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Old 03-29-2010, 11:33 AM   #253
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You make some good points, Gene. If the WBCCI expects the D&O carrier to foot any of the bill, they'll have a seat at the table. Of course, if the insurance company takes a position they don't like, it sounds like they have enough cash reserves to put a spear in the ground and finance the litigation defense without the carrier.

I'm a skeptic when it comes to litigation... mostly based on my professional experience. It's a hammer... and not every problem is a nail. From my observations, the problem of the WBCCI is cultural. There seems to be a fundamental divide between the old guard leadership and an increasingly large group of dissatisfied members. When I really don't know is: How big is the "lump" in the middle... the people who mail in a check every year but really don't know and/or care about what the Int'l leadership is doing?

Let's say litigation (or settlement) breaks the current monopoly on board seats. If there were truly open elections, how would the Int'l leadership change? Would the old guard have enough "keep things the way they are" votes to stay in power or would the power shift to members with a different agenda?

Here's my thing, Gene. Whatever happens with the litigation, I see this as a fight over the red numbers. One side is going to win. The other side is going to pick up their toys and go home. The winners get to keep the name, numbers, legacy, stuff. The others don't. When the dust settles, I just don't see one unified club... I see a splintering of the organization... even if that really isn't what people want in the end.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:53 AM   #254
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Hamp', your analysis is probably correct. The insurgents may win and may get some board seats out of it, but the cultural fractures will be long standing.

I don't understand the details of the WBCCI election system, but it appears it takes many years to move to the top and the nomination procedure is tightly controlled. These procedures to protect existing leadership are not uncommon in nonprofits. I doubt a court would or could change them but there may be state laws that would apply giving a court power to change them.

More likely an outcome of a lawsuit is better financial management and reinstatement of an expelled member. Then what? As Hamp' suggests, getting a majority of seats for the insurgents is hardly assured.

The movement toward decentralized clubs will continued along with the increasing use of the internet will result in alternative clubs, groups and forums. Regardless who controls the WBCCI, I think it will continue to shrink. It may be a better WBCCI, but not a markedly different WBCCI.

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Old 03-30-2010, 05:53 PM   #255
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2. one of the major claims I believe is financial mismanagement? and I think the plan is to file in NY? - how do you plan to address issues such as these...

Derivative lawsuits are claims against a board member on behalf of the corporation. The typical claim here would be mismanagement of assets. But, under New York State law only a few people have "standing" or the right to bring such claims. They are: 1) board member(s) suing other board member(s) 2) members of an organization suing a board (if at least 5% of the total membership join the lawsuit), and 3) the state Attorney General.
The suit will be brought the Eastern District Federal Court, Islip NY.
The law basis is interesting and I don't know if they follow Federal, New York, Ohio (the incorporated state) or Nevada.

It maybe that Federal may be applicable due to the members being nationwide.

There's certainly enough yacht, golf club case law on the subject.

The plaintiffs will get that answer from their legal team shortly.

.
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Old 04-13-2010, 08:15 PM   #256
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ALL CONCERNED,

My wife and I were at the Florida State Rally in Sarasota this February 2010. We listened to WBCCI IP Collier give the state of the club to all those attending. We asked why Leo Garvey was being expelled. IP Collier mentioned 2 previous and 1 current grievance. IP Collier would not say what the grievances were about. Also, Leo was not a member while he appealed the most recent grievance. As per IP Collier, even if he was successful in appealing grievance #3, another one was waiting to be filed. What kind of crap is this??
The control that the IBT has over the club is like the former Soviet Politburo. As IP Collier continued to answer questions from the floor, he made one statement that clearly showed the mind set of the IBT. He said he was very busy since becoming IP and had to deal with other WBCCI business instead of 'HIS INTERNATIONAL'. What a glaring admission. I spoke to him later during the rally and expressed my anger at his statement. I said, 'it was not his international, but every members rally'. IP Collier said that his wife told him of his gaffe. He said he made a mistake by saying that. It was not a mistake. It is the way the IBT feels. We are just the mere members.
My wife and I remain members because of our friendships in the club. Leo is our friend too and now we "can't" camp with him anymore.
We don't want to see the club's demise, but we need the lawsuit to stop the IBT from it's mismanagement.
BTW we started wearing black ribbons on our badges at the FL State Rally and also wore black arm bands in memory of Leo's explosion. We have pledged money for the lawsuit.

Mark & Debbie
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Old 04-14-2010, 05:26 AM   #257
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I was also at the "State of the WBCCI" meeting referred to by Halimar and can confirm that is what happened.
There was no doubt that the intent was to "get rid of Leo" no matter how many grievances it took.
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Old 04-14-2010, 06:40 AM   #258
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As per IP Collier, even if he was successful in appealing grievance #3, another one was waiting to be filed.
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I was also at the "State of the WBCCI" meeting referred to by Halimar and can confirm that is what happened.
There was no doubt that the intent was to "get rid of Leo" no matter how many grievances it took.
Yes, and if the lengthy pattern of political abuse against Leo is ever presented in court, I think it will be a "slam dunk" for Leo. For example, the remarkable coincidence of the IP suddenly deciding that non-International Nominating Committee-selected candidates would have to buy full-page ads in the Blue Beret to present their positions when Leo announced he was running for INC. And then refusing Leo's ad for publication because it was "too divisive".

Quote:
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He [IP Collier] said he was very busy since becoming IP and had to deal with other WBCCI business instead of 'HIS INTERNATIONAL'.
If the International officers would like to be free to pursue their main goals without a massive outcry from the membership, they can learn the lesson that they should avoid blatant political backstabbing.

Jerry Larson, to his great credit, understood that fairly quickly and arranged for Bob Thompson's suspension to be overturned on appeal.

Tom Collier says absolutely not--Leo is history. Fine, his choice--but he shouldn't expect smooth sailing.

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We don't want to see the club's demise, but we need the lawsuit to stop the IBT from its mismanagement.
Hear, hear!
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Old 04-14-2010, 11:42 AM   #259
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This is a bit off topic, but one of my pet peeves is leaders who use the first person singular. In real life, I manage a small city. Every so often, I hear another city manager talk about how "I" did this or "I" did that. It's like fingernails on a chalkboard to me. This is a team sport. The only time I'm going to the first person singular is when it's time to take responsibility for a mistake, problem or goof. We did a great job. And when we didn't do a great job, the buck stops here.

Collier calling it "his" international was an oversight. It was an inadvertent acknowledgement of his perspective on the organization. If the WBCCI were a government, he would be a public master, not a public servant.
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Old 04-14-2010, 11:49 AM   #260
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Collier calling it "his" international was an oversight. It was an inadvertent acknowledgement of his perspective on the organization. If the WBCCI were a government, he would be a public master, not a public servant.
When I was growing up, the idea of stewardship was actively taught. Today one hears little of that and a great deal of ego-centrism. I think we are much poorer for it.
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Old 04-14-2010, 12:02 PM   #261
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Collier calling it "his" international was an oversight. It was an inadvertent acknowledgement of his perspective on the organization. If the WBCCI were a government, he would be a public master, not a public servant.
OVRESITE?
I think we should leave that interpretation to those that were there and rely on it. Often the inflection and body language are as important in determining the intent of a comment. Unfortunately these components of ones comments can not be given justice in reported text.

Another factor in considering the intent of ones comments might be their historical action and comments. Mr Collier has not concealed his intent in the past and I doubt he has changed his spots.
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Old 04-14-2010, 04:03 PM   #262
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I miswrote. I meant to say "was not an oversight." In general, I think how people talk--the nuances of language--reveal a great deal.
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Old 04-21-2010, 10:39 PM   #263
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I'm a non-member

I wouldn't support any organization that forces people out or tries to tell me who I can camp with, but that could just be me.

I was interested, but now I'm moving on and wishing others could do the same.
It sounds like ego maniac slave drivers on wheels.. No thanks, I've dealt with the type before. That is their life, they feed on it. Unless you want to devote a miserable life to their pissing contest, I would say go have a real one. Let that be your mark of protest and proof of what it should be about.

It sounds, from a very uniformed view point, like they are "mere" miserable Airstreamers

This isn't giving up, it's probably the most proactive approach. Airstreams will out live the nonsense. There is no legacy that needs to be taught or passed down. One look and the next generation will know what to do with it. The rest just seems to get in the way.

I just hope the quaility of Airstreams don't deminish too much.

I'm sure I'm off, lol
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Old 04-22-2010, 09:01 AM   #264
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You are clearly in the majority seeing that 80% of a once great Club have left the club.

The lawsuit is a last ditch attempt to brake the strangle hold that the current Leadership has and return the Clubs management to the current members and reopen it to those that once saw advantage in membership.

Most that have knowledge of the actions and directions currently being exercised know this will only allow the Leadership to ride the treasure to zero leaving a shell to be sold off at auction. Yes we could wait till this happens and approach Thor or who ever buys the salvage for the license to use any copy written material and attempt to reorganize the Club around that

Waiting is most likely 10 years away during which time membership will continue to drop under the pressure of ever increasing dues and lack of connection to Royalty. Do those truly interested in the Club want to continue to pump monies into this rat hole for the sole enjoyment of this disconnected group? Increasing numbers are saying no and just leaving thus reducing any core of individuals necessary to support a revised Club. Thus it is now or never.

Many have been reading this thread and have not yet grasp the seriousness at hand. Hopefully you will not look back a few years from now and say this Club could have been saved.
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Old 04-22-2010, 09:34 AM   #265
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On the lighter side

This could be us without the suit and ties.

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Old 04-30-2010, 06:23 AM   #266
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Impresive letter,

but it's my understanding that Mr. Emerick is running from the floor NEXT year, not this year. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f286...tml#post834444
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