TAC New England

[rgesch]

Originally Posted by Chuck

As Miles would say..."less is more".

I think we should consider this philosophy for more rallies.

No Doubt! And don't forget his other bit of instruction, "don't rehearse, you get paid to rehearse on the bandstand." My favorite.

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by rgesch

Richard & I would definitely be in but we will never get the Caravel off the Mountain with the mud season we are having (ref: "#064 Must Be Spring" thread, post #8.) Besides I'm still trying to get over what’s going on with VT. What in *&*^% happened?

Robin

Should we hope for freezing weather so you can get your Caravel?

In re: "What in *&*^% happened?"



Well, let's start with the plumbing....
By the way, did you know they ALL leak? It's true!
Floor was badly water stained.
Electric needed a lot of help throughout.
The bathroom needed help.
The mice needed a new home.
We needed better insulation for longer seasons and future ski trips.
For boondocking: An additional fresh and a bigger grey tank, wired for solar now.
Cracked plastics fixed/painted.
Outside speakers for tunes,
yada, yada....

This pic is from under the shower.
They found it disconnected like that!!!!

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by Over59

Man you are committed to this camping thing now...

I'm committed to this trailer now!

[Chuck]

well...that'll catch most of the water.

and you were wondering why you managed to go for such long stretches with such a small grey tank. mystery solved....
the new grey tank may be a down-grade.

[ticki2]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

I'm committed to this trailer now!

Where are you having the work done ? After all the hype this trailer got with the rebuild I would be one unhappy camper . Best of luck ( at least from now on ).

[rgesch]

I can buy the leaks. The "Earthquake on Wheels Theory" my Dad taught me. But the plumbing? electric? I think I would be a bit pissed or at least questioning the original renovation. Who did the work? I need to avoid them in my life. I guess I just would be wondering, and avoiding, the guy who did the work in regards to certain issues unless really the damage is related to the "Earthquake Theory" or if could forgive if mice, squirrel etc. got into the wires and stuff. I'm just so blown away by the whole deal. Robin

PS Richard and I were out and had a "sighting" we went to the peoples house and asked what they were going to do with this 31 ft Sovereign in their backyard. THEN we saw it. When we were done we told them Give it to anyone willing to take it out of your yard. What a WRECK! Not even worth gutting and starting over. The only thing NOT damaged what three sides of the outer aluminum.

[Frank's Trailer Works]

Originally Posted by rgesch

I can buy the leaks. The "Earthquake on Wheels Theory" my Dad taught me. But the plumbing? electric? I think I would be a bit pissed or at least questioning the original renovation. Who did the work? I need to avoid them in my life. I guess I just would be wondering, and avoiding, the guy who did the work in regards to certain issues unless really the damage is related to the "Earthquake Theory" or if could forgive if mice, squirrel etc. got into the wires and stuff. I'm just so blown away by the whole deal. Robin

I think a lot has been learned since 2004....

[rgesch]

Oh, one more thing about the insulation. I'm not an expert but Richard and I have done our fair share of winter camping. It takes nothing to heat these trailers if the vents are in the right place to circulate the air. That has always bothered me in the longer ones and I will be looking at that layout when we do "Henry".

If it's too heavily insulated and tight your walls will sweat and you will have a wicked time with condensation. We always had to keep a window vent open.

Robin

Isn't there a winter camping thread on the Forums you could check out? I would be interested in that information too.

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by ticki2

Where are you having the work done ? After all the hype this trailer got with the rebuild I would be one unhappy camper . Best of luck ( at least from now on ).

Colin Hyde Trailer Restorations is doing the work. I'm NOT, nor have I ever been, "an unhappy camper." Vintage Thunder has been a wonderful trailer that has taken us to some amazing places and has done right by us every step of the way.

Originally Posted by rgesch

I can buy the leaks. The "Earthquake on Wheels Theory" my Dad taught me. But the plumbing? electric?

Plumbing has a tendency to swell and crack in places, lots of places, when idiot owners don't know how to properly winterize their unit. Remember it's ME were talking about here. The leaks and that pipe under the shower I'll attribute to the "Earthquake" theory. Mouse/squirrel intrusions too. The Earthquakes created lots of cracks, like in the wheel well area. The electric clearly tasted real good to the mice. Chewed in places, corroded in others. GFIs will now also be put in.

Originally Posted by rgesch

I think I would be a bit pissed or at least questioning the original renovation. Who did the work?

Rich and Brett did most of the original renovation. Colin did the axles and the paint job. All three have helped me tremendously throughout my years of ownership and continue to do so even on this project. They are good friends and I probably don't thank them enough for holding my hand.

Originally Posted by 62overlander

I think a lot has been learned since 2004....

The original construction was very "interesting," shall we say. Many of the problems today began in 1977. When things aren't bolted down properly they tend to amplify the "Earthquake Effect" Robin pointed out.

Originally Posted by rgesch

Oh, one more thing about the insulation. I'm not an expert but Richard and I have done our fair share of winter camping. It takes nothing to heat these trailers if the vents are in the right place to circulate the air.

We always had to keep a window vent open.

Vintage Thunder has always kept us toasty and warm. And, yes, I finally figured out how to vent it properly. Three humans and two mutts can do some heavy breathing! The leaks and the mice, however, made for some disgusting insulation. Grossed me out. I couldn't leave it there. Had to go. Also, the Reflextex that was installed will help with summer time cooling. Vintage Thunder is going out west this year and Amanda is talking about visiting a desert or two.

I've got more to say but I gotta go to work now to pay for all this!

But before I go , I just want to emphasize, I am thrilled about what we're doing to Vintage Thunder. It's in great hands with Colin Hyde. This is not an unhappy time at all. We're excited! I went into this with my eyes wide open and communication with Colin throughout has been superb. Everything that has been done either needed to be done or I wanted done. I just got another 70 pictures sent to me last night. Yes, it's going to cost a lot of money. But we're going to have this trailer forever.

One MORE thing. When I get it back from Colin, it STILL won't be done! I've got even more plans in store for Vintage Thunder.

[mutcth]

Glad to hear you're excited about doing this work and that you love the trailer.

I'm trying to figure out our eventual "cut-off" point on the Minuet - fix and remodel it to a certain point, and then just save up for a five-year-old 23' International Serenity in 2015...but that might be trying to be too logical...

Funny thing - with your Argosy at Colin's, and my Argosy at Frank's - does Skip have the only functioning Argosy trailer left in Connecticut?!?

Tom

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by mutcth

does Skip have the only functioning Argosy trailer left in Connecticut?!?

Tom

He doesn't use his, so his doesn't count.

[muddy_hollow]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

I'm committed to this trailer now!

Did you leave the tailer soaking in salt water over the winter?

Jeeeez. That's love..

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by muddy_hollow

Did you leave the tailer soaking in salt water over the winter?

Jeeeez. That's love..

I was told that brining was a great way to get more flavor and juiciness, so I went for it! Silly me, I didn't think just living near the beach would be enough.

For those that don't know, this trailer was originally stuck in a Florida swamp. It was probably there for many years. I heard it took three trucks to finally extricate it from its nest. The back of the frame had been on my punch list ever since I bought VT. Take a look now at where the old frame connects with the new. Versailles, back in the day, used smaller, thinner frames to "support" the small holding tanks. Colin has put in a heartier stock back there and added some real support. I'm totally psyched to be getting a bigger grey tank and a nice new bumper compartment.

[mistral blue]

There will be a smoker on site this weekend!!!

I can't wait for you guys to see my butt.

[Chuck]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

...Colin has put in a heartier stock back there and added some real support. I'm totally psyched to be getting a bigger grey tank and a nice new bumper compartment.

I'd like to see more about this arrangement. I also wonder if the possibility of a larger black tank was explored, and how that might have played out, as well.

You could set up a picassa account on google to post all those pics....

[Over59]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

There will be a smoker on site this weekend!!!

I can't wait for you guys to see my butt.

Which will also benefit from sitting in a brine for a few days...

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by Chuck

I'd like to see more about this arrangement. I also wonder if the possibility of a larger black tank was explored, and how that might have played out, as well.

You could set up a picassa account on google to post all those pics....

I should probably just start a thread on this, I guess. I'm hesitant though because I'm not ANY kind of fixer-upper. I'm a breaker. 1st class.

Here's an example of my mechanical prowess: There was a shelf under the galley sink that I thought could use some bolstering. I found a stick outside that Donal had been whittling. It looked like the right length. I tried to use it. It was just a little short. I remembered that Donal picked up some small pieces of rubber off of the Watkins Glen racetrack when we were there last. So I put a small piece of this treasured rubber under the stick. Worked like a charm! (I hope Colin saved that stick! )

The black has never been an issue for us and how we use the trailer. I can see where it would though, but we're OK with it for the forseeable future. Plenty of times we've even caught grey at the sink and dumped it into the black. The grey limited us, sort of, if you know what I mean. And we also had that really cool shower set up going for us too remember. The fresh capacity limited us the most, and probably always will, no matter how big it gets.

[Chuck]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

So I put a small piece of this treasured rubber under the stick. Worked like a charm! (I hope Colin saved that stick! )

Pure genius. don't sell yourself short! Anything more would have added unnecessary cost, weight, and complexity. (the Miles Davis rule applies, again).

Originally Posted by mistral blue

The black has never been an issue for us and how we use the trailer. ...

I thought it might have come up under the category of, "...as long as we're in there...", and if so, how such a proposal might have looked.
(considering, my extremely similarly configured trailer. i.e. "if Colin were to put a bigger black tank in my (or your) trailer, how would he do that?" ).

[mistral blue]

Originally Posted by Chuck

Pure genius. don't sell yourself short!

I thought it might have come up under the category of, "...as long as we're in there..."

You have NO idea how quickly I can get in over my head. One day I'll have to show you how I dealt with the gaucho.... BTW, this reminds me, do you remember at last year's Chillyman when I was trying to install that screen door protector thingy? 4 rivets, took me an hour. I can still hear Mary laughing as she went walking by. I've screwed up measuring a ruler Chuck!

I did give the concept of a bigger black tank some thought. It can still happen. The grey hasn't gone in yet. Give me a little cost/benefit analysis. I'm interested in what you think. The "...as long as we're in there..." conversation comes up constantly, and it's true, the price is much lower if you do it all at once. That's what has driven a lot of what's happening. That's how these things go. And don't forget, surprises have to be expected and budgeted for as well.

The "how" part I can't answer, but I'll be happy to let you know everything I know/hear.

[Chuck]

Cost/benefit is that for only a few bucks more, you could have "even more capacity"; not that you absolutely neeeeed it now; but that could change. (small people do tend to get bigger...)

Under ordinary circumstances, the cost of upgrading the black tank wouldn't be worthwhile, because it would require complete gutting of the bathroom, a re-working of the plumbing, extensive structural reinforcement of the frame and bumper/drain components....and the cost of a bigger tank.

Well...thats already happening, anyway. except for that last bit. and a stock tank would cost ~150 bucks. a couple of pieces of angle iron and 10 minutes of welding, and...you're already paying for them to do the rest.

{As a future upgrade, it would be easy (i.e. "not a major frame-up restoration") to add a pump that could transfer water from a full grey tank into the mostly-empty black tank, without having to schlep dishwater from the kitchen back to the bathroom. no cost advantage to doing that now vs. later}

how this might work: well, there is no room to put a bigger black tank in the same place where the original was; but there is plenty of room for a large tank under the floor. I'm thinking that since the bathroom would be difficult to change, what with the toilet and vanity and sink all being supported by the original tank cover, you could leave all that in place, only without the tank. in its place, under the toilet, put a 6" pvc extension pipe to connect the toilet to the sub-floor black tank.