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Old 08-02-2018, 01:18 PM   #1
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Has anyone successfully hooked a Volcano grill to the LP port?

We have a new Volcano grill, which we bought for the versatility and compactness. It has a very good flame when running off of an LP tank, whether the 20# tank or the small Coleman portables. I created another assembly that removes the Volcano's own regulator so I can run the grill directly from the LP port on the trailer. However, that flame is very weak. While camping, and seeing the brats weren't being cooked properly, I switched to the portable tanks and suddenly got a very good flame!

I'm now thinking there is no solution. The regulator that came with the Volcano LP connection is rated to output 10psi. However, the Airstream uses a two stage regulator that outputs 11 inches of water at the LP port, or about 0.4 psi. I'm using the same orifice tube (I ordered a duplicate from Volcano), though there is a pressure difference of 25. Volcano doesn't offer a different one.

I'm asking if anyone has solved this issue, or has an idea. Right now, it looks Like I need to keep using external tanks. I searched the forums and found somebody from 2014 had a similar issue, but it wasn't clear it was ever resolved:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...ml#post1471628

Larry
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Old 08-02-2018, 01:29 PM   #2
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We ran our Volcano from the LP port all the time. Just used a straight hose, no regulators. Worked fine for us.
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Old 08-02-2018, 01:36 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tincampers View Post
We ran our Volcano from the LP port all the time. Just used a straight hose, no regulators. Worked fine for us.
Thanks! That's encouraging. I have no regulators either, but I do have the standard Volcano brass orifice tube shown below: https://volcanogrills.com/parts.html

It goes through the grill opening to screw into the burner assembly. Do you have this tube too? If not, what do you use instead?
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Old 08-02-2018, 01:44 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by larry9000 View Post
Thanks! That's encouraging. I have no regulators either, but I do have the standard Volcano brass orifice tube shown below: https://volcanogrills.com/parts.html

It goes through the grill opening to screw into the burner assembly. Do you have this tube too? If not, what do you use instead?
I used the same tube. The only change I made was to remove the regulator.
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Old 08-02-2018, 02:57 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Tincampers View Post
I used the same tube. The only change I made was to remove the regulator.
Well, dang. I'm almost out of ideas. I have an entirely separate assembly, but it is the same design:

1/4" QC to hose -> Control Valve -> hose -> orifice tube.

The control valve is a simple 90 degree ON-OFF which can be adjusted in between for adjusting the flame. Maybe there is a restriction there. I may search for the same control valve that came with the Volcano and see if that makes a difference. I don't want to cannibalize the current one that is on the assembly for connecting a LP tank directly, since right now that is the only way I'm confident that I can get the Volcano to work.
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Old 08-02-2018, 03:02 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by larry9000 View Post
Well, dang. I'm almost out of ideas. I have an entirely separate assembly, but it is the same design:

1/4" QC to hose -> Control Valve -> hose -> orifice tube.

The control valve is a simple 90 degree ON-OFF which can be adjusted in between for adjusting the flame. Maybe there is a restriction there. I may search for the same control valve that came with the Volcano and see if that makes a difference. I don't want to cannibalize the current one that is on the assembly for connecting a LP tank directly, since right now that is the only way I'm confident that I can get the Volcano to work.
Can you try removing the ON-OFF valve temporarily to see if that is the problem? I had one on mine as well.
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Old 08-02-2018, 04:02 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Tincampers View Post
Can you try removing the ON-OFF valve temporarily to see if that is the problem? I had one on mine as well.
You had a separate ON/OFF valve in addition to the control valve just after the regulator? Did the ON/OFF valve cause any problems?

Since I don't have the fitting to bypass the control valve when I remove it, I may just wait until I receive the replacement control valve (just ordered it), which appears the same as the valve that came with the Volcano.

I'm about to move the trailer to nearby storage, so I may not get to this until end of next week.
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Old 08-02-2018, 04:25 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by larry9000 View Post
You had a separate ON/OFF valve in addition to the control valve just after the regulator? Did the ON/OFF valve cause any problems?

Since I don't have the fitting to bypass the control valve when I remove it, I may just wait until I receive the replacement control valve (just ordered it), which appears the same as the valve that came with the Volcano.

I'm about to move the trailer to nearby storage, so I may not get to this until end of next week.
Yes, I wanted to have a way to shut off the propane close to the stove. It didn’t affect the flow at all.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:46 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry9000 View Post
We have a new Volcano grill, which we bought for the versatility and compactness. It has a very good flame when running off of an LP tank, whether the 20# tank or the small Coleman portables. I created another assembly that removes the Volcano's own regulator so I can run the grill directly from the LP port on the trailer. However, that flame is very weak. While camping, and seeing the brats weren't being cooked properly, I switched to the portable tanks and suddenly got a very good flame!

I'm now thinking there is no solution. The regulator that came with the Volcano LP connection is rated to output 10psi. However, the Airstream uses a two stage regulator that outputs 11 inches of water at the LP port, or about 0.4 psi. I'm using the same orifice tube (I ordered a duplicate from Volcano), though there is a pressure difference of 25. Volcano doesn't offer a different one.

I'm asking if anyone has solved this issue, or has an idea. Right now, it looks Like I need to keep using external tanks. I searched the forums and found somebody from 2014 had a similar issue, but it wasn't clear it was ever resolved:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f240...ml#post1471628

Larry
Turn the pressure up on the AS' propane regulator. Mine has a small screw you turn to adjust the pressure.
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Old 08-03-2018, 11:18 AM   #10
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FYI here are all the mentions of "Volcano grill" in this site, in case your search missed some:

https://www.google.com/search?q=Volc...com&gws_rd=ssl

Good luck,

Peter


FYI/FWIW
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:21 PM   #11
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We have used the Volcano 3 for many years, but give little credence to the LPG feature because of its awkwardness and poor functioning. I would rather just stay with refillable one- pound canisters than do a conversion of basic parts. Here is a good article offering worthwhile advise http://letstalksurvival.com/enhancing-volcano-grill/.
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Old 08-04-2018, 08:21 AM   #12
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We have used the Volcano 3 for many years, but give little credence to the LPG feature because of its awkwardness and poor functioning. I would rather just stay with refillable one- pound canisters than do a conversion of basic parts. Here is a good article offering worthwhile advise http://letstalksurvival.com/enhancing-volcano-grill/.
Thanks Sovereign85. That is indeed a very interesting article. What caught my attention was this statement "There are literally hundreds of regulators available with a wide-variety of hose lengths and working pressures, including some that are adjustable. At that point, it is simply a matter of matching the diameter of the orifice with the working pressure to reach the desired BTU output."

I'm leaning towards the theory that if my AS LP port is 0.4PSI, and the Volcano expects 10 PSI, that the flame will always be cooler running off of the port. (This doesn't explain how Tincampers got this to work, however). Anyway, perhaps all I have to do is figure out what size orifice is needed (the article seemed to indicate that this is something you could look up), and drill the orifice tube to that diameter.
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Old 08-04-2018, 08:52 AM   #13
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So, here's a tidbit. Volcano orifice is 0.021" in diameter (Drill 75) according to the above article. I looked up the output for 11 WC of pressure, and got 3,080 BTUs (well under the 19,500 BTU rating).

http://www.joppaglass.com/burner/lowp_chrt.html

For 19,500 BTU the above table shows an orifice size between 0.161 and 0.172. That's a big hole, but may be needed due to the much lower pressure. The area is 65 times larger, but the pressure is 25 times less. If I do this, I may check around with other charts to not oversize the hole, and start small.
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Old 08-04-2018, 11:21 AM   #14
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Here's another chart for orifice size for 11" WC LP (far right column). It says I am currently restricted to 3,081 BTU with the #75 drill hole. To get to 20K, I would need a #54 hole, about 0.055" in diameter.

http://andersonforrester.com/conversion-chart/

Seriously thinking of drilling a larger hole and watching the result.
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Old 08-05-2018, 12:45 PM   #15
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I spoke directly to a volcano rep and was told that there is no safe way currently to run the grill by hooking up to the airstream exterior port.
He also stated they may have a work around for it in the future.
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Old 08-05-2018, 05:11 PM   #16
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I spoke directly to a volcano rep and was told that there is no safe way currently to run the grill by hooking up to the airstream exterior port.
He also stated they may have a work around for it in the future.
Thanks Milo, that's encouraging. I wonder if they are thinking of offering a different orifice or possibly a completely different burner.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:35 AM   #17
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the gentleman I spoke with did not elaborate.
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:49 PM   #18
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I drilled out the orifice to see if I could get the Volcano to heat properly from the LP port on my Airstream. I started with 1mm, then did 1.1 and then 1.2mm. As it turns out, the flame definitely got larger and hotter, but still not as hot as when running the factory setup from a propane canister. The flame also was very yellow, an indicator that it is not getting enough air.

My conclusion is that the burner itself is not made for low pressure propane. Besides the heat difference, the shape of the flames are different too. Using the factory setup with a 10 PSI regulator, the gas shot out of the burner holes, combusting a little bit away from the exit holes as a nice hot blue flame. Not so with the LP port and the larger orifice. The flame starts right at the burner hole and is perhaps blue for 1/2", and then turns into a large yellow flame.

If I really want a Volcano grill to operate from the LP port, I believe I need to switch burners to a burner designed for low pressure.
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:52 PM   #19
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I drilled out the orifice to see if I could get the Volcano to heat properly from the LP port on my Airstream. I started with 1mm, then did 1.1 and then 1.2mm. As it turns out, the flame definitely got larger and hotter, but still not as hot as when running the factory setup from a propane canister. The flame also was very yellow, an indicator that it is not getting enough air.

My conclusion is that the burner itself is not made for low pressure propane. Besides the heat difference, the shape of the flames are different too. Using the factory setup with a 10 PSI regulator, the gas shot out of the burner holes, combusting a little bit away from the exit holes as a nice hot blue flame. Not so with the LP port and the larger orifice. The flame starts right at the burner hole and is perhaps blue for 1/2", and then turns into a large yellow flame.

If I really want a Volcano grill to operate from the LP port, I believe I need to switch burners to a burner designed for low pressure.
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Old 08-15-2018, 03:38 PM   #20
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Found related video from RV Geeks

https://youtu.be/Kbp4LiOjXbI
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