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Old 12-03-2006, 08:32 PM   #15
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Our unit 14 El Camino Real was changed from San Bernardino a couple of years ago. I believe that that the official name includes "California" somewhere in it but we never use the full name. If they want a state name give them a state name.

illegitimi non carborundum

Good luck and I hope you succeed.

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Old 12-03-2006, 09:36 PM   #16
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On the fence???

artlink - nice job on that logo and in any event I hope you are using it now.

Safari64 - your post broght to me a thought. You stated that you thought about joining the club but with this issue will not (I paraphrased). I have a question (and perhaps a poll).

How many people are on the fence about joining the club and will do so if the name changes?

How many people are in the club, sitting on the fence of leaving, will leave if the name change goes through?

Or for that matter...

How many people are on the fence about joining the club and will just walk away if the name changes?

How many people are in the club, sitting on the fence of leaving, will stay if the name change goes through?

And after you have thought about all of that I have a question for the members who are sitting on the fence of leaving WBCCI right now, What would convince you to stay? Is it a name or is it the programs and services that need to be looked at. Why are you on the fence???
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Old 12-03-2006, 11:41 PM   #17
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Wow...this sounds like the kinda club I've been looking for.
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Old 12-04-2006, 07:01 AM   #18
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Aarrrggghhhh!!!!!

First: The rational provided for the name change is not even correct. A majority of the members did NOT vote for WBACI, a slight majority of the delegates did, some flipping there AOAI "no" votes to WBACI "yes" votes and irritating their units in the process. Is the San Joaquin Unit really trying to tear this club apart? Maybe all WBCCI members opposed to this proposal should send messages to region twelve telling them of our distaste to this proposal and nip it in the bud before it gets out of hand again. But I don't think I have the energy to fight this again. I (as a previously strong WBCCI supporter) may have to vote the only way they will notice and not renew next year. As the say "Money talks and WBACI walks".

Second: If the Four Corners comment is true and WBCCI leadership is going to require a name change to add a state name, they are stupid. The 4CU is one of the most positive things to come forward in WBCCI in a long time. The club should be bending over backwards to encourage the founding of this unit, if nothing more than an experiment and a sign that the club is open to change, and if it succeeds, as a role model for other future units. If Club Leadership can't see this they may just give me one more reason to quit. If the club enforces this demand on the proposed 4CU I am truely sorry that I enouraged the 4CU founders to keep at it after my discussion with the WBCCI International President. You will have my sincerest appology.

In the end, changing the name of the club will do nothing positive for it - just drive some current members away. A name change, if not accompanied by real attitude and procedure changes is just a waste of club resources. What's almost more frustrating is that a real change, like admiting the 4CU is apparently being actively discouraged. In addition to disgruntling a lot of fine folks that put this proposal together, denying this charter or making unnecessary requirements like adding a state name will have a further effect of causing some current members from other units to quit over the principle of the thing and other people to never join WBCCI in the first place.
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Old 12-04-2006, 07:13 AM   #19
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This is just plain ridiculous. I think I am going to remove my numbers from my trailer now before they make a permanent mark. That way when I drop out of WBCCI or what ever it will be called. It will not leave a permanent park.

I was excited when I joined WBCCI. Now I think I will just attend Forum Gatherings/Rally's
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Old 12-04-2006, 09:07 AM   #20
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[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecatsandi
This is just plain ridiculous. I think I am going to remove my numbers from my trailer now before they make a permanent mark. That way when I drop out of WBCCI or what ever it will be called. It will not leave a permanent mark.
I already had ghost numbers then I put mine over the top of the ghosts so if we quit now we will be left with a double ghost. That is the only reason I agreed to send in my tremendously high dues for another year. I will quit as soon as someone figures out a way to remove the ghosts.
I wonder if the "Harley Davidson Owners Group" or HOG ever thought of changing their name to something like "Bill and Art's Riding Club?" Then the members of the BARC could go around trying to explain who or what they belong to.
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Old 12-04-2006, 10:51 AM   #21
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Formal vs. informal unit name

Quote:
Originally Posted by 66Overlander
First: Second: If the Four Corners comment is true and WBCCI leadership is going to require a name change to add a state name, they are stupid. The 4CU is one of the most positive things to come forward in WBCCI in a long time. The club should be bending over backwards to encourage the founding of this unit, if nothing more than an experiment and a sign that the club is open to change, and if it succeeds, as a role model for other future units. If Club Leadership can't see this they may just give me one more reason to quit. If the club enforces this demand on the proposed 4CU I am truely sorry that I enouraged the 4CU founders to keep at it after my discussion with the WBCCI International President. You will have my sincerest appology.
Hi Joe:

My understanding is that including a state name in the formal unit name, as opposed to the unit name actually used for most purposes, is simply a WBCCI bylaw requirement that was overlooked by the 4CU organizers. It's very simple and no trouble to add a state name to meet the bylaw requirment, then use it only when formally required. I occasionally use my full formal name for important documents, but simply go by "Fred" all other times. It's the same theory and practice for a unit, nothing to get upset over Joseph ....er, Joe.
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Old 12-04-2006, 02:12 PM   #22
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For what its worth, 50 years of tradition and sole ownership for the WBCCI happens to mean something to me. Owning an AS which has roots going back 75 years also means something to me. Why can't everyone just be happy with things the way they are. Forget the incredible costs to all the regions, chapters and members for the name change; ei. pins, hats, shirts, flags, decals on our trailers, letterhead, business cards, and hundreds of other items, why? I see no reason to a change in the name nor a reason to hand the rights to our name off to any corporation, who ever they may be. I know, Airstream can change their name to Wally Byam Mfg. Company and the club can change its name to Airstream Owners Club. Please, there are so many other things that this organiztion needs to adjust for its welfare other than this mess again. Long live WBCCI!
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Old 01-15-2007, 09:33 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
The real problem here is why after 51 successful years as the WBCCI would a club even consider taking a different tact? If someone owns a unit and wants to find a club how hard is that exactly (be careful I KNOW the answers )?

So if the club has a real history -- has a name that took it to a peak of 25,000 member families -- WHAT could possibly be gained by signing a contract with the trademark holder that puts THEM in control of US?

There's an old estimated cost of $23K-$100K to change the name. Where's the payback? We're all hauling these shiny rounded (mine is more rounded than yours ) RVs all over the country. That draws plenty of attention in itself. The red numbers have done exactly the same (imagine that exposure just by having red numbers on a round shiny vehicle).

The alternate view is that the club is more valuable left alone. It is what it has been. Nothing in the way of a name change is going to change the club in any tangible way. It's purely a sounds good effort. The downside is that it puts our corporation into a subservient position with another corporation.

From a corporate point of view it's a no brainer. The inclusion of the name is not permanent. It is not unrestricted nor irrevocable. Why would anyone want our corporation to be controlled by another corporation? If you don't care that the name can be withdrawn at any time in the future and you'll have to rename OUR corporation again then I guess it might look good because it sounds good.

But with nothing to be gained I think you'll find the vintage crowd prefers somebody goes and fixes something that needs fixing INSTEAD...

__
Howdy all. I am not a member, but have considered joining. However, my work and family "leash" prevents much time away from home, and that limits my participation.

What was said by 65GT seems to ring clear with me as an outsider looking in. A significant amount of money can be spent on name changes as corporations acquire corps (swallow?), or are taken over. Some would argue that that name-change money is wasted; I generally agree.

WBCCI has on it's website "The Wally Byam Caravan Club is now one of the largest clubs in trailering, and it is a remarkable tribute to Wally. It demonstrates once more, and in an excellent way, the effect he had upon those around him. Most men would have insisted upon controlling the club; Wally let his followers keep control."

They did not include "Airstream" in the name. I don't know why, but IMHO, I think the name should be left alone (as if anybody cares what I think about that).
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Old 01-15-2007, 09:43 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil and/or Sue

They did not include "Airstream" in the name. I don't know why, but IMHO, I think the name should be left alone (as if anybody cares what I think about that).
It's great to hear everyone's opinion,especially from those outside the club for their perspective.
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Old 01-15-2007, 12:18 PM   #25
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Before I let my membership slide I was for the name change. I know that's sacrilege to lot of people out there but I thought it might be one small step in bringing new life to an old and (in my opinion only) outdated club. Now , I've completly change my mind. I now think , after reading about all the disagreements about most anything related to the WBCCI on this forum that it should be left alone. The people that love the WBCCI and all it represents should have it the way it is and pretty much always will be. But..what's needed (maybe) is a new Airstream Club. Something completely seperate from WBCCI for all those who simply don't want to spend their free time trying to change or fit into a club that really if it ever changes at all will be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century. I know my views aren't going to win a lot of friends among the club supporters but aside from this forum there are propably a lot of Airtream owners out there who may want to belong to an Airstream club but the WBCCI just doesn't offer then remotely what they're looking for. I love my grandparents and like to visit them but I don't hang out with them or their friends, and I don't try to change their views because it would just be an exercise in futility. The people in my unit were wonderful people but besides from the fact that we all owned an Airstream we were lightyears apart. It wasn't them it was us we just didn't fit in. We weren't old enough in years or thinking to really become a part of the group. I don't think most of these old timers are in any way ready for change . So maybe a new Airstream Clup existing along side the traditional club would really solve a lot of problems.
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Old 01-15-2007, 01:52 PM   #26
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Craftsman,

I really appreciate the passion you put into that message. I detect a level of desire to have a better club but see that the vision is just not there. I wanted to offer some comment.
I respect people who desire the name change as well as those of us who do not. I approach the subject with the impression that those who want the name change want to have a more vibrant club. I will not debate the pros and cons of the name change now because it has all been said before. I think the underlying theme is that change is needed and little change has come along.
What impressed me most about your post is the reasoning you gave for feeling like you didn't belong as it were. There does seem to be a deep divide as it were between the old guard and the younger at heart members. I can say that I saw a big difference between the "regular" members and the VAC types (of which i am a proud member). The VAC types just seem to have more fun and are seemingly ready for anything. Heck, you almost have to be to keep some of these old rigs on the road!
I like the WBCCI for it's history and I for one hope to be around to see it change and grow into a more youthful and less regimented club. I hope to contribute to that change.
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Old 01-15-2007, 02:02 PM   #27
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With the release of the 2007 WBCCI Directory it is a good time to review the membership total compared to last year.
The trend continues These are official Home Office Numbers.

2006 WBCCI Directory total--6919 Members

2007 WBCCI Directory total--6549 Members

Net loss--370 Members


According to GT65, there were 25,000 WBCCI members at one time! And if you consider that Thor sells 2000 AS units a year, then the membership retention problem is far more serious than a simple name change!

I'm waiting to see how the 4CU decision comes out and will send my check in post haste if it is approved.

Some where down the line, another club is going to crop up with the name AirStream in it and it should hit 5000 members in 24 months if it is done right.
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Old 01-15-2007, 02:04 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artstream
Oh boy, here we go again, and I just finished designing the logo for Region 9, Heart Of Texas Camping Unit!

Thanks for the heads-up, B'cup.

Michael
Beautiful logo! Here's the New England Unit's new logo - we love it and it proudly displays the name of our club: Wally Byam Caravan Club International.
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