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Old 10-24-2015, 11:58 AM   #379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Punch View Post
OK, now I'll shut up.
no wait, there is more.
Both the hydroboost and the master cylinder work via pistons and seals.
A leaky hydroboost output rod piston seal would eventually help destroying the Master cylinder piston seal, but not in a rapid way Martin experienced brake failure. A catastrophic failure may even slightly pollute the brake fluid, but that is very far fetched and it would cause failure of all the power steering stuff too.
And there are 2 piston seals in the Master cylinder, which means the first one would have to fail first before reaching the second one.
Feel better now, Punch ?
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Old 10-24-2015, 12:19 PM   #380
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very odd, maybe they forgot to fill it
did you see a puddle anywhere? Thats a lot of fluid
Sorry Peter, I missed this in the exchanges.

No sign of any fluid leaks but also the MC gasket had been 'sucked' (deformed) into the cylinders (sorry for the non-technical description). To me this suggests fluid being pushed out rather than leaking.

I had driven straight from the shop to the local car park (which just happens to be next to the beach), and had been driving around braking with different levels of intensity, before the light came back on and the pedal returned to how it was previously (I didn't loose all brakes fortunately, it just went back to how it was before the repair). If they filled the MC (and I assume they did because the brakes were great for a while) then I can't rationalize both sides of the MC would be effected.
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Old 10-24-2015, 12:35 PM   #381
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no wait, there is more.
Go ahead.... stir the pot. Followed by Punch's "I told you so".



Cheers
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Old 10-24-2015, 06:18 PM   #382
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I hesitate to bring this up but it might be something to check into.

Is it possible the previous shop bled the brakes and by mistake they put brake fluid in the power steering system reservoir thinking they were "topping off" the brake MC reservoir?
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Old 10-24-2015, 06:37 PM   #383
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Anything is possible at this point Brad!
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Old 10-29-2015, 04:00 PM   #384
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I said anything is possible; so believe it or not, here are all things that the new shop have found so far, any one of which could have caused the issue....

Rear brakes
The only thing salvageable is the drums and the back plates. All the wheel cylinders are blown out. On the right side the pads are down to the rivets, on the left the fluid has leaked over the pads. The lines across the back axle are physically ruptured.

Front brakes
Nothing is salvageable. The right hand caliper is totally blown out, the pads are down to the backings, the cylinder itself is out of the caliper and even the rubber boot is missing, the disc on the right has dime size lumps taken out of it. The left side is not so bad, but if we are changing calipers and discs we may as well to everything.

It appears I have only ever been driving with one working brake (the left front), luckily the right front was inoperable or I would have lost the left front as well. The rears, it appears only worked long enough to bleed and once I used (and for a short period had there brakes working) it burst the lines across the rear axle, blew out the wheel cylinders and dropped all the fluid in the rear and most of the front circuit.

Parts bill so far (not including a possible new hydroboost and MC; and the mechanics thinks they will need to be replaced when they start flushing the system), is $750 (just parts, the guy is already 8 hours labor in as well).

I feel pretty lucky to have got away with the mechanic finding all this, without me ending up in A+E and Bella in a ditch or worse!
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Old 10-29-2015, 04:23 PM   #385
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I'll say this, you SHOULD have bought a lottery ticket the day you picked Bella up from the shop.

The next thing is to present the evidence to the first shop and ask them to pay for any work currently being done. If they don't want to take care of you that way there is always small claims court. I won a small claims court case against a transmission shop that installed used parts trying to save a buck.

I'll say again, you're one lucky guy
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:10 PM   #386
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Wow, that sounds pretty nasty Martin. I thought you had a shop go through the entire brake system?


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Old 10-29-2015, 06:36 PM   #387
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Wow, that sounds pretty nasty Martin. I thought you had a shop go through the entire brake system?


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So far.......

The original seller 'had his mechanic' go through the brakes when the body was off

Then Airstream NE removed all the wheels/drums checked and bleed the brakes during the rebuild. Then after I drove Bella and complained the brakes were poor, they went through them again and ran the hydroboost performance test and gave it back with a clean bill of health saying the brakes were 100% and that I need to get used to them.

Then the brake warning light came on and I took it to the local shop. They 'went through everything, removed the wheels, drums, flushed and bleed the brakes'. Because the brakes went during a 'test drive', I haven't paid the bill or even got a schedule of work from the last shop (the guy is pretty put out that I took it somewhere else when the brakes failed as they still feel they were working on it), but they called me to say it was ready for the test.

So far three separate 'mechanics' have gone through the entire system although I think the current situation speakers for itself.
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:38 PM   #388
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Frustrating! Sorry, Martin!
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:41 PM   #389
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So far three separate 'mechanics' have gone through the entire system although I think the current situation speakers for itself.
Pictures, get lots of pictures of what this latest shop has found. I think the old saying "A picture is worth a thousand words" couldn't be more true.

Another thing that worries me about all this is just how few shops really know what they're doing anymore. Kinda scary
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:45 PM   #390
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Martin,
I am glad to hear that your concerns are getting taking care of the right way. No matter what anyone is telling you, this is the first time the rear drums came off. You just don't go through all that work to pull the drums and put them back on with brake pads down to the metal, not to mention the leaky wheel cylinders.
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:49 PM   #391
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...this is the first time the rear drums came off. You just don't go through all that work to pull the drums and put them back on with brake pads down to the metal, not to mention the leaky wheel cylinders.
I think Peter just nailed it.
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Old 10-29-2015, 06:50 PM   #392
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What's that age old saying....."If you want the job done right.....do it yourself".

I can understand someone not knowing a wheel cylinder is bad and about to blow, but if I was your mechanic, I would look at the age of the vehicle and since the axles had to come out to get to your drums in the first place, I would be the first to SUGGEST replacing everything while it was apart. Wheel cylinders, pads and springs are cheap.

Unless of course they never actually took the axles out to get to the drums and still charged you.

Somebody buggered up, that's for sure. I'm glad I have rear discs.

Cheers
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