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10-05-2015, 07:38 AM
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#321
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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I didn't realize there were 3 versions of the doghouse!
Looking at the picture it looks like it would be horribly inconvenient, both for getting into the seats and working on the engine.
The overall shape of the doghouse top on the 74-76 model Argosy is probably the best for access to the seats and rotating the seats. The shape of the opening is probably best on the Classic series that use the ABS plastic removable cover.
Now if you could have the opening of the Classic series and shape the top of the later Classic series doghouse covers more like the early Argosy covers you'd have the best of both worlds
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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10-05-2015, 02:59 PM
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#322
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STstudios
1986 34.5' Airstream 345
Wixom
, Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 68
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Nice shop Brad! Look forward to seeing the progress on your Argosy!
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10-05-2015, 04:48 PM
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#323
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Keen amature
1975 20' Argosy 20
Chestfield
, Kent
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
Martin, I see what you mean about the taper at the top. Could you take a measurement from the top flat part of the doghouse cover to the floor of the cockpit? I'd like to see if there is a difference between the new style and the old style.
Next question, what is the measurement from the top front of the drivers seat to the floor?
And my last question How far rearward is the divers seat from the edge of the cockpit window?
Thanks!
Brad
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Lets see if this works....
So the height from the main floor to the cockpit floor is 9", and the height of the doghouse is an additional 9"
The height from the top front of the drivers seat to the floor is 17" (made up of a 10" mount, 3" adapter, 4" seat)
(Terrible photo, sorry it was getting dark so I grabbed it quickly)
And when fully back, the base of the drivers seat is right on the rear edge of the cockpit window (however I sit with the seat in a recline so the top of the seat back is approx 8" behind the window).
This means the center of the mount is approx 8" forward of the edge of the cockpit (meaning the seat could have gone back a further 2", but that would have meant, it would be 2" forward when reversed 180")
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10-06-2015, 05:38 AM
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#324
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STstudios
Nice shop Brad! Look forward to seeing the progress on your Argosy!
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Thanks Sam! I'm looking forward to progress myself
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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10-06-2015, 06:47 AM
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#325
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3 Rivet Member
1978 28' Argosy 28
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 207
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Brad, the doghouse on my '78 is obviously the old style that you're replacing. Took me forever to figure this out, but I ended up pulling the carpet out in front of the piano hinge. That flat section unbolts to expose the front of the engine. I was able to gain access to the belts/ac compressor etc with ease. Of course, I didn't figure this out until after I had lifted the engine with the hoist and done the motormounts.
But, bottom line is there actually is very good access with the old style. Just takes a few minutes to remove the panel. On mine anyhow.. no telling if its stock.
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10-06-2015, 07:01 AM
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#326
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Wouldn't you know it, I left my notes at home with all the dimensions on it
Quote:
Originally Posted by martin300662
Lets see if this works....
So the height from the main floor to the cockpit floor is 9", and the height of the doghouse is an additional 9"
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Those numbers sound pretty close to what I remember on mine.
Quote:
The height from the top front of the drivers seat to the floor is 17" (made up of a 10" mount, 3" adapter, 4" seat)
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If I remember right you said originally you were 3" higher which would have put your seat at 20". With the flexsteel seats in mine using the original mount and seat my drivers seat is about 18-1/2". Oddly enough my passenger seat pedestal is about 2" taller than the drivers pedestal.
On Sunday I ordered a new 7-1/8" fixed pedestal and a 6-way power pedestal. The 6-way pedestal is a minimum 4" tall to a max of 6" tall. So with the seat being 4" + 7-1/8" + 4" my minimum height would be 15-1/8" with a maximum of 17-1/8". I will need to add an inch or two spacer so my seat height should fall within the range that you're currently using. Once I prove (to myself!) that the new fixed pedestal and 6-way pedestal are going to work I'll order the same for the passenger side. I ordered the pedestal parts from the Factory RV Surplus site that you mentioned previously in your thread.
Quote:
And when fully back, the base of the drivers seat is right on the rear edge of the cockpit window (however I sit with the seat in a recline so the top of the seat back is approx 8" behind the window).
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I like my seat reclined as well although probably not think quite as much.
Quote:
This means the center of the mount is approx 8" forward of the edge of the cockpit (meaning the seat could have gone back a further 2", but that would have meant, it would be 2" forward when reversed 180")
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Try this, move your seat forward until the back side of the seat is 1" rearward of the window and then change the tilt so it's pretty much straight up and down. If you still had the bathroom wall in place this is the where your seat would have to be! This configuration would likely explain why Airstream never used this arrangement in any other rig that I know of.
Thanks for taking the measurements!
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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10-06-2015, 07:28 AM
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#327
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpg_austin
Brad, the doghouse on my '78 is obviously the old style that you're replacing. Took me forever to figure this out, but I ended up pulling the carpet out in front of the piano hinge. That flat section unbolts to expose the front of the engine. I was able to gain access to the belts/ac compressor etc with ease. Of course, I didn't figure this out until after I had lifted the engine with the hoist and done the motormounts.
But, bottom line is there actually is very good access with the old style. Just takes a few minutes to remove the panel. On mine anyhow.. no telling if its stock.
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Ben, when I got my Argosy all of the doghouse components had been removed and piled in the back by the PO that yanked the 454. At one point I laid all of the pieces back in place to see what it was like. It's been so long now I don't remember how that flat section was attached.
So other than having to do a bit more work you can gain access to the front of the engine, that's a bit of good news. Overall I think I'm still going to be happier with the newer style doghouse cover. When I had to replace all the belts on the 310 while sitting on the side of I-75 it would have annoyed me to have to do any more work than I had to to get going again!
Thanks for pointing this out!
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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10-06-2015, 07:34 AM
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#328
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Keen amature
1975 20' Argosy 20
Chestfield
, Kent
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
Try this, move your seat forward until the back side of the seat is 1" rearward of the window and then change the tilt so it's pretty much straight up and down. If you still had the bathroom wall in place this is the where your seat would have to be! This configuration would likely explain why Airstream never used this arrangement in any other rig that I know of.
Thanks for taking the measurements!
Brad
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To be honest, I wouldn't have even fitted behind the wheel, even with it tilted straight up!
We have the same height on both driver and passenger side, and the biggest reason for lowering was DW could not reach the floor when sitting in the chair....she would end up legs swinging in mid-air. So I lowered them as far as possible so I was comfortable, she could touch the ground but they could still swing past the doghouse when turning. The reason for wanting the seats the same height will probably never come about....when the fold flat you could lay a platform for an extra (twin) base and have a extra bed.
One thing occurred to me and that is I have the factory 350 small block; is there any chance they needed to change to the second type of early doghouse if the big block was installed, and by the time they went to the fiberglass hutch all the engines were big block?????
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10-06-2015, 07:51 AM
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#329
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3 Rivet Member
1978 28' Argosy 28
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
When I had to replace all the belts on the 310 while sitting on the side of I-75 it would have annoyed me to have to do any more work than I had to to get going again!
Brad
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No arguing with that!!
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10-06-2015, 07:52 AM
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#330
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martin300662
To be honest, I wouldn't have even fitted behind the wheel, even with it tilted straight up!
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In the original configuration it's tight for me as well. Not a well thought out floor plan by Airstream.
Quote:
We have the same height on both driver and passenger side, and the biggest reason for lowering was DW could not reach the floor when sitting in the chair....she would end up legs swinging in mid-air. So I lowered them as far as possible so I was comfortable, she could touch the ground but they could still swing past the doghouse when turning. The reason for wanting the seats the same height will probably never come about....when the fold flat you could lay a platform for an extra (twin) base and have a extra bed.
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Makes sense and it's a nice idea to have them the same height for something like a small bed. I'll have to keep that one in mind.
Quote:
One thing occurred to me and that is I have the factory 350 small block; is there any chance they needed to change to the second type of early doghouse if the big block was installed, and by the time they went to the fiberglass hutch all the engines were big block?????
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My 74 came with the 454 from the factory. I don't think there is much difference in height between the big block and the small block, at least from the motor mounts upwards. The difference seems to be more in the width and possibly a little lower for the oil pan.
I think like everything else on these motorhomes they just sort of evolved. Sometimes the evolution went down a path that was a dead end like Neanderthal so Airstream changed something to improve the line
My Argosy has a bunch of little features I've not seen on any other Argosy but I'm sure it came from the factory that way. I have two rear lower outer corner compartments that I've not seen before. I have an exterior storage compartment at the left rear under the bed and it has a rear fuel tank that sure looks like it was installed during the original build of the coach.
Argosy motorhomes are some of the more unique rigs that Airstream built.
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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10-07-2015, 06:26 AM
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#331
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
On Sunday I ordered a new 7-1/8" fixed pedestal and a 6-way power pedestal. The 6-way pedestal is a minimum 4" tall to a max of 6" tall. So with the seat being 4" + 7-1/8" + 4" my minimum height would be 15-1/8" with a maximum of 17-1/8". I will need to add an inch or two spacer so my seat height should fall within the range that you're currently using.
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I just noticed my math was wrong. The seat is as Martin stated previously 6" thick not 4". That means without any adapters to tie the base to the 6-way pedestal to the seat the overall height is 17-1/8". I will have to add a total of 3/4" for adapters which puts me at almost 18".
Fortunately I made one other mistake when I ordered the 7-1/8" pedestal. The floor in front of the seat is 2" higher than where the pedestal sits that effectively makes the pedestal 5-1/8" tall
So all is well again
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-12-2015, 12:08 PM
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#332
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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When ever I get a spare minute or two I've been sorting through what I need to do to get my dash reassembled. One of the major issues with the dash is the wiring mess and the dash AC installation.
As I was reviewing some pictures of the dash that I had taken while disassembling it I noticed something that I just had to laugh at. If you'll look at the picture below notice where the passenger floor vent opening is in relation to the return air vent.
I'm not sure how Airstream ever thought that the passenger would get cool (or hot) air at their feet considering any air coming out of the floor vent was likely to be sucked right back into the return air vent before coming near the passenger.
I'll have to see if I can do something about the placement of the floor vent.
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-14-2015, 11:21 AM
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#333
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Dazed and Confused
Currently Looking...
1983 31' Airstream310
Hillsburgh
, Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterH-Airstreamer
I was referring to what they had changed the dog house to in 79 or before, which was rather annoying
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That is the very same doghouse as in my 310 turbo diesel. There's very clearance between the top intake plenum and the doghouse cover. Yes it's a pain to move around it to get in an out of the front seats.
Coming together nicely Brad.
Cheers
Tony
__________________
Per Mare, Per Terram and may all your campaigns be successful.
“It’s a recession when your neighbor loses his job; it’s a depression when you lose your own.” "Harry S Truman"
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11-17-2015, 10:51 AM
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#334
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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While doing the ABS plastic repair on the front valance I decided I might as well start working on the ABS fan housing that goes above the evaporator box for the dash AC.
The fit between the evaporator box and the ABS housing was horrible. There were enough little gaps and cracks I'm surprised any air made it to the vents.
So far I'm really impressed with how the ABS repair process is working. It's a lot easier to work with than I thought it would be. Sometime in the next week or so I should have the evaporator box re-assembled and ready to mount to the firewall.
Baby steps...
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-17-2015, 11:53 AM
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#335
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Rivet Master
1984 34.5' Airstream 345
Foothill Ranch
, California
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,695
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Brad,
As you know, I have done the MEK/ABS slurry repairs before.
To make it REALLY strong, wet in a piece of fiberglass mat over the cracked areas. I have found it might crack again if you don't do that.
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11-17-2015, 12:19 PM
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#336
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyair
Brad,
As you know, I have done the MEK/ABS slurry repairs before.
To make it REALLY strong, wet in a piece of fiberglass mat over the cracked areas. I have found it might crack again if you don't do that.
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Steve, several years ago after I read about your repairs was when I realized that damaged ABS panels could actually be fixed
What I plan on doing for the fan housing is to use metal bars on top of the ABS flanges for strength where it screws to the evaporator housing. I'm also going to use some self adhesive rubber strips to provide a seal.
The last thing I want is for that nice cool air to be blowing out of cracks and gaps in the engine compartment instead of blowing into the cockpit!
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-17-2015, 12:48 PM
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#337
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Martin, I stared at this picture of your seat pedestal for days before I finally realized why the spacing from your pedestal to the the edge of the raised deck was so much shorter than mine. On yours in the picture below the distance appears to be about 5" to 6" from center of pedestal to edge of wall.
On mine the distance from the center of the pedestal to the edge was something like 15". It finally dawned on me that your coach is missing the 9" extended platform behind the seats!
On my old 84 310 the extended platform is present as seen in the picture below. Actually I think the extended platform is slightly larger in the 310 compared to my Argosy.
Do you think having the platform present would make it easier for you to climb into the drivers seat of your Argosy?
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-17-2015, 01:48 PM
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#338
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Keen amature
1975 20' Argosy 20
Chestfield
, Kent
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkahler
Martin, I stared at this picture of your seat pedestal for days before I finally realized why the spacing from your pedestal to the the edge of the raised deck was so much shorter than mine. On yours in the picture below the distance appears to be about 5" to 6" from center of pedestal to edge of wall.
On mine the distance from the center of the pedestal to the edge was something like 15". It finally dawned on me that your coach is missing the 9" extended platform behind the seats!
Attachment 252328
On my old 84 310 the extended platform is present as seen in the picture below. Actually I think the extended platform is slightly larger in the 310 compared to my Argosy.
Attachment 252333
Do you think having the platform present would make it easier for you to climb into the drivers seat of your Argosy?
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I guess you don't miss what you have never had!
I am only 5' 9', 30" inside leg, but can comfortably step from the lower level, into the foot-well - maybe because the doghouse is shaped as it is.
I am not sure mine ever had the extended platform as a 9" extension would bring the raised section out past the edge of the door.
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11-17-2015, 02:01 PM
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#339
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Martin, I'll have to measure the actual length of the extension. It's been several years since I rebuilt it and it is likely shorter than that. On mine the extension reaches to within about 2" of the door opening.
On the later Classics the space inside that extension and right above the transmission is where Airstream located the hydraulic power unit for the coach leveling system. At least that's where it was located on the 86 345.
I went to a lot of effort rebuilding that platform extension and after looking at your arrangement I'm not sure why I went to all the effort
Now that it's in place I doubt that I will remove it, but it sure is tempting!
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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11-20-2015, 08:11 AM
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#340
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Rivet Master
1974 20' Argosy 20
Richmond
, Kentucky
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,115
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Since Martin has been going through fuel tank issues I figured it was time that I dropped my fuel tanks for cleaning and/or replacement.
My Argosy has two fuel tanks, the original OEM main tank on the passenger side and a custom auxiliary fuel tank behind the differential. Fortunately the main tank is available at a reasonable price, $189 delivered. I'll be ordering one of those in the near future.
The rear auxiliary tank is a real interesting piece of work.
The exterior fill door was installed with pop rivets.
Since the tank sits up between the frame rails the only way to get a vent pipe high enough was to route it up into the coach. For the breather/vent pipe from the tank to the filler neck they built a plywood housing that extends almost halfway into the coach above floor level.
A lot of thought went into the construction of the covering as it has a galvanized sheet metal floor with plywood sides and the top cover had a sealing gasket.
The filler tube itself was routed down into the compartment below floor level and out to the tank itself.
The tank itself was definitely custom fabricated to fit in the spot it was in. The tank is solidly built and whoever built seemed to know what they were doing.
As far as installation goes my only real gripe is how the vent piping was routed. If I end up keeping the tank or something similar I'm going to have to find a better way to route the vent line.
The first thing I'm going to do is have the tank boiled out to get a better idea of what condition it's in. From looking inside it seems to be pretty solid but I'd rather have the repair shop give me their opinion.
Assuming I do keep the tank I will likely rework the filler tube arrangement. From what I could see someone smeared silicone sealant around the joint coming out of the tank where the large tube meets the smaller tube. My guess is the joint was leaking and it was an attempt to fix that.
I'm also considering dropping the tank several inches or more. The tank sits about 8" or more above the bottom edge of the differential. Dropping the tank 3" or so would make it a lot easier to route a vent line below the floor. The other modification would be to hang it from straps instead of bolting it directly to the frame.
Bottom line is I'd really like to keep the auxiliary tank for the added capacity. The main tank only provides about 26 usable gallons so adding another 25 or so would sure be nice
Brad
__________________
Air forums # 1674
1974 20' Argosy Motor Home
1975 24' Argosy Motor Home
1974 31' Excella trailer (parting out, as of 4/1/2015 I have wheels & windows left to sell)
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