Not Going to International

[Buttercup]

I know there is a serious question there but I can't see it from laughing so hard.
I think a serious gamble was taken that 1100 rigs could have shown up based on the seemingly cyclical bounces the years prior had seen and the centralized location should have helped. But it didn't.
I don't exactly but the high cost of fuel because it was much higher for Bozeman.

As for comparing membership numbers with the attendance of International, I could not do that here from work. Kimber spent 15 minutes on the phone reading me the data and I just typed in what I could. I might play with that if nobody else does.
What is not deniable is that there has been a general trend down for years and years. it is just a simple fact - you apply your own meaning to it.

[WineStream]

Originally Posted by Buttercup

As for comparing membership numbers with the attendance of International, I could not do that here from work. Kimber spent 15 minutes on the phone reading me the data and I just typed in what I could.

I want your job. Airforums is "blocked" with out internet access at work (probably a good thing for me) and I wish I had time to chart the data as dictated from Andrea for 15 min.

[Buttercup]

Really? want to know how to get in anyway?

[WineStream]

Yeah, I know there's proxys and so forth and anonymizing programs. But, it's quite clear in our employee handbook that the usage of such things are grounds for dismissal. Not something I'm interested in at this point. I've got enough time at home to get through the Airforums. Like I said, it could be a bad thing for me. I'd spend not much time working and lots of time posting.

[87MH]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

I don't know how to do graphs, but could you possibly plot the estimated 1515 to 2000 registrations and the break even number of 1200 registrations Mr. Larson expected for last year's International? That was the one where his contract negotiation skills ultimately cost the club $103,279.76.

Here's a graph I kept until the "President's Letter" was unavailable.
You may have to double click the graph to enlargen it to make it readable.



Here is a better shot of just the graph.



Seems to me that projected participation numbers were obviously unattainable from the very start.

Military thinking - go figure. Makes one wonder where and how "fiscal responsibility" should fit into the "officers code".

Maybe this years "leadership" will follow through or "stand down".

Yes, the "rank and file" of the club IS interested in what the leadership proposes AND how it follows through.

Time for transparency and change is long past - maybe too late.

[mistral blue]

Thank you Dennis!

It looks like more than 200 folks chose to not pay the extra $$$ for 30 amp at Madison.
(Hmm, how can we squeeze some money outta THESE folks?)
This year, however, members do not have that option. (Gotcha!)

Raising fees and raising dues seems to be the new preferred tactic to offset the self-inflicted collateral damage of lower member participation.
And, apparently, this collateral damage is deemed acceptable.

The message is finally becoming loud and clear.
Our leaders WANT a smaller club.
They want, "Quality over quantity!"

If that's truly the case, they should just go ahead and raise dues by $5,000/year and call themselves a country club.

[RickDavis]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

Thank you Dennis!

It looks like more than 200 folks chose to not pay the extra $$$ for 30 amp at Madison.
.

It was more like 270 as the graph stops in may. A lot must have made the decision to attend after that.

If only half don't go to Gillette thats still losing a lot of trailers.

[StingrayL82]

Originally Posted by atobols

...So it begs the question of how Bozeman, a proven good venue, only produces an attendance number of 871 in 2008?!? There's no question that the location is not an issue...

Well, Jason, like Tim said, the price of fuel was high in 2008; I was paying $4.97/gal for diesel. Our Sovereign stayed in its garage that year, given that our King Ranch gets about 11MPG towing.

[Buttercup]

Actually, considering fuel prices for that year, that rally was well attended. But what should have been a banner year for 2009, Madison should have met the mark. Should have but didn't despite the centralized location - close to Canada and reduced fuel prices. So why didn't madison measure up?

[WineStream]

Originally Posted by StingrayL82

Well, Jason, like Tim said, the price of fuel was high in 2008; I was paying $4.97/gal for diesel. Our Sovereign stayed in its garage that year, given that our King Ranch gets about 11MPG towing.

According to the WBCCI's own research which concluded that gas prices couldn't be a factor (old survey said participants would pay up to $5/gal in like 1975 or so), you should have been willing to pay that to travel to national! Funny, one of their rationale points for why over $100k needs to be transferred to from the general fund to the int'l rally fund is that gas prices are preventing people from traveling. I guess they call it whichever way it's convenient for them.

I didn't own my AS when gas was $4.50 a gallon. Having just bought my AS last Feb. and having paid maybe max. $3/gallon for gas in the V10 Excursion this past calendar year in order to travel; I'd honestly say that if the destination is worth it, I'd pay $4.50/gal at 9.5MPG towing to get there. Lucky for my wallet, we're not going to Gillette this year either. I too am going to the WBBB and Andrea and I are still planning where we will go the week after July 4 when my co. will be "shutdown" for the week. We haven't figured gas prices into the equation. It's all about camping.

[Pahaska]

We had made other plans long before a resignation and an illness propelled me into unit Presidency. Someone else is going to carry our flags if they get carried at all.

I have been to four Internationals. We had 30a electricity at Springfield and Perry; it gets mighty hot and damp in those places. We had 3a electricity at Bozeman and Madison and didn't suffer a bit. We would prefer 3a at the lower cost at Gillette, also, if we were going. We travel with 2 cats and we do not leave them unattended depending on the AC to keep the trailer cool. That reduces the value of 30a for us.

Forcing everyone to pay for full hookups ay Gillette is going to cost registrations.

[Buttercup]

I was slated to give a multi-part lecture at the International on building/improving a unit web site using free software like WordPress, Gimp and the WBCCI.net infrastructure. It was designed to boose units and regions presence in the internet.
I notified the organizer today that we would not be going to International after all due to the cost of the event and due to the baloney that is going on within the club leadership, funding, etc.
I already know about vendors not going this year - all in all it should be a very exciting and entertaining year for all who actually attend - NOT!

[mistral blue]

At this time last year there were 683 registered for International.

One year later, President Tom Collier announced at yesterday's Mid-Winter that there were 620 registered for Gillette....

Year after year, decade after decade, more and more people are finding NO VALUE in attending the International rally.
They are already doing as PIP Jerry Larson so bitterly and shrilly suggested and are "boycotting" all of the arrogance, all of the pomposity, all of the irrelevance.

(I still can't believe Mr. Larson actually estimated 1515 to 2000 registrations.)

Originally Posted by 87MH

Here's a graph I kept until the "President's Letter" was unavailable.
You may have to double click the graph to enlargen it to make it readable.



Here is a better shot of just the graph.



Seems to me that projected participation numbers were obviously unattainable from the very start.

Military thinking - go figure. Makes one wonder where and how "fiscal responsibility" should fit into the "officers code".

Maybe this years "leadership" will follow through or "stand down".

Yes, the "rank and file" of the club IS interested in what the leadership proposes AND how it follows through.

Time for transparency and change is long past - maybe too late.

[RickDavis]

Originally Posted by mistral blue

At this time last year there were 683 registered for International.

I think it is worth noting that 189 of those registered at this time were for 3 amp. They ended up with around 270 in 3 amp.
Fuel prices at least for diesel , were at least $2.00 a gal. less than 2008 where 800 trailers showed up at Bozeman. Madison is much closer to many population centers so fuel price is not a valid excuse.

I have heard break even numbers of 700-750 for this year as it appears Tom has a better grasp of reality than Jerry did. (or does)

None the less, if 3 amp had not been eliminated I think he would have about made his numbers by now. For sure he would have 1 more as we would have signed up at Madison.

[mistral blue]

To me at least, the fact that YOU are not going is significant.

It's obvious, however, that the International elites really couldn't care less.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by RickDavis

I have heard break even numbers of 700-750 for this year as it appears Tom has a better grasp of reality than Jerry did. (or does)

Gillette break even - 750 trailers x $500 (approx) = $375,000

Madison break even - 1200 trailers x $500 (approx) = $600,000

Doing the math, the break even at Madison was $225,000 more than Gillette - divided by the 900 trailers in Madison = $250 per trailer!!!

Why did we need such and expensive venue? And if the break even for Gillette is so much less... why are the rally fees not less?

[Buttercup]

How about makeup for the losses last year??

[wkerfoot]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Gillette break even - 750 trailers x $500 (approx) = $375,000

Madison break even - 1200 trailers x $500 (approx) = $600,000

Doing the math, the break even at Madison was $225,000 more than Gillette - divided by the 900 trailers in Madison = $250 per trailer!!!

Why did we need such and expensive venue? And if the break even for Gillette is so much less... why are the rally fees not less?

That would take an analysis of the costs for each rally on a per trailer basis. I really don't care to do the analysis but the budget for Gillette and the actuals for Madison are available.

Part of the answer may be the fixed costs allocated over fewer units.

Bill

[robandzoe]

Originally Posted by byamcaravanner

Gillette break even - 750 trailers x $500 (approx) = $375,000

Madison break even - 1200 trailers x $500 (approx) = $600,000

Doing the math, the break even at Madison was $225,000 more than Gillette - divided by the 900 trailers in Madison = $250 per trailer!!!

Why did we need such and expensive venue? And if the break even for Gillette is so much less... why are the rally fees not less?

Since it's at a Camplex, and infrastructure is in place, and Madison had a ton more to do (draw, offerings), I thought it would be alot cheaper too... but was told that all sites are back ins, so the parking committee would be bigger.. perhaps those who go are paying their way while they prepare and train on how to help Trailer and MH owners back up their rigs.... that the parking committee had to be bigger than Madison's...

make up for losses... interesting.. hmmmm maybe you're onto something there Buttercup.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by wkerfoot

That would take an analysis of the costs for each rally on a per trailer basis.

Bill,

My question was rhetorical... the point I was making is that choosing a better venue for the Madison rally (not a convention center) could have offered a rally fee savings of $135 per trailer and a balance budget.