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Old 03-27-2008, 08:42 AM   #15
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Radiator

From what I can see the setup on the 74 argosy looks like mine. I just know that it would be next to impossible to change design by installing a dif rad all together. For one thing the rad sets in a metal U channel affair. This U channel has several things attached to it....such as the dip stick...the oil fill spout....the transmission oil cooler.... the air conditioner evaporator....couple wire bundles. So to change desiges....I take it a new U channel would be needed...which means figuring out how to re attach all these things. I think maybe even more impoertant than an engineering degree....one might need a magic wand. (anyone know where I can get a nice used magic wand....cheap)
It does have me wondering if I will be able to find a new rad. I really hate to go the repair route but I guess it might be the only way.
I'll try to send some more pictures....I'm leaving April 1st for a week long train trip with AmTrak so I won't be able to log on for awhile....the rad won't get reinstalled until after I get back....

Speaking of train trip.... with the Mud Slides out in Oregon...and the flood conditions up the Mississippi river valley...which are two of the places we plan on going.... maybe the train trip will be cancled.

See ya all later....but big thank you for all your imput
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Old 03-27-2008, 10:30 AM   #16
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Train trip

Tn2

I don't have much experience with P30 radiators. However, I have had very good luck with radiator shop repairs. A good one should be able to help.

But my real reason for responding is your Amtrak trip. My wife and I did the Chicago, San Francisco, Seattle and back to Chicago loop last year in March and were going to do it again this year. Fortunately I checked and discovered that the Sacramento to Eugene(?) portion was going to be a night time transfer to a bus. We changed our plans and returned from SF to Chicago. (Last year there was flooding sout of St Paul - they switched tracks and came down the east side of the river.)

I am fairly confident that Amtrak will get you there - we were on time (within a few minutes) to both San francisco and returning to Kalamazoo this year. And last year we were successfully bussed over Donner Pass when Union Pacific's snow removal equipment derailed. We just did not want to sign up for a night time train to bus to train trip.

If you are traveling by coach probably not much difference. But I like to let the train put me to sleep in my bunk - and stay that way. Anyway, I called Amtrak's 800 number - they were very nice and changed the reservation. (Last I heard the mud slide was not going to be fixed until late April - but who knows.)

Good luck

Whit Nash
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Old 03-29-2008, 08:17 AM   #17
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Camden , Tennessee
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Radiator

Well I took my radiator to a repair shop about 30 miles away from my place. I guess radiator repair must be a dying trade...there are fewer and fewer of them. This old gentleman seem to know his business about radiators. He didn't give me much hope of finding a new radiator and he was also supprised about it being mounted up and down in my MH rather than crosswise. His plan is to pressure check it and determine if its worth repairing. Doesn't really hold out much hope for the repair because of its age. He did say that if he could repair it the cost would be about $75. I think he will probably go with a recore job....which he says will be no problem doing it....but the cost would be up around 300....and he would not charge anything for his time in first trying to repair it first. I'm actually hoping for a recore job. One might think that repair or recore would be strictly my decision but I trust this old gent that he isn't going to repair if it's not worth the effort. I'll post the results after I get back from vacation
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Old 03-29-2008, 06:32 PM   #18
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There's a reason its a dying trade

Quote:
Originally Posted by tn2
... I guess radiator repair must be a dying trade...there are fewer and fewer of them. This old gentleman seem to know his business about radiators. ...
The old guys in the business remember when radiators were built to be repaired.

I took my OEM radiator [from a post above] to an established radiator shop full of old guys a year before the radiator was replaced with another one.

On pickup, the seasoned veteran told me the radiator was repaired, but that I should replace it at the next sign of trouble. Radiator part thicknesses are NOT what they used to be.

Good luck,
Tom
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Old 03-29-2008, 07:43 PM   #19
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I have the same radiator in my 79. Can you describe how the radiator is removed, does it come out the bottom?
Thanks
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:50 AM   #20
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Radiator

My first reaction to if the radiator would come out the bottom was to say NO WAY....LOL.... but then I have to stop myself because I am not a pro at removing radiators. So I will repharse my reaction. There is a picture on the forum of someone removing the rad thru the bottom but it's not on a 78 model. So maybe it would be possible on some RVs. But for me I don't see a way in the world that that would be the best method of removal. All I did was remove the grill ....which is only a few bolts and the grill comes out in one piece. It took me about 3 hours to get my rad out thru the top. Except for the upper radiator hose....all the work was done from the outside of the MH. One tool I could not have done without....it's called a racheting box end wrench. The radiator sets inside a U shaped channel. This U channel has a top channel that goes over the top of the rad. The radiator and this channel all comes out as a unit. I've done radiators in cars and of course in the car you leave the U channel in place and the rad just slips out....but in a car you have clear air above the radiator....not so in the RV. So you disconnect the U channel .... tip it forward enough to remove the upper portion of the U channel....then there is room to remove the radiator and lower U channel as a unit. Goes without saying..... there are many opportunities to do further damage to the radiator....so be very careful how you pry and tug. It's really not all that bad of a job. One little problem I had. The drain cock on my rad was plugged so it would not drain the antifreeze. So I removed the complete pet cock..... BE READY with a rather large pail....there's lots of antifreeze in there....but also it will come shooting out of there with some force. I got a face full of antifreeze before I could roll to one side... . SO DO let your engine cool before draining the fluid.
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Old 04-10-2008, 02:32 PM   #21
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Radiator

Well I got home from my 7 day Amtrak train trip out to California. Was that ever a great ride....would highly recommend it to all.

Anyway.... when I got home I called the radiator shop and they had my radiator all ready to go. They had to record my radiator. All there is to that is that they order a core that is same size as your old core...then they take the upper and lower tank off the old rad and solder it inplace on the new cord. It comes out looking like a brand new radiator. All total I guess it took about 8 or 9 hours to install it back into the RV. Not really to bad of a job. When I first started the engine I did not have one leak....LOL. I was hoping that I would see a little bit of drop in running temp but it is pretty much the same as with the old core. My RV runs right at about 205 degrees. For those interested in price....and who isn't... the total was 409.69. I figure labor if it was out on the road would run another $500.

Talk to you again when the next thing gives up the ghost...hopfully it will again be in my driveway.

Charles
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Old 04-10-2008, 03:25 PM   #22
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Based on my experience, I would not trust temp reading unless you have validated your gauge.
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:31 AM   #23
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Temp

Well I'm not too concerned with 205 temp. According to what I read with antifreeze in the system and a pressurized system (15 pounds in this case) the boiling point is not reach until around 265 degrees. These big block engines normally run over 200.
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:44 AM   #24
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What I did to verify my temp gauge was to buy an infrared pyrometer and use it to check the temperature on various parts of the radiator and engine. What I found was the gauge was always reading a little high and worse as the supplied voltage to the dash instruments dropped the temperature read even hotter. I still haven't tracked down the problem with the voltage but at least now I know what temperature the engine really runs at.

Surprisingly it never ran much over about 205.

The infrared pyrometer was only about $40 an seems to work quite well. I've found lots of uses for it once I got it .

Brad
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Old 04-11-2008, 04:37 PM   #25
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Pyrometer

I've often thought I would like to get a pyrometer.....$40 is not too bad of a price. Hey....thought just crossed my mind....I was wondering what else I might use the meter for....do you think it would work for making fudge....LOL
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:58 PM   #26
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Internal vs. external temperatures

Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
What I did to verify my temp gauge was to buy an infrared pyrometer and use it to check the temperature on various parts of the radiator and engine. ...
The temperature gauge is connected to a sensor mounted to measure coolant temperature (internal temperature).

I can easily see that any device which measures skin temperature would return a different reading (external temperature).

External skin temperatures, with all the various types of metal in the way, would be slower to respond to coolant temps, and would be affected by other heat sources (exhaust manifolds & radiator fan convected heat).

In my opinion, the coolant temperature is the best indicator of how comfortable the engine is.

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Old 04-11-2008, 07:37 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomW
In my opinion, the coolant temperature is the best indicator of how comfortable the engine is.

Tom
Tom, I certainly don't disagree with you. I didn't just check the radiator I also checked various parts of the block as well. Temperatures were in line with what I would have expected to see.

The main reason I wanted to check with a pyrometer was because with-in minutes my gauge temperature would swing 15 to 20 degrees with no change in surrounding conditions (i.e. driving speed, hills, etc). The only difference was the dash voltage would drop to often times less than 12 and those readings corresponded to the higher coolant temperatures. The pyrometer confirmed for me the external engine temps stayed the same during the periods of voltage & temp gauge fluctuations.

What I really want to do is install a mechanical temperature gauge to give more accurate readings of engine coolant. This on my list of must do's some day.

Brad
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Old 04-11-2008, 07:42 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tn2
I've often thought I would like to get a pyrometer.....$40 is not too bad of a price. Hey....thought just crossed my mind....I was wondering what else I might use the meter for....do you think it would work for making fudge....LOL
Making fudge, monitoring boiling water, checking the temperature of the air coming out of your dash vents, checking seat temperature before sitting in it if its been in the hot sun, etc.

The list is endless as to what you can do with an infrared pyrometer

Don't leave home without one!

Brad
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