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Old 11-08-2009, 06:39 PM   #15
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Andy
I don't think this group is too ridged. The mods here pretty much let me speak my mind.Janet has always been here for me if I have a technical problem,and that's as it should be. I don't mean to be degrading to any one person althought I have been called names in some PM's. Its the way that the WBCCI is run. I as an outsider can clearly see why the national is in trouble. The whole thing is about money and power and I don't hve enough of either to make a difference.
There are great people who make up WBCCI, its a shame that those who pour their heart and soul into it are being taken.
Yes Carol we have always had fun.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:19 PM   #16
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Mokeypants…. I couldn’t agree more! We have only had our Airstream 2 weeks and We are finding that one of the major draws to owning an airstream (beside a cool quality trailer) was the instant bond supposedly with other airstream owners. Granted I didn’t go trolling the forums prior to buying it (maybe I should have), but I can’t believe the politics involved with the WBCCI and others. Who knows what is right. All I know is that there is discord in a group of people that should be having fun.
I don’t know anyone on this forum other than by posts I have read and the VAP. I have to go back to what PeeWee has said before, “Just have fun”. I agree, there has to be some order, there has to be mutual respect and there has to be camaraderie. I looked forward to meeting people that have been doing this for 40 years. Experience is a great teacher if you are listening, a cruel master if you are experiencing.
I never even heard of Mr. Byam, until I started seriously looking into getting an Airstream. I have heard enough about him to know I would like to learn more. I also don’t understand the issues with the National events. Haven’t we learned tolerance? So what if there is pomp and circumstance. So what if someone says grace. I mean, it never bothered me. We have become a nation of individuals, unwilling and unable to put up with others differences that we disagree with. Granted I like a nice adult beverage as much as the next guy, but if I am with a group of those who don’t partake, than I will abstain.
Sorry, this got a little off topic.
I am not just talking to be heard, here is my solution. If everyone is concerned with having fresh blood in the WBCCI, then maybe those members of the WBCCI should make that a priority. They could have someone on the board that has less than 2 years in the organization. This way they always have a fresh point of view. Maybe we as a group could just accept our difference and look to the common good/goal. A group of Airstream owners (not like minded, what fun would that be!) who are joined in a common experience: owning an airstream and having fun! Nothing more, nothing less!
The problem too many times with younger members like myself is we think we know it all. Maybe we do, maybe we don’t.
This post is in no way meaning any disrespect to the original poster, 62overlander, just my thoughts to continue the discussion. Frank, your points seem valid. I understand your frustration. But I also believe that no one can be silenced in America, as you have pointed out by using this forum! The membership has gone from 28,000 to 6,000. After the brief introduction I have had, it probably won’t go to 6,001. But on the other hand it probably will. What’s an Airstream without the cool red numbers! My point is that if it is going to succeed than it will, if not it won’t. However the local clubs will always be there! I look forward to trailering (SP?) to the Baltimore/Washington area to join you for a rally and pancakes!
Like Shackleton, Byam was faced with a mission, to promote his product and the success of the caravan. I am sure he never forgot those 2 points, as I am sure he never forgot to raise his glass in thanks and good cheer! We keep forgetting the true rarity of great leaders. We forget the principles that they stood for; Success of the mission, and the people carrying out that mission. Everything else is just fluff.
In the end we shouldn’t be upset with those current leaders who don’t live up to the likes of Wally Byam. That is a pretty tall request. If the current WBCCI fails, than it fails. I am sure there will always be an airstream organization, just as I am sure my airstream will be around for another 50 years!
In the end I think I am going to go out and get some random numbers and put them on the front of my trailer. Now the only question is what color? Maybe green, that will keep everyone guessing and us laughing. Which is the point of having a trailer…to have fun! (thanks PeeWee for the insight!)
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:48 PM   #17
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Andy
I don't think this group is too ridged. The mods here pretty much let me speak my mind.Janet has always been here for me if I have a technical problem,and that's as it should be. I don't mean to be degrading to any one person althought I have been called names in some PM's. Its the way that the WBCCI is run. I as an outsider can clearly see why the national is in trouble. The whole thing is about money and power and I don't hve enough of either to make a difference.
There are great people who make up WBCCI, its a shame that those who pour their heart and soul into it are being taken.
Yes Carol we have always had fun.
Again spoke from someone who has NEVER been a part of the club.

Outsiders such as yourself don't have a clue. Us that are in the middle of it have the real understanding. I don't feel "taken" and I just paid my dues for 2010, come join us, the WI Unit as other progressive Units continue to grow!. BTW, we just had event this weekend and added ANOTHER member, I guess it goes to show there is light at the end of the tunnel Roger!
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:50 PM   #18
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Again spoke from someone who has NEVER been a part of the club.

BTW, we just had event this weekend and added ANOTHER member, I guess it goes to show there is light at the end of the tunnel Roger!

Oh ya thats 23 yes 23 new members this year that do enjoy us!!!!!
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:09 PM   #19
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Like Dave and Felicia we have just purchased our first Airstream. I have been following the discourse on the forum regarding the WBCCI. Should we join...shouldn't we join. In the end, we will only get out of it what we put into it. Last week I met a great couple from Punxsutawney, PA who belong to the WDCU. They were very encouraging and I can't wait to get out and camp with other Airstreamers. Whether right or wrong...looks like there will be 6002 members...we joined!
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Old 11-08-2009, 09:07 PM   #20
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Welcome aboard, Roadrunner! Hope to meet you soon at a WDCU rally.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:00 PM   #21
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Unfortunately the WBCCI Forum is only a place for positive thought. If anything negative is discussed, the post is either removed for "harsh words" or parts are moved else where to break up the context of the discussion. This tactic makes having a mature discussion impossible. Many very serious club members have attempted to talk about real issues facing our future and they are quickly silenced or the thread is locked out.
Frank,
I totally agree. I have chosen to remain silent on the WBCCI forums for some time for a variety of reasons, but I do log in every once in a while to look around. I am dismayed to see threads constantly moved (that even happened to one I started before I entered "silent" mode). I see that differing opinions are basically not tolerated. Posts are removed and moderators note that one is approaching "the line" when merely making a polite post that differs in opinion.

All that said, yesterday I was almost moved to break my silence and participate in a thread on the WBCCI forums - that is until I saw that the thread was already locked. Then I saw another interesting thread and it was locked, too. I guess the moderators think they know when we should stop discussing a topic.

That is no way to run a forum. I will not participate as long as it is an over moderated "pleasantville" (as someone else has termed it). If we cannot openly debate issues of importance to the club, even in the private "members only" section, then forums has no purpose for being. If things do not change, I predict that it will quickly become as irrelevant and underutilized as the old WBCCI forums it replaced. And that is a sad development.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:32 PM   #22
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I am not an "outsider". I have an Airstream and participate in this Forum.

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Old 11-08-2009, 10:57 PM   #23
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I am dismayed by the people who will tell you that if you are a member, you have some special understanding over those who do not. I do not quite understand the assumption that if you somehow pay your $55 plus unit dues, you are somehow "In The Know". You absolutely, positively do not need to be a member to make an informed decision about the club and its status. That $55 doesn’t give you extra special experiences that somehow makes you better.
In the end it is about camping and enjoying your Airstream with other like minded people. Whether you do that as only an AirForums member, a WBCCI member or some combination of the two – you are no better or worse than somebody else – no matter what others say.
I am an Insider in more ways than one and I love to contribute to WBCCI & the VAC. Not everybody appreciates that contribution but most do. I, despite my misgivings about the direction WBCCI is going, contribute because I can. I also have contributed on these forums when called.
I believe that people on the outside should not be treated like the plague but always thought of as a potential member of WBCCI just waiting to be won over.
In that light, the only question is “What do we need to do to WIN them over?” Once you answer that and act upon it, you have a turnaround in membership numbers and the health of the club.
Personally, I like hearing from the outsiders – if I were in charge of WBCCI – they would be my barometer. So you outsiders – SPEAK UP – be heard. Somebody is going to listen and when they do, they will have your hearts and support. Those with the deaf ear will not.
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:06 AM   #24
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Oh ya thats 23 yes 23 new members this year that do enjoy us!!!!!
A growing Unit!!! Excellent news. This great influx wouldn't have anything to do with two Units disbanding in your region would it?
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:19 AM   #25
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I am dismayed by the people who will tell you that if you are a member, you have some special understanding over those who do not. I do not quite understand the assumption that if you somehow pay your $55 plus unit dues, you are somehow "In The Know". You absolutely, positively do not need to be a member to make an informed decision about the club and its status. That $55 doesn’t give you extra special experiences that somehow makes you better.
In the end it is about camping and enjoying your Airstream with other like minded people. Whether you do that as only an AirForums member, a WBCCI member or some combination of the two – you are no better or worse than somebody else – no matter what others say.
I am an Insider in more ways than one and I love to contribute to WBCCI & the VAC. Not everybody appreciates that contribution but most do. I, despite my misgivings about the direction WBCCI is going, contribute because I can. I also have contributed on these forums when called.
I believe that people on the outside should not be treated like the plague but always thought of as a potential member of WBCCI just waiting to be won over.
In that light, the only question is “What do we need to do to WIN them over?” Once you answer that and act upon it, you have a turnaround in membership numbers and the health of the club.
Personally, I like hearing from the outsiders – if I were in charge of WBCCI – they would be my barometer. So you outsiders – SPEAK UP – be heard. Somebody is going to listen and when they do, they will have your hearts and support. Those with the deaf ear will not.
Tim, usually I agree with you fully. I think you are a very sharp man and had come to that conclusion before we met this past summer...
You statement is somewhat flawed. To say someone knows about something with out experience is just flawed in my eyes. That is on the same plane as me saying I just read this book on brain surgery and now I am ready to put you under. What if the book was written by someone that did not know what they were doing? What if they were basing cerebral dissection on the writings of some one that had written about it? I feel you cannot be an expert until you have walked the trail.

Though I have no doubt that Mikethefixit had a very bad experience attempting to see what the WBCCI was about, what if he had the first encounter was you or I? What if his first rally ever had been Cherry Blossom or family camping at Baker Acres?
If that had happened, he might just be sitting in a totally different Lazyboy pointing his anger in a totally different direction.
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Old 11-10-2009, 06:55 AM   #26
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Frank,

I think there is a difference between the camping experience and political experience.
If Mike is talking about what I think he is talking about - he is mentioning that the club has problems that if left unchecked, will serve to further the decline in membership. You do not have to be a dues paying member to see that. There is enough discussion right here on these forums to form a reasonably informed opinion about the health of the club from any stand point.

From the perspective of camping, you are right - Mikes experience with either you or I could make or break him . That experience would not be based on the health of the club, but rather the quality of our character in welcoming him. That is why the Units are the true backbone of the WBCCI. If the experience at that level is not good, you will lose a member.

As an analogy to what Mike was saying as I interpreted it, lets say that someone who has never been a member of WBCCI states that the club sucks - that would probably be an unfair blanket assessment. If that same person states that the club is not for him because of the red coats and marching bands, that would be a fair assessment. If that person said that Red Numbers on your trailer were stupid, that would obviously be an inappropriate assessment. And, if that non-member says that there are great people in WBCCI but the leadership is blowing it for the club, that would be a fair assessment.

And as I was trying to point out - you do not need to be a $55+ dues paying member to come to conclusions that are fair and astute. Beyond that , I think we are actually all on the same page.
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:38 AM   #27
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Is it just me, or did more than a few posts get dropped here?
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:42 AM   #28
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Is it just me, or did more than a few posts get dropped here?
There was a computer glitch, that caused a bunch of posts to disappear, about a half days worth, according to Janet, one of the mods.

Apparently, they cannot be retrieved either.

I lost about 6 posts myself.

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