Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 03-25-2011, 02:33 PM   #435
Rivet Master
 
mbmbstreamer's Avatar
 
2006 25' Safari SS SE
1969 27' Overlander
Martinez , Georgia
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 631
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested
One quick question. Is it possible for the majority of delegates to accept a revised constitution and the IBT or EC or parliamentarian dismiss or delay its acceptance? I just don't want anyone to get too worked up and then be disappointed at the alter.
A simple majority of the delegates can "perfect" (revise) the proposed change. It requires 2/3 of the membership (voted by the delegates) to approve.

They are the final authority.
__________________

__________________
Matt
WBCCI # 3518
TAC# GA-6
mbmbstreamer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 02:41 PM   #436
Site Team
 
azflycaster's Avatar
 
1975 25' Tradewind
Dewey , Arizona
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 12,127
Images: 62
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
It also seems to take away the process by which Forrest's amendment is traveling to circumvent the IBT to pass an amendment with member support only (that is if the EC would play and be honor bound by the present books) and his particular amendment would give delegates the power to review IBT decisions, correct?
That is correct.

Forrest's amendment would give the delegates the ability to nullify changes made by the IBT to the bylaws.
__________________

__________________

Richard

Wally Byam Airstream Club 7513
azflycaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 02:53 PM   #437
Rivet Master
 
wheel interested's Avatar
 
2007 23' International CCD
Lapeer , Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,039
Don S.'s Recommendation, pg 2, 2b

Has the current International President already invalidated the results of the committee by breaching the current by-laws? Could this be used at the International and ruled to dismiss the new constitution? At any rate is anyone nearing trepidation about the business conducted by the current IP, in the past with breached agreements that were called by Don S. out of order and the IP conceded and doubledback and hereto in the present with Don S. calling the misstep will the IP not doubleback again, or perhaps in the very near future? There you go 87 MH. Your answer about opposition in the committee(s) Still reading...

B. It is to be noted that instead of a "blue ribbon" committee of knowledgeable and experienced members from a cross section of our organization to develop a new Constitution that meets the Ohio Code and the wishes and desires of our entire membership, the committee who developed this document represented primarily only a small segment of the interests of our membership. In fact, since there were no members of the Constitution and Bylaws Committee on this committee, it was in violation of Bylaws Article III, Section 8, and Robertís Rules of Order (10th edition, page 474, lines 28 through 30) from the beginning: "A special committee may not be appointed to perform a task that falls within the assigned function of an existing standing committee". This task was not an emergency requiring minimum time and bypassing the wishes and input of the entire membership. This violation was reported at the July 5, 2010 IBT Meeting when the forming committee for this new Constitution was originated, but was not heeded.
__________________
Caroljb



photography
wheel interested is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 03:02 PM   #438
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
It was ruled upon.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 03:12 PM   #439
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by azflycaster View Post
The caucus does not replace the delegates meeting. In fact the term caucus IMO is a bad choice of words. It it a member discussion only as I read it.

With the elimination of the delegates meeting, two things are eliminated. The ability to amend a motion and the ability to have a candidate from the floor. These would be replaced by the "direct voting" provision.
I think you may want to take a look at that part again please in re: the originator.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 03:14 PM   #440
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbmbstreamer View Post
A simple majority of the delegates can "perfect" (revise) the proposed change. It requires 2/3 of the membership (voted by the delegates) to approve.

They are the final authority.
It would take effect immediately on the spot
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 06:44 PM   #441
Rivet Master
 
RickDavis's Avatar

 
1961 24' Tradewind
1969 29' Ambassador
1970 21' Globetrotter
Jamestown , Tennessee
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,781
Just skimmed through this document quickly, but 2 items caught my attention.

Article VI section 3 does NOT appear to eliminate the MAL surcharge.
While I believe unit membership should be encouraged, I don't believe there should be a penalty for choosing not to belong to a unit


Article XIV sect 2 and 3.

These appear to give the nominating committee both the power to decide who can run and to rank them according to their feelings on their qualification

I believe anyone who is a member should have the right to run, It is up to the candidate to convince us of his qualifications and experience in his campaign for office.
Under no circumstances should the committee be allowed to "grade" them

I am sure there are other things too, but these are the ones I feel strongly about5 at this point
__________________
Rick Davis 1602 K8DOC
61 tradewind, plus a few others
13 Ram 2500 TD
99 Dodge TD 577K miles

RickDavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 07:40 PM   #442
Rivet Master
 
wheel interested's Avatar
 
2007 23' International CCD
Lapeer , Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,039
Don S.'s Recommendations Conclusion

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowieE View Post
All that read this have to remember that Don Schaffer has a personnel addenda that does not always reflect the wishes of the membership and has presented this recommendation without the record of the committees vote on this. I would look upon this so called recommendation of the Constitution Committee with greater respect if it were presented over the signatures of the complete committee.


As Delegates to the 2011 Annual Delegateís Meeting you will probably receive a large amount of electronic and possible mail concerning whether or not to adopt this new Constitution. It is a HUGE decision that you have and it is extremely important in the direction WBCCI will take. I can only recommend that you consider all the input you receive and evaluate it in the light of what you consider to be the best for our Club. Be very careful of opinions from outside of your Unit except for the recommendations of your Region Officers. Stick to the facts. If the pattern of the last six (6) years is again put into place, you will receive many negative comments from outside your Unit concerning the Club organization and personalities will likewise pictured in a negative vain. These are certainly not in line with the present Code of Ethics as it will be an effort to cloud the facts. We now have a Constitution that guarantees majority rule and the proposed one may very well remove that guarantee! Again, it is a decision that will most definitely have a huge effect on the Club for years and I urge you to carefully consider the impact that your choices will have on our future. And PLEASE be sure that your voice is heard and your vote is counted at this meeting.
Very respectfully submitted,
Don Shafer,

Except for the middle paranoid hysteria inducing warnings about being careful of others, which come off sounding rather snarky to me, I thought the recommendations and clarifications were drawn well and very insightful. I would agree on more than a few of the points Don S. illustrated. What is a shame is that the leadship forum was not utilized and was chosen to be closed down when we as members could have been having the benefit of excellent discertation and mentoring such as Don Shafer has shown to be well within his auspices and capacity to give. Think of what could have culminated had we built a system of change together. And yet for some reason there has to be a channel of command and more than one form of dues to be paid before one can approach the high places unfortunately. I found the recommendations very informative and an amazingly interesting read. I hope all of you take the time to go over it in its entirety. But what I don't understand is why instead of helping membership work towards their goals, consultation is withheld and a halt put to the works in the final hour. All this time waiting could have been used trying to refine and find a suitable path to make the desired changes. This appears to be the usual method of operation and limiter in orders of new business between the IBT/EC and members trying to further their initiatives if unsupported by the leadership.
__________________
Caroljb



photography
wheel interested is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 08:45 PM   #443
Site Team
 
azflycaster's Avatar
 
1975 25' Tradewind
Dewey , Arizona
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 12,127
Images: 62
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forrest View Post
Just for easier reading, here is the Revision Committee's Constitution as it might be if it were adopted without being amended or revised. This is based on an earlier copy, but LI Pets says that it has not been changed. So, I believe it to be accurate.
There are several differences between the two documents.
__________________

Richard

Wally Byam Airstream Club 7513
azflycaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 09:08 PM   #444
Rivet Master
 
rideair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,223
I never thought I'd see the day when I agree with Don S. on a subject.

When I started reading the "Constitution Re-Write" and saw "the Airstream RV Association" in Sec.1, I knew it would be down hill from there and it was. I thank all those that worked hard on it, put in the time and tried the best they could, but I think Don S. is spot on almost with every comment made about the new Constitution. "TOO MUCH, TOO BIG, NO INPUT, NO TIME". I did find it interesting that he even pointed out the very committee that was formed to write this document was in "violation" of our current By-Laws!

This thing has problems, everyone knew that it would and there were hopes that small changes could be made at the delegates meeting to make it work. In it's current state, there's just not enough to work with and by the time all the changes were made you still would end up with something that needed to be fixed.

Plus add to that, this new Constitution does nothing to fix the "real" problems with the club. If you really want to fix the club, past the motion from the Denver Unit which will give more control over the "By-Laws" to the general membership, that's were the real meat of the problem is located.

Don S.if you are reading, "HIGH-FIVE", you got it right this time!

For once, I hope they listen to old Don S. and vote this thing down.
__________________
Paul Waddell
rideair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 09:26 PM   #445
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
The CBL committee by Don Shafer has taken it upon himself to release not only his report but an unofficial copy of the constitution to all region presidents circumventing the Executive Committee and established process.

The release of the proposed revision should have been under the authorization of the IP after HQ mailed an official package of documents to the region pres.

It would appear that Mr. Shafer believes he is running WBCCI.
Moreover, it speaks volumes about the tone of the CBL report replete with gross miss statements of fact, RONR & opinions.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 09:34 PM   #446
Rivet Master
 
wheel interested's Avatar
 
2007 23' International CCD
Lapeer , Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,039
Do the actual copies differ Bob or is it the early release that you are finding a source of contention? What inaccuracies do you find in his recommendation? Of course he may not agree but has he misrepresented any information? Can you be specific? Will the others on the revision committee be making any statements? And do you believe the IP and Don S. have worked independently of one another in regard to the new constitution? What do we need to know to best make our way through contradictory information?
__________________
Caroljb



photography
wheel interested is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 09:45 PM   #447
Rivet Master
 
Tom Nugler's Avatar

 
1972 25' Tradewind
Currently Looking...
McHenry County , Illinois
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,129
Images: 5
Thanks posting this document and to every one for all the comments, concerns and critiques over the last few months. How this will play out will be quit interesting.
I'll attempt to digest this on the 2 hour drive to our Unit Luncheon tomorrow.
I wonder how many there have been paying attention to the ongoing drama?

Tom
__________________
AirForums # 2806
WBCCI / VAC # 6411
TAC IL-11

Not All Who Wander Are Lost.

Avid supporter of trailing edge technology.
Tom Nugler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2011, 09:47 PM   #448
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested View Post
Do the actual copies differ Bob or is it the early release that you are finding a source of contention? What inaccuracies do you find in his recommendation?
Too many, perhaps most
Quote:
Of course he may not agree but has he misrepresented any information?
absolutely

Quote:
Can you be specific?
See below

Quote:
Will the others on the revision committee be making any statements?
I seriously doubt it.

Quote:
And do you believe the IP and Don S. have worked independently of one another in regard to the new constitution?
Neither worked on it, if you mean did they work on the CBL report, no

Quote:
What do we need to know to best make our way through contradictory information?
Read Kerry's guide, email the Revision committee's new email where questions will be answered by several of us developing an FAQ.

Certain committee members will take phone calls.

Sure the report can be picked apart line by line but to what end.

The naysayers will hang on every word including those who complained about his thinking in the past.

Most should see the bias of an individual that was not included in a task.

The committee will rely on the facts and not get into a debate about the CBL opinion.
__________________

__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
constitution, wbcci


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:40 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.