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Old 03-01-2011, 05:17 PM   #253
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I had one knowledgeable person estimate 2 days for the delegates meeting. Sounds about right. Hope they budgeted for extra coffee!
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Old 03-01-2011, 05:47 PM   #254
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Bob,
So there will be argument for and against the proposed revision? Who will be writing the pro and the con? Two different people, I hope.

Bill
Bill we will explain the reasoning and basis for the changes it's not going to be a pro/con type of presentation.

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I had one knowledgeable person estimate 2 days for the delegates meeting. Sounds about right. Hope they budgeted for extra coffee!
We don't expect more than 5-8 Articles being subject to debate at the delegates meeting, not all 18.


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Old 03-01-2011, 06:47 PM   #255
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Types of motorhomes are unlikely to be in the new document—it would attract too much attention.

The important thing is power—

who has it,

who can change things?

are members of the ruling group self perpetuated?

is there functional democracy? and,

can members get things changed without the changes being obstructed?

Gene
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:52 PM   #256
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who can change things?
Not you
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:35 PM   #257
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Frank when do you sleep, reading old threads all night posting at at 4:30 in the morning.........you need a hobby
Some of us have a job Bob. Frank's Trailer Works starts the day at 6am...
What I think you meant to say was "you need one less hobby."
You should read some of those threads Bob, wanta talk about flip flopping!!!!
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:40 PM   #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrawfordGene

Types of motorhomes are unlikely to be in the new document—it would attract too much attention.

The important thing is power—

who has it,

who can change things?

are members of the ruling group self perpetuated?

is there functional democracy? and,

can members get things changed without the changes being obstructed?

Gene
Gene brings up some very pertinent points. If the balance of power remains with the Executive Committee, the motorhome issue would not have to be addressed in the new constitution but could possibly be allowed with greater ease depending upon the answers to the questions he has just raised.

Though Gene may not be a member of the WBCCI, currently, I hope you will speak on the subject Bob. His comments are insightful and will only benefit us in their examination. The more we look at issues and the more perspectives we gain the more we arm ourselves with the tools to make best choices.

You mentioned some time back that there would be 1 Member 1 Vote and that the delegate status is being considered for elimination. That would preclude the procedure and all intiatives such as Forrest's amendment of the units (membership) would it not?

Can you tell us what features replace that and other processes that are revised within the club for it's operation and the handling of new business? (change) Beyond the laundry list of various initial change touted with this document, we want to insure that we will have a very workable, successful and member friendly method of bringing about additional change in the future without the typical road blocks at the bottleneck and chokehold of the IBT/EC level that we have regularly been experiencing.
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:51 PM   #259
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Pushing the cost down!

Not trying to be a “Naysayer” but I find the policy of the Norm forming a committee to “re-write” a WBCCI Constitution (when only a few areas of the existing one needed fix) to then say it will be sent out via email (50% of the members have email, look at Howie’s stats, leaving the other 50% in the dark, to find out on their own, etc..) to then say it’s “For the most part the unit president needs to make sure the info is out there.” to pin this job on the Unit Prez’s and make them get the information out (the 44 page document) because of the “cost” to place it in the Blue Beret is to high (so let’s push the cost down the Units that don’t have a million bucks in the bank and can’t afford to pay their leaders 100K plus in travel expense) is just appalling!

So let think about this for a second.

I’m Joe member that does not have email, but I saw in the BB about this new Constitution thing. Should I expect my Unit to create a 44 page Unit news letter telling me all about it, mail it out at major $$$? One might say, “Well Joe, you need to go to the Unit meeting where they are going to discuss this issue”. OK, So, once again it’s up to my Unit to cover the cost of printing up “X” numbers of copies for every Unit member as a handout? When for some Units 44 pages is more than “ALL” their new letters “combined” for the year! What if I can’t make the meeting?? How do I get a copy??

How about this idea, Why doesn’t Norm and the rest of the bunch pushing this thing not take a red cent in travel reimbursement this year and use that cash to print the thing up and send it out to the membership like they should. The arrogance of these people never ends!

I guess, I’m lucky to be a member of a Unit that states up front everything is done online so we will not have to eat that cost.
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:57 PM   #260
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FYI - I will present the power point in 3 sessions and post the changes, as we do with our Business Meeting Minutes. I will NOT pay for 44 pages copied for the 40 or 50 units represented at our Business Meeting. I WILL discuss the proposal for as long and as often as any member wants to do so. Not a big cost to do it this way.
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:05 PM   #261
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Gene brings up some very pertinent points. If the balance of power remains with the Executive Committee, the motorhome issue would not have to be addressed in the new constitution but could possibly be allowed with greater ease depending upon the answers to the questions he has raised.

Though Gene may not be a member of the WBCCI, currently, I hope you will speak on the subject
Carol I'm not obligated to, nor will I reply to those who continually cast negativity on the Committee's work, especially with Genes history herein, nor, will I answer if parroted thru others.

Quote:
You mentioned some time back that there would be 1 Member 1 Vote and that the delegate status is being considered for elimination. That would preclude the procedure and all intiatives such as Forrest's amendment of the units (membership) would it not?
delegates are replaced with 1M1V as you wanted.

Forrest's amendment would be moot as I see it assuming the New Constitution is passed. I think we are offering an even better alternative.

Quote:
Can you tell us what features replace that and other processes that are revised within the club for it's operation and the handling of new business? (change) Beyond a laundry list of various initial change with this document, we also want to insure that we will have a very workable, successful and member friendly method of bringing about additional change in the future without the road blocks at the IBT/EC level that we have typically and regularly encountered.
It will be much streamlined member driven, it has several new Articles to cover it, far to involved at this point to discuss until you have read it.

Amendments going forward will be very workable we worked long and hard on this part, I think all/most will like it.



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Old 03-01-2011, 08:09 PM   #262
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I had a conversation last month with an individual that gave me an estimate to print, collate, and mail the New Constitution to every member. That number was about $12,000. It clearly would be less if included in the BB.

A small price to pay for a credible presentation considering what get spent on some of the Clubs more narrowly focused expenditures. Speaking of narrowly focused expenditures. A past member of the WBCCI band was required to arrive several weeks early for the International, practise an hour a day, and play at the international for 4 people to dance. As noted she is no longer a band member.

Lets give up this conversation of cost and "Get Er Done"
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:10 PM   #263
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Paul Waddell
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Perhaps you can help in your unit as a past Pres, you have what over 100 members, pitch in and stop bitchin
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:11 PM   #264
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Amendments going forward will be very workable we worked long and hard on this part, I think all/most will like it.
Are you able to include the procedure at this time for the making and passing of an amendment or motion?
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:13 PM   #265
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I had a conversation last month with an individual that gave me an estimate to print, collate, and mail the New Constitution to every member. That number was about $12,000. It clearly would be less if included in the BB.
Howie put the money aside for a moment, if it was done this week it wouldn't appear until I think the May issue of the BB.
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:15 PM   #266
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Are you able to include the procedure at this time for the making and passing of an amendment or motion?
Just to be clear at the delegates meeting or after this is passed looking forward to '12
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