Gauging amount of propane in tanks

[xo1rider]

I'm in the "open both tanks and wait for the change over camp" I just have one question.

Has anyone parked the trailer close enough to a propane filling station to fill the empty tank without taking it out? Or is that o.k. and safe to do that way?

[clancy_boy]

Originally Posted by xo1rider

I'm in the "open both tanks and wait for the change over camp" I just have one question.

Has anyone parked the trailer close enough to a propane filling station to fill the empty tank without taking it out? Or is that o.k. and safe to do that way?

They fill motor homes that way, their tanks are generally not removeable and much bigger than the smaller travel trailers. Just haveing some guy with that big brass refill connector and hose swinging around my Airstream would give me the willies.

[overlander64]

Greetings xo1rider!

Originally Posted by xo1rider

I'm in the "open both tanks and wait for the change over camp" I just have one question.

Has anyone parked the trailer close enough to a propane filling station to fill the empty tank without taking it out? Or is that o.k. and safe to do that way?

Prior to converting to the new OPD valves on my Worthington tanks, I would pull my trailer to the refill station. While I could pull up to the refill station, the attendant always removed the tanks and refilled them by weight -- I disliked trying to get the metal fittings on the old valves undone so let the attendant provide full-service refill (usually about $2.00 more than just taking the tanks in) . . . . the modern fittings that don't require wrenches make the tank refill process so very much easier . . . I now transport my tanks in the back of the tow vehicle to the refill station.

Kevin

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by xo1rider

I'm in the "open both tanks and wait for the change over camp" I just have one question.

Has anyone parked the trailer close enough to a propane filling station to fill the empty tank without taking it out? Or is that o.k. and safe to do that way?

They're supposed to weigh the tanks, which they can't do without removing them.

[azflycaster]

My propane dealer does not weigh the tanks, they have a meter on the unit which measures the number of gallons used.

Since the tank connection normally faces the trailer, I do not think the adapter on the dealers filler will fit without removing or spinning the tank. My empty tank is only 16 pounds and 46 pounds full.

[PhilipKS]

Don't rely on the meter! If your tank is not completly empty, you run the risk of over filling. Overfilling might not be apparent at the station, but gas in the bottle will expand on a sunny day, causing your Pressure Relief valve to do its job. If the day is windy, it might not be noticed. If the weather is calm, there will be a noticably smelly cloud which will alarm the neighbors, at least, if you don't catch it first. Could become explosive!

Your friendly tank station attendent should weigh the bottle to confirm it is filled. The meter you can pay by, but not weigh by.

Happy (and safe) streaming! Philip

[Alumaholic]

Not my area of expertise, to be sure; but the propane pros weigh and meter to ensure you get a full refill and not a partial refill.
I agree with Clancy Boy, I will glady disconnect an empty tank and lug it to and from the refill point a few yards away from my TT and my TV.

[eubank]

Originally Posted by Alumaholic

Not my area of expertise, to be sure; but the propane pros weigh and meter to ensure you get a full refill and not a partial refill. ...

Actually, the issue is not whether they fill it full, but rather whether they overfill it. An overfilled cylinder is one dangerous thing to have around.

The National Fire Protection Assn (see NPFA 58) specifies two safe methods to prevent overfill of DOT-approved cylinders (like yours): Filling by volume or filling by weight.

Filling by volume involves opening the small valve on the side of the main valve, and filling until propane spews out. (Below the valve is a small pipe that reaches down to the 80% level. This pipe leads to the small twist valve.)

Filling by weight involves (obviously) measuring about by weight. Most of our RVs have 30-lb cylinders, so the scale is set to account for the weight of the propane plus the weight of the cylinder itself plus the weight of any machinery necessary for filling (e.g., the hose).

Some states don't like filling by volume (generally for environmental reasons), specifying filling by weight instead. Some others leave the choice up to the individual filler. On the other hand, some states don't have any regulations at all concerning propane filling.


Lynn

[dznf0g]

Isn't this all a moot point since the ACME fitting tanks have a float which shuts off the ability to fill above 80% of the volume of the tank?

[eubank]

Actually, not. The so-called OPD valves are there to prevent overfill, but they are mechanical devices, subject to possible failure and not regularly inspected. The reason why NFPA first required them was to attempt to prevent overfilling by home fillers. Evidently, the requirement has reduced some of the accidents. And even while requiring the OPD on cylinders, NFPA still requires fillers to use either volume or weight. (Note that many states regularly inspect both filling machinery and scales.)

Lynn

Originally Posted by dznf0g

Isn't this all a moot point since the ACME fitting tanks have a float which shuts off the ability to fill above 80% of the volume of the tank?

[clancy_boy]

And all of this can become a non-issue if we all went to those polymer semi-transparent tanks and could see the level visually. I just don't like the look but they would be covered by the tank cover.

[Frank's Trailer Works]

What is a tank cover?
Can they be polished?

[Mikethefixit]

I take my tanks to my Gas Dealer with whom I have an account for OX/Actene and those tanks. They weigh and meter what is put into my tanks.

[Skater]

Originally Posted by xo1rider

I'm in the "open both tanks and wait for the change over camp" I just have one question.

Has anyone parked the trailer close enough to a propane filling station to fill the empty tank without taking it out? Or is that o.k. and safe to do that way?

You probably could, but I'm not sure why you'd want to.

As a former B190 motorhome owner, I can say that one of the things I hated the most about the motorhome was having to drive the camper to get the propane tank filled every time. Believe it or not, I now actually enjoy driving the truck (and JUST the truck) to the gas station to get a propane tank filled. It's a minor thing, I know, but it always really bugged me with the motorhome. I grew up with travel trailers, which is probably why I feel this way.

[Alumaholic]

Originally Posted by 62overlander

What is a tank cover?
Can they be polished?

AS the name implies, a tank cover is a highly polished, clear-coated cover that covers both tanks. Tank valves are accessed via a piano-hinged, painted cover, as shown in the picture.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by eubank

Actually, not. The so-called OPD valves are there to prevent overfill, but they are mechanical devices, subject to possible failure and not regularly inspected. The reason why NFPA first required them was to attempt to prevent overfilling by home fillers. Evidently, the requirement has reduced some of the accidents. And even while requiring the OPD on cylinders, NFPA still requires fillers to use either volume or weight. (Note that many states regularly inspect both filling machinery and scales.)

Lynn

The OPD is supposed to be a safety device, not an operating control. It's still possible to overfill a tank with one, especially when gravity filling them.

I had always understood the reason for the OPD valves to be to address a very specific accident scenario:

1) Homeowner with BBQ grill takes 20# tank to store to have it filled
2) Insufficiently trained, apathetic, minimum wage individual overfills tank
3) Homeowner puts tank in trunk of sedan and drives home in the hot sun
4) Heat of trunk leads propane to expand and vent through relief valve
5) Sedan explodes from accumulation of propane in the trunk

RVs were never really part of the problem, because RV propane tanks are usually mounted on the tongue in a bottomless enclosure, or at worst in a well-ventilated locker. It's hard to imagine enough gas accumulating to reach the lower explosive limit unless the RV is parked indoors or maybe in a depression with no wind, and the accident history isn't there.

[clancy_boy]

Originally Posted by Alumaholic

AS the name implies, a tank cover is a highly polished, clear-coated cover that covers both tanks. Tank valves are accessed via a piano-hinged, painted cover, as shown in the picture.

Ummmm, Kevin - I think Frank was taking a shot at me but I thank you for the picture and description in case he has taken off his aluminum helmet and is being bombarded by gamma rays.

[perryg114]

If the tank is upright when you fill it then you can't overfill it with an OPD valve. It has a float on it that shuts the valve off. Turn it upside down and it does not work. I really don't see the need for a OPD valve in this case. I would have to downgrade my tanks to put that stupid valve on. Gas companies know how to fill them but the law says not to fill a non OPD tank. It is government messing in our business.

Perry

[eubank]

In fact, it's 50 different laws as this is a state matter, not a federal one. Actually, it's fewer than 50 since some states don't have any laws in this regard. And at least one state that I know of did not adopt the NFPA recommendation that all DOT cylinders would have to have OPDs.

Lynn

Originally Posted by perryg114

If the tank is upright when you fill it then you can't overfill it with an OPD valve. It has a float on it that shuts the valve off. Turn it upside down and it does not work. I really don't see the need for a OPD valve in this case. I would have to downgrade my tanks to put that stupid valve on. Gas companies know how to fill them but the law says not to fill a non OPD tank. It is government messing in our business.

Perry

[Frank's Trailer Works]

Originally Posted by Alumaholic

AS the name implies, a tank cover is a highly polished, clear-coated cover that covers both tanks. Tank valves are accessed via a piano-hinged, painted cover, as shown in the picture.

Vintage trailers do not have tank covers. Many of us sport polished aluminum tanks that our wives can apply lip stick by. New trailers hide their tanks behind modern Airstream aluminum. My post was a pun directed at Clancy Boy. He knows I am a vintage snob and am very proud of it. I know exactly what a tank cover is and that it indeed cannot be polished.