diesel fuel, if I can get the propane for $2 a gallon.

[Chuckles]

I have had some further thoughts on this.

The earlier comments related to older 1960/70's vehicles and American petrol (Gas) which has a much lower Octane than UK Petrol (Gas).

I had to retard my 454 by nearly 8 degrees, when I brought it over from Texas, to run better on 95 octane regular UK Unleaded. It now runs quieter and has more performance. With the low compression ratio and the hardened valve seats for unleaded on the later engines, that must go some way to meet the LPG (propane) fuels ignition settings. With the spark nearer TDC it is not far from the very low advance setting for LPG.

As for the corrosion/erosion factor I am still out on that one.

Does that make sense? after all range Rover use the Buick 3.5 to 4.2 V8's and many of those are running LPG, with some success.

[Boom Sounds]

Does anyone know the number of the IMPCO propane conversion kit for the 454? Also, where you can get them from? I'm going to stick one in my 1991 250.


thanks
Boom Sounds

[remcolent]

Propane Guy Parts and Propane Accessory's
compared to our EU prices I find this realy cheap, look at the rebuild units.
I would prefer a OHG over impco but on a 454 your better of with a dual mixer setup
eiter from impco or OHG both mxers only flow a little over 300CFM and that is a bit low for a 454.
Remco