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Old 09-04-2010, 07:32 AM   #85
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IMHO, I agree with Dan. It seemed that Norm asked that the communication from concerned members be e-mailed directly to Dona Garner, its chairperson. The chairperson of most committees is usually the person that is the contact person for the committee and the person who sets priorities within the committee ( other that the group that oversees or originally set up the committee). I do not know whether Dona has ever posted here or whether she intends to. Her e-mail address is found in the WBCCI directory or it may be found on the WBCCI.org site. She has written articles for the Blue Beret on many occasions in her various roles she has had over the years.
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Old 09-04-2010, 11:18 AM   #86
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You know, a good part of charging an extra fee for printed publications is how one states it. For example, you could say that you do indeed have to "pay more" for printed stuff. However, the other way of saying is that your dues are reduced if you want only electronically delivered materials.


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Old 09-04-2010, 12:17 PM   #87
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Would membership dues be reduced from the savings of not printing and shipping the Blue Beret? And would the rationale be to directly reduce membership costs? Globally, or individually?

I like the paper copy of the BB it's a tangible benefit that I get for my dues. However if I had the opportunity to opt out at a reduced membership rate I would certainly consider it. However I do like a nice printed page to peruse. With the BB online for free and buddy rallies growing in popularity the margin of value to cost for membership would be further narrowed.

My other concern is that the savings would be absorbed and make an inperceptible difference for individual members and impede cost cutting in other areas that might be more critically addressed.

I think an efficiency expert would be able to not only pay for his employment but bring a substantial savings and perspective to the club.
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Old 09-04-2010, 04:26 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by eubank View Post
You know, a good part of charging an extra fee for printed publications is how one states it. For example, you could say that you do indeed have to "pay more" for printed stuff. However, the other way of saying is that your dues are reduced if you want only electronically delivered materials.
Lynn


True, how about this idea and the club can kill two birds with one stone and show a profit.

Offer a 20% discount for any purchases thru the club store if you accept electronically delivered materials.

The club will save on postage.

The sales of merchandise will increase more than enough to cover a lower margin.
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Old 09-04-2010, 04:47 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by dwightdi View Post
It seemed that Norm asked that the communication from concerned members be e-mailed directly to Dona Garner, its chairperson.
Dona, is chair as well as the club Parliamentarian.

That's correct email if you wish, but Norm also approved this forum.

Please PM if you need her email
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Old 09-04-2010, 05:47 PM   #90
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From: Norman Beu <beu146@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2010 10:44:19 -0500
Subject: Membership
Friends

The selection of members for the Bylaws Revision Committee, approved by the Executive Committee on July 5, 2010, is now complete. I am pleased to announce the following appointments:

Dona Garner, Chairman, WBCCI Parliamentarian
Kerry Mattila, President, Ontario Canada Unit
Joe Perryman, 1st Vice President, Region 10
Bob Novak, Member, Metro New York Unit
Tom Smithson, First Vice President, Northern California Unit

I have encouraged Dona to consult with the 2020 Committee, the Vintage Airstream Club, and others as appropriate. I want to thank Dona, Kerry, Joe, Bob and Tom for stepping forward to the challenge of this significant task. My personal interest is to make the Blue Book more user friendly, to reduce the bulk, to review Standing Committee Job Descriptions, and to identify impediments to "fun, fellowship and adventure" - all the while retaining the essential character and the traditions of the WBCCI, including the Code of Ethics. Should you have an input for study by the Committee, please communicate directly with Dona.

Safe Travels

Norm Beu
President, WBCCI
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Old 09-04-2010, 06:06 PM   #91
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Yes also

Norm Beu in the instructions to the committee in pertinent part “The Committee will communicate with WBCCI Members via the ...Airforums,



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Old 09-04-2010, 06:53 PM   #92
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I'm not taking sides on issues here but one thing does puzzle me. I see several things that aren't going to happen and other things being argued. Of the five committee members only one seems to be responding here.

Fair question,
Three others are in here on and off they mentioned it. I understand they are put off by the rhetoric and flame baiting (they don’t know why I subject myself to its negativity).

Recently I find not responding at all to flames or abusive language helps stay on topic, IMO many should be edited or deleted by the mods, not my choice.

I think the others would be in here (and I don’t just mean this thread) if posts remained on topic and more civil. Forums tend to operate with certain subcultures of the frequent posters which I think I understand here after 2000 posts, it takes a new user a while to adjust to it or they just lurk, never posting.

Quote:
It seems to me with no meeting taking place yet, we shouldn't be getting these kind of responses. I thought this thread was for suggestions and recommendations. Shouldn't these issues be taken to the committee, discussed and then a response be posted?
I will present all suggestions posted on this forum all Emails sent to Dona and any input from the other members that are submitted to Kerry, Tom and Joe will present those. All submissions will categorized or summarized we will then deliberate. Deliberations are not public, we must follow RONR.


Correct me if I’m wrong but this is the first time a committee had an open exchange of ideas with the members, “Time's a-changing” in the right direction.

Norm Beu in the instructions to the committee in pertinent part “The Committee will communicate with WBCCI Members via the WBCCI.ORG forums, Airforums, the Blue Beret and direct e-mails.”

This is a big change.
My interpretation is that perhaps when consensus is reached on a group of issues or major proposed revision it will be published. But have not discussed this yet. I believe part of this process which will affect every member should have a degree of transparency.

Dan, I don’t think what is going to posted or emailed will happened as fast as you may think. There has been emails and calls between us, the first conference meeting is this coming week, I setup a test on Go To Meeting which most of you know will allow us to talk and push docs to a host computer for discussion, again a first in this club, approved by Norm Beu.

Probably weekly this will occur. My guess it will be 6-8 weeks before we get to second base and report publicly, this has not been discussed yet. We have until the midwinters to complete the submission to the board. But the board will need lead time to study the changes. So Dec 15 – Jan 10 is our tentative target date.


Quote:
Maybe I'm looking at this all wrong but I was hoping the committee and it members would approach all issues with an open mind.
Dan
To think otherwise would be incorrect because; RONR relating to a special committee states: …should represent as far as possible all points of view……….usefulness of the committee will be impaired if any important faction of the assembly is not represented.






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Old 09-04-2010, 06:56 PM   #93
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...Correct me if I’m wrong but this is the first time a committee had an open exchange of ideas with the members...
ok

u need 2 b corrected...

this 'first time process' mentioned has happened b4.

here AND on other forums.

cheers
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Old 09-04-2010, 06:59 PM   #94
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Joe, can you say where or have a link?
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Old 09-04-2010, 07:35 PM   #95
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LINKS, some of the links have already been posted...

in the thread U consider closed.

but go back and LOOK at ANY thread communicator posted into...

or MANY of the wb' threads from 2005,6 or 7...

the PREVIOUS edition of the wb CLUB forum had many many threads with leader/member idea exchanges...

that OLD forum might be gone, but bill may remember some...

or the WAY BACK machine site might still load them.

point being be careful about declaring FIRST TIME for any of this stuff...

cheers
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Old 09-05-2010, 07:03 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by RickDavis View Post
On voting:
There must be a way to vote that gives each and every member the opportunity to, be it by mail, in person, or electronically.
There also needs to be a way an individual voter can instruct the delegate to vote for a person running from the floor. Since some running from the floor are not known until the actual meeting it should be possible to , for a member to instruct his delegate to vote for anyone running for that office from the floor, but not the "approved" candidate.
RONR p. 409 An org should never adopt a bylaw permitting a question to be decided by a voting procedure in which the votes of persons who attend a meeting ….votes can be affected by debate, amendments ….need for repeated balloting.

I was in Perry and heard delegates state they wanted but couldn’t change their vote on the MH issue thereafter voting for rather than against it.

Suggestions
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Old 09-05-2010, 08:10 AM   #97
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Would membership dues be reduced from the savings of not printing and shipping the Blue Beret? And would the rationale be to directly reduce membership costs? Globally, or individually? ...
I don't have a clue about how any benefit from electronic publication/distrubtion would be handled. I do have a clue about the income and cost of the BB for Jul 09 to Jan 10:

BB advertising income: $74,536
BB publication: $54,747
BB postage: $31,452


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Old 09-05-2010, 12:09 PM   #98
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Last year advertising revenue was down for all magazines. Haven't you notice how all of them look like they were on a diet in the last two years. As we come out of this economic hole, ad revenues should increase and we should be able to show a profit on the BB. Fred says he should be able to sell more ads also, because on the internet version of the BB, we are now tracking the hits developed from the ad links.
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