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Old 05-10-2011, 02:41 PM   #869
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I for one will never go to an International unless there is wes,and I mean 30 amp. Only way would be if it was held where daytime temps are cool enough to survive. My AS is an rv, not an aluminum tent. jim
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Old 05-10-2011, 02:43 PM   #870
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While gas prices are not the topic, it sure is more interesting than the usual fare here. The Cato Institute prices do not conform to other sources. Adjusted for inflation the previous high was $3.53 in March, 1981. That's from the Dept. of Energy.

And for the following years (actual prices from Dept of Energy), adjusted for inflation:

1935: $2.77
1950: $2.50
1955: $2.42
1962: $2.29
1972: $1.92
1981: $3.22

Gas prices around $2.25 in today's dollars would seem to be average and prices today are well more than 50% higher.

Another measure of prices is what percent of annual income goes to annual fuel usage. I'll let someone else figure that out.

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Old 05-10-2011, 03:04 PM   #871
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The price of gas vs. income is less “now” than it was in 1955, 1972, 1981 (adjusted for inflation)
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=6440

...snip...

So when people try to use this argument for 1M1V, Smaller Region International, etc… is a bunch of nothing because if you really look at the FACTS, it’s not true!
Here are some facts. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics of the United States Government, the price of gas at $.36 in 1972 is equal to $1.92 today adjusted for inflation.

FACT: Yesterday gas cost me $3.76/gallon and that was almost the cheapest price in town. That is almost double what it was in 1972, adjusted for inflation. In most places it is $3.90 to over $4.00 for regular. Yet my 2011 income is less than 50% of my 1973 income adjusted for inflation.

FACT: Gas prices are making it impossible for me to travel, and I suspect hard for others as well.

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Old 05-10-2011, 03:22 PM   #872
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Please disregard my earlier post, I went temporarily insane in this Ga heat. jim
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Old 05-10-2011, 03:29 PM   #873
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My next post will be off to the CATO Institute to let them know they don't have their facts straight based on responses here on the forums and if people had been listening to them (CATO)instead of other sources we might get 800 WBCCI members at the International Rally this year.

Off with their heads!

Maybe we can get the Delegates to vote on which sources of information should be used to base the facts about the cost of gas?

That would be the most worthwhile thing they could vote on this year.
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Old 05-10-2011, 04:14 PM   #874
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we might get 800 WBCCI members at the International Rally this year.

Off with their heads!

.
Actually we did get 871 in Bozeman in 2008. Being more or less in the middle of nowhere and diesel looking cheap at $4.50 when I hit Montana That pretty well shoots the fuel cost is keeping them home idea. Madison didn't do a lot better in 2009 and it was near major population centers and fuel was $2.00 cheaper. The same can be said of Du Quoin. It will be interesting to see what the numbers are .
It is only 351 miles from here and instead I will put on over 2 k round trip going on a caravan.
We sure have wandered off topic
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Old 05-10-2011, 05:32 PM   #875
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We sure have wandered off topic
Well yes and no Rick. WBCCI has had the same discussion of International rally participation being down and what the causes have been. I think I read it in a Blue Beret as well, that gas prices were blamed on low attendance. However an event like the WB Birthday Bash and Alumapalooza draws Airstreamers from all oer the country eager to attend. Gas prices may contribute somewhat to a decline, certainly higher rally and dues fees without increased member value may also play a part, but most importantly, in my opinion, is that leadership never once questioned themselves or their planning and usual MO as a reason for falling attendance. While it is pertinent to ask why is the club shrinking and why are the Internationals getting smaller and smaller, it would be wiser to point to factors other than only gas prices and more to the tune of accountability and lack of success on the part of planners.

I do agree with Paul here though that using gas prices to support dissolving the delegate system is mostly a convenient argument rather than a winning one for singularly supporting that particular change in the revision. I also don't think it has to be strictly a matter of electronic communications verses a deliberative body but that both could also be incorporated to benefit the club. I also think we can have 1M1V and retain delegates. Discussion seems to be more of a twist and zing than a comprehensive comparison in recent posts. I am anxious to see how the delegates handle the situation at the upcoming International.

Rick you have a point that delegates do not always follow the units' recommendations in the past. It happened to us on the name change issue so I share your frustration in that regard. But I wonder if it wasn't the system of voting without returning to the unit for final authority that could rectify that. It seems leadership can use their position to influence rather than guide members through the process and it has happened at many a meeting I have heard.
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Old 05-10-2011, 05:38 PM   #876
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While gas prices, lower incomes and irritating leaders probably have an effect, fewer members = fewer attendees.

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Old 05-10-2011, 06:34 PM   #877
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There are units that manipulate the vote and the process.

Ask yourself this, can a unit with 50, 100 or 300 members on a hot button issue as this Revision have a unanimous vote?


.
News Flash

This change is a "hot button" for 5% of the club, maybe. They are in it for camping and caravans!

I can assure you we had a unanimous vote and an open discussion. People often agree when they have a chance to discuss issues.

So we should offer electronic communication / voting for any delegates who cannot attend the meeting. Cheaper, easier change to sell.

We can keep all the important changes proposed, like eliminating a large portion of the IBT. We can also incorporate the second proposed amendment into this change. That means NO recommended slate. All qualified (members in good standing) candidates presented to the members. Also, give MALs all rights. They can sign over their proxy to a delegate selected to represent MALs, or vote in advance, with their votes counted with the unit votes (cast by delegates).
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Old 05-10-2011, 07:14 PM   #878
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You can evaluate the popularity of the International by comparing the percentage of current members who attend. The percentage has been down recently. It usually runs between 10% and 15%. There are a lot of variables each year effecting the popularity of a particular International. The recent three year planning of the IBT for the Internationals tried to have the rally close to the center of gravity of the member distribution, in hopes of attracting more to come, even if the gas became a little high that year.
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Old 05-10-2011, 09:30 PM   #879
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I don't know how the other units are progressing but I haven't noticed any discussion or voting of my Nova unit other than the delegate giving his personal position for acceptance as written. Any posts I have made have usually gone unanswered and there appears to be little interest or internet activity on the NOVA forum. I have no idea if there is to be a meeting ahead or not before the International. I think there was one e-mail early on.I am unclear about any results. It really can not be determined at this point the involvement of accepting, rejecting or altering amendments for the new constitution by the various units and the next meeting will surely be a unique experience. I wish I could attend.

I think unit presidents keeping in touch electronically could accomplish much together as a group and be a great lead for members and involvement. That there is no centralization of communication as in a WBCCI members forum amounts to making every voice single against the Executive Committee often leading unchallenged support of the majority of IBT. At best as we have seen many inquiries and challenges and e-mails go fallow and unacknowleged in the club.
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Old 05-11-2011, 05:32 AM   #880
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Originally Posted by dwightdi
You can evaluate the popularity of the International by comparing the percentage of current members who attend. The percentage has been down recently. It usually runs between 10% and 15%. There are a lot of variables each year effecting the popularity of a particular International. The recent three year planning of the IBT for the Internationals tried to have the rally close to the center of gravity of the member distribution, in hopes of attracting more to come, even if the gas became a little high that year.
In our unit, the level of interest is much higher when the destination offers more. Bozeman, Gillette, and even Madison offered new adventures before and after the rally. DuQuoin has not generated much interest.
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Old 05-11-2011, 03:15 PM   #881
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In our unit, the level of interest is much higher when the destination offers more. Bozeman, Gillette, and even Madison offered new adventures before and after the rally. DuQuoin has not generated much interest.
I agree its all about the destination now, and WY, southern IL, MO don't offer me much. Add the cost of the Rally when I don't really attend any entertainment and I have seen most of the seminars and there is not much of a draw for me anymore. We have attended 10 Internationals starting with Dayton and just can't justify the cost v. the location.

Also who wants to sit in a meeting and listen to this boring useless discussions about changing the Constitution? Me I'm going to spend my vacation at Alumapalooza, there is value there!
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Old 05-11-2011, 04:30 PM   #882
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I look forward to meeting you at Alumapalooza!
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