How would you structure a new AS Club?

[Buttercup]

Originally Posted by TWaugh

In response to Fred’s original request.

We all tend to agree we like Airforums and some of us even like/enjoy the WBCCI at the local level.

Why not the best of both worlds?

I think it is safe to say that WBCCI has zero interest in being part of these forums and a team player in what goes on here - the simple reason... They can not control or moderate it. That being said, many units very successfully use this venue to advertise and discuss rallies so in that aspect it does happen. But as for a larger cooperative participation... forget it.

[TWaugh]

Originally Posted by Buttercup

I think it is safe to say that WBCCI has zero interest in being part of these forums and a team player in what goes on here - the simple reason... They can not control or moderate it. That being said, many units very successfully use this venue to advertise and discuss rallies so in that aspect it does happen. But as for a larger cooperative participation... forget it.

Sorry, I did not mean to infer that the club would be the WBCCI participating on the AF but rather a new organization modeled on the portions of the WBBCI which do work along with aspects of the AF which are useful.

From Fred's original message:"Briefly, how would you structure the "club" to grow and prosper in today's world?"

I was simply suggesting a model for this "club".

Thanks,
Tom

[Buttercup]

Ah - of course! Got it - then it becomes an exercise of what works in WBCCI that could be adopted.

[LI Pets]

Originally Posted by Buttercup

Ah - of course! Got it - then it becomes an exercise of what works in WBCCI that could be adopted.

The one thing that works is the local units.

The thing that doesn't work in the International.

So perhaps the local units should secede from the WBCCI, then each local unit communicates on or through this forum.

I believe the local unit here in NY works great because of the people.

In conjunction with that I spend time here and have hooked up at several forum rallies.

best of both worlds.

-----

I wish I didn't pay $55 to Wbcci for the zero benefit I receive in return.

Knowing the ancients are spending $125,000 traveling around pisses me me off. That's about 40% of everyones dues.

[bob280]

One of the reasons for having international officers is to bring those airstreamers in other countries into the club and thus exchange ideas and methods. Another is for the international president to attend various national RV shows and RV manufacture meeting and present the members wants and needs to them and bring back news and info on what is coming down the road and report such to the members. min cost max benefit. the club website should be set up at the int'l level for many reasons - lowert cost and with more benefits.

As to cost / dues work is being done to get that down to $25 to $30 bucks. Also, liability insurance is cost effective at the international level but not at the local unit level. And if you think that insurance is not needed, think again.

Bob T

[Gene]

I stopped reading this thread almost immediately when I saw it was not: how would you structure a new club? It was another: how do we reform the WBCCI thread. But curiosity got the best of me and I see there are posts about a club that never mention the WBCCI.

The variety of ideas show there is potential for manynew clubs. And, maybe something that is never called a "club" because that name brings baggage with it, as does "structure".

A note of history—people who do not like what is going on (see: French Revolution), eventually find themselves with pretty much the same thing (see: Napoleon). It's not quite that simple, but will do. The tendency is to want a club that is the anti-WBCCI. No berets, no magazines, no flags, no, no, no. A lot of times the anti-club evolves into the same thing it replaces.

I believe true creativity is a rarity. Well, I agree that reinventing the wheel is silly, how about inventing something different? Some will reinvent, some will invent, but many will blend bringing in something they know and feel ok with.

For ex., just about everyone will want some form of democracy and potlucks. Both are structures. Everyone will want some kind of communication be it the Forum or Twitter or notes posted on a telephone pole in downtown Cincinnati. The devil may be in the details (The USSR said it was democratic) of course.

I did not create a structure for a new club because I meant what I said. Let us see what evolves. Since I'm full of cliches, let a thousand flowers bloom (not in the sense that Mao meant it, but literally). Now "let" implies someone is allowing blooming and that they must be flowers, so the presupposition is someone is in charge.

I suggest everyone is in charge and ideas will attract like minded people.

A variety of things will pop up over time. There will be some limits (although there will be workarounds). The Forum provides communication ability, but will may have trouble with the Airstream Orgy Club (the orgy may be an orgy of restoration, or what you see isn't always what you get), Marijuana Airstream Festival and Mass Murderers with Airstreams Group. Pretty hard to get around some structure.

I really don't know what will evolve and am hoping to see something really original, but will probably settle for a very loosely organized, decentralized bunch of Airstreamers will similar tastes. I will struggle with my desire to draft bylaws because I know how to do it. Maybe a rule should be: every club or group will be dissolved in 2 years (i.e., before "leaders", "organizers" and "bylaws writers" take over).

Several days ago we participated in a rally. There were 2 Airstreams and 4 people. We knew each of us would be in the same area at the same time. The cocktail hour went on and on. Great ideas were parsed and no decisions were made. The Forum provided the initial communication. A good time was had by all. Or: A couple of weeks ago we had dinner with two other Airstreamers we had never met in a city far from home. Again, the Forum provided the initial communications link. Another good time. Maybe it can be that simple.

Gene

[rollingbubel]

The forum should be the club. Maybe the dudes in charge could lobby campgrounds for reduced rates due to the size of the forum. Members interested in getting reduced rates could make a slightly larger contribution to the forum. Rally's of any variety could be organized through this web site. If you want to go to the AS Satan worshipers Rally in Hell Michigan or the Heavenly Bunch in Florida you are free to sign up and attend. No need for presidents, officers, or berets. Someone gets an idea for a rally and folks are free to attend. Forum members interested in staying with the WBCCI are more than welcome. Members that are not interested can go there separate ways. Maybe this sounds to easy. Perhaps one rule!!! Nobody sues anyone for any reason.

[Mikethefixit]

rollingbubel
What you suggest would be to easy. Nobody will ever go for it.
Bob= LI pets
IF that 125 K figure is true, it confirms my gut feeling and also the words of one Unit President when she said to me That their camping at BOZEMAN didn't cost them ANYTHING and they were there almost two weeks. She just kinda blurted that out without thinking.
I think the system of setting up rallys and attending those rallys, works good at least for me. I can see Forums rallys all over the country and choose what works for me. I can make my reservations and pay my own way and not have to pay for someone else. IT really works AMAZING and I get What I PAY FOR.

[hampstead38]

Originally Posted by bob280

One of the reasons for having international officers is to bring those airstreamers in other countries into the club and thus exchange ideas and methods. Another is for the international president to attend various national RV shows and RV manufacture meeting and present the members wants and needs to them and bring back news and info on what is coming down the road and report such to the members. min cost max benefit. the club website should be set up at the int'l level for many reasons - lowert cost and with more benefits.

As to cost / dues work is being done to get that down to $25 to $30 bucks. Also, liability insurance is cost effective at the international level but not at the local unit level. And if you think that insurance is not needed, think again.

Bob T

With all due respect, Bob, but you are talking about a better oxen yoke when we talking about diesel tow vehicles. It makes little sense to send people to other countries when we already have international communication happening right now. I've become acquainted with (and helped) folks from outside the U.S. through the Airforums.

As for RV manufacturers... the same principle applies. We have thousands of people on the Airforums who can do "recon." Having forum members everywhere makes this process local, and very inexpensive (read "free").

As for liability insurance... I simply disagree. Liability insurance can be easily acquired by any size of organization. A simple D&O policy isn't hard to acquire if there's some need for corporate/nonprofit board liability insurance. I serve on a regulatory commission as an unpaid member. We're responsible for the oversight of a 30,000 customer franchise cable television franchise agreement and a franchise agreement worth millions of dollars to local government. The nine-member body pays $1,538 per year for a "full meal deal" liability policy.

Is insurance necessary? Sure. Is it expensive? No. You could have a unpaid, "unreimbursed" governing body of a club with no bricks-and-mortar HQ for a nominal cost. At 6,000 members, you're talking about two-bits a head.

I'm sure you're a nice guy, Bob. I'm sure you honestly believe everything you've written... as do the Int'l officers who cash in on the buck-and-a-quarter in travel reimbursements. It's just that my irony meter is pegged when your first sentence is about "exchanging idea and methods" when the WBCCI appears more resistant to change than the Carthusian Order. There's nothing wrong with traveling to other countries and "Airstreaming." There's nothing wrong with staying abreast of evolving technologies... or hoping the Airstream mothership eventually uses them. The real question is: Who pays? Should rank-and-file club members underwrite the travel excursions of a select few?

This thread is about a new club... and if one evolves, I hope it will include a simple rule that any leaders may not benefit in any way from a leadership position within the club.

[gail]

Bravo! no one should benefit financially from the WBCII and that is a problem.
Also i have a caravan to Baja here on the forums and it is my free planning pay as you go. the one that was cancelled on WBCCI in the Blue Beret was over $2000 a person. NOw who is benefiting.

[Stefrobrts]

Everyone seems to be having so much fun working up the details of the new club, I still have not seen an answer to my question: Why do we NEED a club? What need is not being met in the current situation? What are potential members crying out for that the new club is going to provide which they cannot get anywhere else?

I still see no reason for another club.

[CanoeStream]

hamp and bob -- I don't actually see 47WeeWind's objective as a new club. It could be taken in that way -- and others. His post 53 definitely points to a clean page approach that the WBCCI could consider. Interesting thread... (and hamp's blog gets better every day )

[gail]

The reason for a not for profit club would be for people to find their way to caravans and ralliies.
The WBCII has too much overhead and for what purpose. Girls who work in an office to do what. With the internet it would be easy to have caravans and rallies posted here on airforums. The source for info would be a club.

[Stefrobrts]

Originally Posted by gail

The reason for a not for profit club would be for people to find their way to caravans and ralliies.
The WBCII has too much overhead and for what purpose. Girls who work in an office to do what. With the internet it would be easy to have caravans and rallies posted here on airforums. The source for info would be a club.

But that's exactly why clubs are dying out. We don't need to pay dues and organize overseers and all that stuff for organizing caravans and rallies. With the internet we have the ability to do that ourselves. It's not just Airstreams. I used to run a local Miata club back in the mid-90s in E WA. There was no other way to gather people up to get together for a run in the mountains. We put out a little newsletter and everyone had everyone else's phone number, and we'd get together and do our thing, and dues paid for postage and paper to print the newsletter so folks would know when the next run was so they could plan. But today, there would be no reason to go through all that trouble. Everyone is online. I could go over to Miata.net and put a call out for locals and tell them when to gather and we'd be off.

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by Stefrobrts

...Why do we NEED a club?...

because HUMANS need a tribe, sista!

we just got SO MUCH LUV 2 share...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbqND...ayer_embedded#

even iceT gots a blue beret.

think sharks/jets only online with no knives...

lots LESS blood2shed if youse club is n the cyber'hood....

solid!
2air'

[hampstead38]

If you don't see a need for another club, Stephanie, then why participate in the thread? Why not simply allow the people who see a potential need to discuss and explore the concept of what shape a new club might need?

I don't understand the "need" for red numbers on my coach... but I recognize that some people covet them. I don't understand the need for a blue beret... or honestly, a beret of any kind. When one has a melon of my Peanuts-esque proportions, the last thing one would want is to draw attention to it.

Airforums is a virtual watering hole. Some people want a real life watering hole. There's a deep and abiding difference, Stephanie between watching "Cheers" and having a real place where everyone knows your name. Even prototypical nonjoiners like me harbor a childlike fascination for decoder rings, secret handshakes and an official certificate suitable for framing.

Virtual connections feel real... but they are not. My wife and I spent the day with Brenda and her great kids. Reading about them on the Internet was not the same as actually hearing them laugh or seeing them smile. The Airforums is a great resource and wonderful medium of communication... but for some, it is not enough.

[Stefrobrts]

Originally Posted by hampstead38

If you don't see a need for another club, Stephanie, then why participate in the thread? Why not simply allow the people who see a potential need to discuss and explore the concept of what shape a new club might need?

Because I'm curious to see what a new club will encompass, and I don't think it will be successful until people define what it is the new club will do/offer that people cannot already do on their own with the resources that are available.

I see the need for a physical place to gather, that's why we have rallies. I've met lots of great people through the forums, and we've had a lot of great times rallying. But that all happened for free without any club structure necessary. I'm a member of a local dog training club because we get together and train together, and you can't do that virtually.

So I guess what I'm asking people to think about is what can a new club offer that is not already freely available? Because otherwise all you'll get is the people who like to join clubs, and the rest will still be sitting out saying 'well, what can you do for me?'

[Chief]

If one wants to see "my humble opinion" of what a new club would be......just come on down and join us for "Canopener 2010" in January. There should be approximately 50 Airstreams in attendance, and hopefully none will try and force 2Air into "neckedness" just because he isn't wearing a badge.

BTW Joe, thanks for the video......I recognize the 'hood from Mz. Garmin's Miss-directions (in at least three different cities).

Chief

[1963tradewin]

Speaking of clubs, which 1 do I need to join to get the red numbers on my unit? Thanks for the help.

[PeeWee]

When given an opportunity to be creative and constructive, the same old purveyors of cliches, and trite continue on.

Wee Wind truly has tried to find a light at the end of the tunnel, without turning back into the dark.