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Old 05-28-2011, 11:59 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by garry View Post
Ford Mustang owners joining an exclusive Corvette club. Honda motorcycle club member joining an exclusive Harley Davidson club.
...
... which is exactly what an ad-hoc, non-principled solution to the problem in intended to avoid! As I noted before, I'm fully against a principled solution, one that simply permits owners of SOB motorhomes to join our club. Nuthin' doin'!


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Old 05-28-2011, 03:50 PM   #268
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Personally, I think we're treating this thing in a far too principled way: Either change the fundamental nature of the club, or not. And I'm completely against a principled, fundamental change to the nature of the club.

But, you know, there's nothing wrong with a non-principled, ad-hoc solution to a problem that appears to need one. Suppose this one: Because of the change at the plant, people who are currently Airstream motorhome owners, who are current WBCCI members, and who wish to continue their membership can petition the IBT to allow their memberships to continue even while owning not an Airstream motorhome, but a Thor motorhome. (You can add additional restrictions, as desired: No leadership positions; have to have been in the club for X years; have to have owned their Airstream for X years; whatever.)

Well, duh. This kind of ad-hoc solution pretty much eliminates the possibility of giving membership to any old body with a white-sided motorhome while allowing those dwindling few who meet the criteria to continue.

So while I'm fundamentally against the idea of a principled change to the club, opening it up to non-Airstream owners, I can also see the problem that the recent change in factory policy has created for a few of our members. The least we can do is to help just those folks out with a temporary, ad-hoc measure.


Lynn
Lynn,

I think most members would agree with you, but if you recall the last MoHo go-around, the powers-that-be would not hear of any kind of affiliate membership for non-Airstream motor home owners.

This time the study committee is saying,

"It was also suggested that if Thor motor homes were allowed in the club, the owners could not hold office in WBCCI, and, in fact, could only be affiliate members. The majority of this committee's members judged that to be extremely biased and prejudicial."

So the bottom line is that the EC7 is going to cram non-Airstream motor homes down the membership's throat, if it's the last thing WBCCI does.

Which, it most likely will be.
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Old 05-28-2011, 05:11 PM   #269
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I am of course aware of what happened the last time. And what did happen is that the initiative was voted down solidly. I don't expect this time would be much different, assuming several intervening variables are the same.

What I suggested is a different animal, one that more folks might be able to live with.


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Old 05-28-2011, 05:27 PM   #270
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Although if the new constitution passes, only those members who choose to vote will decide the issue.

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I am of course aware of what happened the last time. And what did happen is that the initiative was voted down solidly. I don't expect this time would be much different, assuming several intervening variables are the same.

What I suggested is a different animal, one that more folks might be able to live with.


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Old 05-28-2011, 06:54 PM   #271
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Old 05-29-2011, 06:27 AM   #272
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Sorry

Quote:
Originally Posted by eubank View Post
I am of course aware of what happened the last time. And what did happen is that the initiative was voted down solidly. I don't expect this time would be much different, assuming several intervening variables are the same.

What I suggested is a different animal, one that more folks might be able to live with.


Lynn
I can't live with anything but AIRSTREAM in the club. Period. I am not alone when I say "hey old timer, take care of your equipment if you want to stay a member." the line that they need to replace a "worn out" MOHO make me laugh sitting here typing this in my Airstream that is 52 years old and over 600 miles from home and still heading out.

And ya know I don't feel sorry for them..........
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Old 05-29-2011, 07:55 AM   #273
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Boy, I certainly understand that sentiment! What turned me a bit was a quite elderly wbcci couple here now, telling and showing pics of their friends and adventures in the club. Evidently, some of those 400 folks are way up there, really not feeling comfortable with towing, but used to their smaller, but high-mileage motorhomes. They're feeling like the club that welcomed them into old age is now turning its back on them.

The boogie-men that others speak of may indeed be out there, but not all of these folks are boogie-men.

And it's for these non-boogie-men that I came up with the ad-hoc, non-principled solution. So, no, I don't think for a second that we should change the nature of the club to allow in just anybody. But I also feel uncomfortable turning my back on the folks above.


Lynn



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Emerick View Post
I can't live with anything but AIRSTREAM in the club. Period. I am not alone when I say "hey old timer, take care of your equipment if you want to stay a member." the line that they need to replace a "worn out" MOHO make me laugh sitting here typing this in my Airstream that is 52 years old and over 600 miles from home and still heading out.

And ya know I don't feel sorry for them..........
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:09 AM   #274
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The club is not turning their back on Airstream motorhome owners. If the Airstream motorhome owners want to sell their Airstreams and purchase non-Airstreams they should realize non-Airstreams are not allowed in the Airstream club. There are no surprise punches there. And there are Airstream motorhomes for sale. Or better still let the couple enjoy substantial savings and improve their current Airstream. No one is throwing elderly couples out in their old age, well actually perhaps some are being driven away because of dues and high rally expnses, but that is a whole 'nuther topic.
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:10 AM   #275
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Perhaps we need to define "high mileage home".
It seems to me with reasonable maintenance those thing should go several hundred K. More if diesel.
There is a difference betwen wanting a new one and needing a new one.

Admittedly the question comes from one with a 50 year old trailer and a half million mile plus TV so I am not very sympathetic with these folks perceived need.
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:31 AM   #276
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Exclamation

Needing (?)to buy a brand new motorhome and keep up with the latest and greatest doesn't sound like a hardship (?) to me. They are wanting their cake and to eat it too. Regardless of the constitution and brand identity requirement of the WBCCI, and irregardless of the members' vote against changing the product identity requirement of the club, there are those that wish to change the club into a social club about friends rather than a club of Airstream product. Never mind that they do not want to own an Airstream or be caught traveling in one any longer, they want to maintain their club standing and introduce whatever they wish to be allowed into the club. They actually believe they have the right and the power to keep readdressing the issue even after meeting with overwhelming rejection from the general membership time and again by all the surveys and the vote. This issue is so disguised from the actual motivation and greatly exaggerated in scope to shield the personal agendas of a few "quality" members. Last time around, many Airstream motorhome owners publicly spoke up and said they did not want the club to change its Airstream only requirement. They would do the right thing should that occur down the road. We can't be picking and choosing the relaxation of prerequisites for club membership. It would not be fair to allow some but not others the right to membership and bar others with other brands and types of recreational vehicles. Once the uniqueness of the WBCCI, Airstream club is lost it will never be the oldest single brand recreational vehicle club again and frankly the ones traveling on the members' funding dont care about that at all and have said so openly from their high places in WBCCI. It is time to change out that leadership with leaders who will respect and regard and protect the trust, and not to change the premise of the club for their own benefit, period. Shame on them to keep pushing their selfish interests and fragment the membership and cause further membership losses. They don't care. Their perceived kitty is ample and given a brand new motorhome to do their Great American Tour along with their friends they will be flying high while the WBCCI becomes a casulaty taking a back seat to their own special interests.
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Old 05-29-2011, 09:23 AM   #277
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Old 05-29-2011, 10:38 AM   #278
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Here are the names of the most recent Motorhome committee:
Carolyn Florence 264 Chairman
Ralph Forester 279
Gene Forsyth 1679
Dean Kyle 232
Phil Latimer 2800
Don Martie 217
Tersa Taylor 8209

Not all members voted for the motorhome proposed by the committee, as published,
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Old 05-29-2011, 10:50 AM   #279
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Quit Thinking of Yourself

I can fully understand the need for us to include “ALL” THOR motor home products into the club and potentially even their line of travel trailers to boot!

With the membership numbers dropping the way they are in the club, we must do whatever we can to bring in new members and keep the ones we have. Here are the facts,

1. Airstream no longer makes a Class A MOHO


2. Through different reasons, accidents, fires, bad design, etc… things over time will need to be repaired/replaced. It’s no different than a travel trailer with axles, flooring, exterior damage, etc… some things just cannot be fixed/repaired and there are only so many MOHO’s units that can be used from auto graveyards for parts. Far less than the number of travel trailers which is why there is a greater need for “REPLACEMENT” and not repair.


3. We need to do whatever we can to retain the members of which own MOHO’s since they are the ones that are running the WBCCI and without them as members of the club, there’s a very good chance the club will fall apart without their leadership skill’s and guidance. The numbers prove this, about 10% of the current MOHO have three digit numbers on top! It’s not the travel trailer owners that are keeping this club going.


4. With Airstream owners leaving the WBCCI for various reasons, we as a club need to more now than ever before in the past to look for new sources of membership, thus others brands of products to keep the WBCCI alive and well.


5. At this point, we should even consider including other brands of travel trailers too. Again, since even at this point it appears the WBCCI is no longer the “defacto standard” club for Airstream travel trailer owners, we now need to look for other avenues of possible membership including other THOR travel trailers.


For years, the “naysayers” have kept out the very changes that have been needed to allow this club to grow. If we had changed our name, allowed other brands into the club and changed our Constitution to create a member caucus, thus giving the membership the power to make these needed changes instead of being controlled by a few naysayer delegates, the club would not be in the current mess it’s in.

I’ll be the first to admit, I was one of those “naysayers” but have realized the error of my ways over the past few weeks. We can only hope the delegates of this club are forward thinking enough to not only vote in the New Constitution, but can see the need to amend it to include any and all THOR MOHO’s and change the name such to invite owners of other products to join the club as well. These Special Committees were formed for a reason, they understand the problems facing the WBCCI as a whole and have made these decisions for a reason many of which we as the general membership may not see or know about.

This is the only way we can continue to allow the IBT/EC7 to travel the way they have at our expense over the years and is the least we can do for them going forward. They have earned this right and it’s our duty to give that to them.
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Old 05-29-2011, 11:32 AM   #280
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I can fully understand the need for us to include “ALL” THOR motor home products into the club and potentially even their line of travel trailers to boot!
I hope you're just being facetious, Paul! I, for one, did not advocate such a move, nor would I.

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