Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-30-2011, 06:59 PM   #321
2 Rivet Member
 
wam52's Avatar
 
Windham , New Hampshire
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT View Post
Bottom line - SOBs in -- Airstreams OUT -- no doubt...__
Great segue to begin anew. I left the club volantarily, so did many others. There are so many Airstream owners out here who just want those associations of other Airstream Owners. In general we do not want the sun blocked out from a 12 foot high plastic box parked next to us, but we will make exceptions for our friends who happen to own Airstream MH's.

There comes a time when the only good choice for the human condition is to give up the insanity of constant bickering.

Five years ago I knew that the club was going to tank. That is because it was obvious to me that the focus and mission of its officers and their peers were not that of its general membership. I tried my best to convince others to make the case for splitting and start a new club but I guess the forces of not giving up on a lost cause were greater than the vision of creating a new club from scratch.

It is now time for a general rebellion to show the 450 some odd MH owners that they can have the club and the treasury to which they cling so dearly.

Whole units should vote themselves out of the WBCCI and form their own local Airstream Association. Should someone start a national organization with Airstream Company approval they can always apply for a charter to the new club.

Its time to reduce the WBCCI to the point of 450 members, which is their ultimate goal!
__________________

__________________
WAM & Lin
Airsteaming since 1999
1966 " Trade Wind"

wam52 is offline  
Old 05-30-2011, 07:29 PM   #322
Ready-to-Travel
 
pmclemore's Avatar

 
2012 30' International
Walkerton , Virginia
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,727
I'm with Lynn: Leadership has been very effective in what they have attempted to do. The MOHO vote was just a temporary setback; look at all the effective opposition they have marginalized (banned or induced to resign).

Lynn has also described a more realistic POV as to the problems faced by the folks that are aging out of their current motorhomes: No mystery that folks - and leaders - that have always been WBCCI members would want to continue; many years of relationships and activities. Nothing sinister - it is the natural order of things when focus is lost.

The problem is that WBCCI management believes that it owes more to their friends and colleagues - years of hard work and relationships are at stake - than it does to the mission of the club. Conflict? Resolve it according to their wishes. You can rationalize anything - just talk to a teenager, right? Nothing new. This is why so many non-profits fail after a long life - the mission gets clouded and the energy dissipates. If my wife were online, she'd mention the metamorphosis of Randolph-Macon Woman's College into Randolph College.

Absent a change of management, the institution must fail when it loses its focus. There is nothing unusual about this - it is the natural order of things.

Pat
__________________

__________________
--------------------------------------
Somebody, please, point me to the road.

AIR 3987
TAC VA-2
WBCCI 4596
pmclemore is offline  
Old 05-30-2011, 10:32 PM   #323
Moderator
Commercial Member
 
eubank's Avatar
 
1967 30' Sovereign
1999 31' Land Yacht
Bosque Farms , New Mexico
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 6,668
The ultimate question -- really the only question -- is whether this non-feckless leadership will be successful in the endeavor. They lost the last round. There's no reason why they should not lose round two. However, the means used in this round need not -- probably should not -- be the same as used before.


Lynn
__________________
WBCCI 21043
eubank is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 12:11 AM   #324
Rivet Master
 
Coloradobus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 804
Hmmm, no one has mentioned in this thread, Airstream Class A body-styles. It has been stated there are 469 Class A Airstream motorhomes in WBCCI by the MoHo Committee Report. Does this 469 number count just the plastic diesel and gas powered fiberglass boxes and Widebody Land Yachts, or does it also include All Argosys and Classic 245's, 250's 270's, 280's, 290's, 300's, 310's 325's 345's 350's or 370's gasser and diesel pushers? As a Classic gasser Airstream 270 Class A motorhome owner, we resent the MoHo committee using our coach as part of their tally in favor of their report.
__________________
JIM n CHRIS
"62 ATW Overlander, '51 Flying Cloud
'67 GT, '90 Squarestream 29ft, 06 Bambi, Bigfoot slide in/GMC Denali K2500, Marathon Coach, Class A.
Coloradobus is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 02:15 AM   #325
Aluminum in 3-D
 
Blue Pearl's Avatar
 
1968 28' Ambassador
Seaside , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 579
Images: 1
Member of the committe

To start, I'm the minority in this report. I asked Norm to put me on this committee and was surprised that I was appointed. To be blunt, my husband didn't know I knew some of the word he heard from me during the time the committee was meeting by e-mail. But I didn't give up.
Lynn, Richard and Pat, thank you for your support of the ideas I tried to get passed. Like I said to the committee, I want to keep our older members but a Thor Motor Home should not be the face of the WBCCI. You can't have the President of the Corvette club driving a Chevy. Didn't get it.
If I hadn't asked how many Motor homes are in the WBCCI I don't think any of the committee member would have asked, I was pretty much a thorn in their side and I really don't know if all the committee members even read my e-mails. I do think the other committee members think that this is what Thor and Airstream want the WBCCI to do. They don't want Thor or Airstream to be mad at the WBCCI and think this is the way to do it. I told them, Airstream is selling trailers like hot cakes, we should follow, they weren't selling Motor homes, good marketing move by Airstream and we should follow their lead. How could they be mad at us for following their lead.

I was surprised they even added the minority opinion, I guess I made some good points but they couldn't bend. Like I said, they didn't expect me. Norm knew who I was and still appointed me. Thanks Norm.



Now you can tear me apart Leo & Carol

Chairman of the WBCCI Wally Byam B-day Party in Wally's home town Baker City, Oregon. July 1-5th 2011. Pee Wee will be here to help dedicate the new exhibit on Wally Byam and his Caravanners at the Baker Heritage Museum. Join us if you can't go to International.
__________________
Teresa

Membership chair
Wally Byam Airstream Club
Past President Oregon Unit 090

Campfires, the original social media!
wbcci#29827

Check out the [URL="https://airstreamclub.org/"and Wally Byam Airstream Club on facebook
Blue Pearl is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 06:18 AM   #326
Rivet Master
 
rideair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,319
Teresa,

Thanks for all your help and trying to keep the MOHO Committee somewhat on the right path. Back in 2007, I sent a letter recommending the same thing you did, "you can buy all you want, but you'll never get to hold office again and you "HAD" to be a current member" At that time, Jim E. was head of that Special Committee and we went to blows manytimes, even proved the CBL missed a place in the Constitution that would have needed to be reworded before the vote (that almost did not happen).

It's about them, not the club, not the membership, etc... Some in the top leadership want new MOHO's that's the bottom line and they will not stop until they get them.

I say, let them have them, change the name of the club, add the new Constitution and be done with it. We're having fun without the club this year so far, even though we are still members.

Already working on creating another caravan for next year!

Tired of flighting them, GET-R-DONE and be finished with it!
__________________
Paul Waddell
rideair is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 07:31 AM   #327
Rivet Master
 
Coloradobus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 804
Blue Pearl, Wow, WELL Done! totally unexpected. Yes, it is surprising the MoHo report stated a "minority opinion" and I am glad you held your ground.
In 2007, before the Perry mess, I contacted Mandalay Coach. I was then given the info for the President of the Mandalay Travel Club, a Mr Findley, I called him, since we were being told our INT EC-7, Mandalay coach owners were chomping on the bit to join WBCCI and grow our numbers.
When I explained who I was, and what was going on in WBCCI, Mr Findley told me he and his club had no interest in WBCCI. He said any WBCCi member was welcome to join their club, as long as they bought a Mandalay coach.
Now that the MTC is the THOR motorhome club, I would suspect they have the same feeling. They don't need WBCCI to flourish.
I agree, its not WBCCI that is abandoning our elder Class A Airstream owners, it Airstream. We had a 1999 Cutter diesel, and got rid of it back in 2000 after 10 months of ownership.And bought a Country Coiach Affinity.
__________________
JIM n CHRIS
"62 ATW Overlander, '51 Flying Cloud
'67 GT, '90 Squarestream 29ft, 06 Bambi, Bigfoot slide in/GMC Denali K2500, Marathon Coach, Class A.
Coloradobus is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 08:13 AM   #328
Rivet Master
 
wheel interested's Avatar
 
2007 23' International CCD
Lapeer , Michigan
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,046
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Pearl View Post
Now you can tear me apart Leo & Carol
Why would anyone tear you apart Teresa? Did you think the things I said about the club and my opinions had no merit or were lodged as a personal affront or were objectionable? There are things I strongly object to in the WBCCI, but they are mostly club actions taken that I believe to have been conducted inappropriately! Other than that, whether there is a name change, or SOB motorhomes are allowed in the club, or if MALs get a vote, or how delegates are able to propose change, these things are all issues every member is free to support or reject and to debate and lobby with others freely.

There seems to be some residual consequence of speaking out and asserting strong opinions and criticisms that I am heated or uncivil or not being nice and I think that is a misnomer. I will also say that Leo is often much maligned and unjustly so. When it comes to what actually perpetrates negativity, detriment, and malice, it should be the execution of unjust actions and rather not the expression of belief, that is regarded as culprit and vilified. You as a messenger should also appreciate that position.
__________________
Caroljb



photography
wheel interested is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 08:37 AM   #329
Rivet Master
 
HowieE's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
Princeton , New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,037
Images: 12
Teresa

Please don't refer to yourself as in the MINORITY. Yes you were a minority member of that committee but in reality you are a leading member of the majority of the Club.

I have not interfaced to any extent with those on the committee, with one exception, and that member stated with conviction that their next MH would be Prevost, not even something made by Thor.

Maintain your position because the opposition has clearly demonstrated their suborn staying power.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles

HowieE is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 09:13 AM   #330
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Pearl View Post
the committee was meeting by e-mail.
Teresa are you saying the committee never did any conference calls?
Or go to meetings etc.

Hq has a conference system that can be used.

Were you the only only one dissenting if you care to say?

The biggest flaw I see in the report is the fact that 4 out 7 owned MOHO????

and there should have been a poll of the current 450 owners to get their input.

Why wasn't that done?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloradobus View Post
Blue Pearl, Wow, WELL Done! totally unexpected. Yes, it is surprising the MoHo report stated a "minority opinion" and I am glad you held your ground.
it is required that any member dissenting have that stated.

As far as the majority of the EC voting for this committee it was not unanimous.


.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 09:19 AM   #331
Rivet Master
 
rideair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,319
Howie, (I'll include you Bob on an edit)

You knew this was coming:

The very thoughts and views you have with your response to Teresa are the "very same" thoughts and views the majority have with the "Special Revision Committee" and what they are doing. It's no different, a small group forcing their views on others to the point where the Revision Committee did a "REBUTTAL" which hass "never" been done before in the history of the club from what I've been told by those that have been around for a very long time.

A "Special Committee" pushing their views on the membership is the "same" regardless of the topic!

You know, this now makes you one of those "Naysayers", "Troublemakers", "Just trying to stir the pot" members that have been so badly talked about.

I really wish you "Naysayers" and "Troublemakers" would for once support these Special Committees, if you did, the club would be in a far "different" place. Where ever that might be.

Support "ALL" Special Committees wants/desires over the past 7 years, VOTE "YES" for a Name Change, VOTE "YES" for the MOHO issue, VOTE "YES" for a new Constitution. It really does not matter at this point folks anyway.
__________________
Paul Waddell
rideair is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 09:32 AM   #332
Moderator
Commercial Member
 
eubank's Avatar
 
1967 30' Sovereign
1999 31' Land Yacht
Bosque Farms , New Mexico
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 6,668
Quote:
Originally Posted by rideair View Post
... VOTE "YES" for a Name Change, VOTE "YES" for the MOHO issue, VOTE "YES" for a new Constitution. It really does not matter at this point folks anyway.
Oh, I don't think you're right on this. Folks voted "no" to a name change and "no" to the first moho proposal, and the proposed constitution isn't doing that well, either. I'd say that what folks say has had a major impact on the club.


Lynn
__________________
WBCCI 21043
eubank is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 09:41 AM   #333
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by eubank View Post
the proposed constitution isn't doing that well,


Lynn
I think several of us on the committee would disagree with the support we found directly with units.

In fact this past weekend at Region 2 rally I had very positive feedback.

But lets be candid until the fat lady sings no body knows how any vote will go.





.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 09:51 AM   #334
Moderator
Commercial Member
 
eubank's Avatar
 
1967 30' Sovereign
1999 31' Land Yacht
Bosque Farms , New Mexico
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 6,668
Quote:
Originally Posted by LI Pets View Post
I think several of us on the committee would disagree with the support we found directly with units.
In fact this past weekend at Region 2 rally I had very positive feedback.
But lets be candid until the fat lady sings no body knows how any vote will go.
And it may pass in the end. It's hard to know. I do oppose it and found it heartening to discover that the folks in a couple of uints had similar reservations.

Lynn
__________________
WBCCI 21043
eubank is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 10:19 AM   #335
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by eubank View Post
And it may pass in the end. It's hard to know. I do oppose it and found it heartening to discover that the folks in a couple of uints had similar reservations.

Lynn
Some of those that don't fully understand it may not at first blush want it.

When I spoke at region 2 there were certain issues that I thought were easy to understand but it's not to several.

When it was explained in long hand they got it!

There will be many delegates, 4 committee members and the Parliamentarian ( that get it) at the Int before the meetings to debate the pros/cons to those that do not yet get it!

I'm sure there are going to a bunch that are closed minded that will never be convinced, but is that 1/3?


.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 10:20 AM   #336
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Who here are actually going to the International?
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 10:27 AM   #337
Rivet Master
 
wkerfoot's Avatar
 
1979 23' Safari
1954 29' Liner
Orange , California
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,746
To get this thread back on track.

Teresa,

Thank you for your information on the Motorhome committee. I have already emailed the IP, all IVPs, my region president and unit president stating my opposition to the newest motorhome committee. I have heard back from three. One stated that he had already heard from several members, but did not state whether those members approved or disapproved of the motion.

Bill
__________________
Bill Kerfoot, WBCCI/VAC/CAC/El Camino Real Unit #5223
Just my personal opinion
1973 Dodge W200 PowerWagon, 1977 Lincoln Continental, 2014 Dodge Durango
1979 23' Safari, and 1954 29' Double Door Liner Orange, CA

http://billbethsblog.blogspot.com/
wkerfoot is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 11:17 AM   #338
Rivet Master
 
rideair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,319
We need MOHO's

Many WBCCI members like some on the MOHO Special Committee for the inclusion of THOR MOHO products into the club think until the fat lady sings no body knows how any vote will go because some of those that don't fully understand it may not at first blush want it. But, if the Committee had the chance to explain it in long hand they would get it!

Evidently this must be something the membership wants badly because this is now the third time it’s come-up since 2007. The membership is asking for this much like they did to “Revise the Constitution”.

One can only hope there will be many delegates, the 7 committee members and the IP (that asked for this report)( that get it) to be at the International meeting before the meetings to debate the pros/cons of including THOR MOHO’s into the club to those that do not yet get it!

I'm sure there are going to a bunch that are closed minded that will never be convinced.

Like others in leadership, some want to move up to a MOHO because either they can’t or do not want to pull a trailer anymore. By not allowing these member to purchase any THOR MOHO and allow them full voting/holding Unit/Region/IBT office privileges is just not right.

We can only hope some Delegate will stand up at the Delegates Meeting and make a motion to “INCLUDE” the ownership of any THOR MOHO into the “New Constitution”. We need to include these products NOW to stop members from leaving the club. The Special Committee’s has asked for it, it’s now time to give it to them.

Support your Special Committee’s and vote YES for everyone of them has ever asked for!
__________________
Paul Waddell
rideair is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 11:41 AM   #339
Silver Mist
 
LI Pets's Avatar
 
1977 31' Sovereign
Riverhead , New York
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,008
Images: 28
Paul your tongue in cheek humor is very entertaining to your little group of naysayers.

But how about getting serious for once and cut it out.

Just to be clear the revision committee never supported the MOHO issue, we left the eligibility in tact to prohibit them.

If you know who was not in favor of the MOHO committee you guys wouldn't be so concerned.

since this issue is a super hot red button issue it should not be taken thru the back door as an amendment to the revision but be sent out to the units for discussion.
__________________
Bob
'77 Sovereign Intl 31' CB
WBCCI R2 Rep VAC 11411 Metro NY VP

LI Pets is offline  
Old 05-31-2011, 11:55 AM   #340
Rivet Master
 
rideair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,319
Bob,

Not trying to be entertaining, being 100% honest!

I will go on the record right now,

"I AM 100% IN FAVOR OF THOR MOHO IN THE WBCCI AND FEEL IT SHOULD BE INCLUDED INTO THE NEW CONSTITUTION"

I have no problem with them in the club. I ony wish we could have the "NAME CHANGE" done through an amendment to the New Constitution as well.

If we are going to screw this club up, let's do it right! By doing all the Special Committee things at one time, it's a clean cut, GET-R-DONE approach. With a new name attached, we can at least say the WBCCI was the WBCCI until 2011.

The WBCCI then changed their Constitution, added THOR MOHO and Changed their name!

Quit being a "NAYSAYER" about the THOR MOHO.
__________________

__________________
Paul Waddell
rideair is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
wbcci


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Airstream, Inc. or any of its affiliates. Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.