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Old 03-09-2006, 11:14 PM   #57
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hi b cup......so i guess you're talking to me again? nice....

my point about the wb delagate and committee folks posting here is that they aren't high volume web forum types...and some of the replys (to them) that others of us would just deflect (thick skinned) may not work well directed toward them....i didn't post that i or anyone else here....was nice always.....

also i didn't give you advice.....
i offered a suggestion (for 65gt also) on how to reach wb members and get the ball rolling to turn off the name change....
my suggestion is just an idea......
and i'm fine if you think it isn't a useful approach or you think my motives aren't sincere....
how would you like to reach wb membership and influence their views with info....THEY AIN'T HERE BRO'

now about that issue of who owns the forums and by implication.....that thor/airstream inc is pulling strings....

i had occasion to look some things up myself of this.....
and reached the same conclusion as you......
it was explained to me (and i could be stating this incorrectly) that thor now owns the 'airstreamforums' name and one of the ip addresses...but that andyr still actually owns the forum content....


also you may find it useful (or not) to know that there used to be two publications......
the bb and the caravaner...
the first was wb property and the latter thor/airstreams....
and each was written/published and mailed separately by wb or thor......

in 92' when membership issues were a big concern (like now).... the 2 combined.......

wb agreed to write/format/publish the content of the combined publication....

and thor/airstream agreed to PAY for the publication and mailing....

this combined bb/caravaner was inked at 80,000 copies and mailed to 60,000 households.....a considerable expense for thor/air and done in an attempt to help the wbcci keep, gain and grow....

so i don't think thor/air has any sinister agenda here....a healthy club is good for them too....my understanding is that they only want the the club clearly distinguished from the company....

as for a splinter/new club.......
FMCA used to have an airstream subgroup....is it still active.....

does anyone know?

cheers
2air'
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Old 03-09-2006, 11:52 PM   #58
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Wait! I am a B cup. But I figure with a little exercise, less drinking, I could get that down to AA.


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Old 03-10-2006, 12:34 AM   #59
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Dial it down! We all have opinions but several recent posts are on the edge of violating the "Be nice" policy. It is not our intent to censor but when posts get personal the moderation team will get busy. Not fun for us - and not good for exchange of ideas, but sometimes necessary.

If you are not sure what you are posting is acceptable - don't post! If you think you're pushing the envelope - you probably are. Just don't go there.

Fair warning...

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Old 03-10-2006, 12:58 AM   #60
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Let me say this as simply as possible. I am tired of hearing the same stuff over and over (I know, I shouldn't click on these threads). I think this direction is destructive, not constructive. I think you are doing more damage to the club than you are helping.

What you (and I refer to both Buttercup and 65GT as the people who keep these threads going) ARE doing is influencing people who might otherwise join to stay away, because you imply the WBCCI board is corrupt and in some sort of cahoots with the evil entity Thor (which you say even owns this forum) and none of which is true. I believe you have made these conspiracy theorys up with no evidence to back them up.

Those people who chose to stay away because of this one little topic will never know how much fun a good local unit is and how irrelevant the whole name change issue is in relation to what your local experience will be.

And that's what ticks me off. And I apologize if I mixed up Buttercup and 65GTs experience, or which of you used the A**stream name, or if I offended you personally. I think we have all been cut plenty of slack in our impassioned responses to these issues, so I hope you would do the same for me.

And BTW, yes, you can report me, and the other mods can edit my posts and give me the smackdown, just like anyone else. And I'll take it, because I stand behind what I said.
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Old 03-10-2006, 01:03 AM   #61
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It's here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
I'm sure Shari can give you verbatim on what the original motion was -- I can't touch it...
Post #231 in this thread

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Old 03-10-2006, 02:58 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Janet
Just to clear this up.. While Thor has rights to the domain name they do not own this site or the content contained here. This site is privately owned, by one individual. The site could be migrated to a new URL, new servers, heck - even sold to a new owner... but Thor does not control, govern or otherwise have input here.

Last year they sent out nasty-grams to many businesses using the word Airstream in their titles. Some businesses changed their names e.g. Airstream Dreams became Vintage trailer supply. Others, like this one, wishing to keep it's name chose different paths.
Coincidently, now that you mention it, besides those businesses I just stumbled upon this law suit today from another Airstreamers' site.

http://dayton.bizjournals.com/dayton...06/story3.html
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Old 03-10-2006, 06:38 AM   #63
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I wrote this yesterday, just before I lost my computer connection so I didn't get it posted before the thread took off in other directions. Thanks for bearing with me and my server problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by insideout
dougjamie, my point was not that you should memorize the constitution & bylaws, but that every member should at least know they exist and look to them for guidance when questions on how things are done come up. I'm sure you are an asset to your unit, I'm just trying to encourage those with questions on how their unit is run, to look within.

Shari
I really didn't read "memorize" into what you said; I was just responding to what you wrote in reply to Chuck. I've met Chuck at our unit's rallies and I know he's a smart and nice guy and definitely an asset to our unit, and I'm sure he also knows to look for guidance on WBCCI issues from our units' leadership. I saw the humor in what he wrote (what you responded to) in that it doesn't seem like the unit leaders, and maybe even the region leaders, are getting any more information to distribute on this issue than the members are getting. There seems to be a communication problem in WBCCI.

Like Wheel Interested said, this is all healthy discourse and I appreciate the food for thought you gave.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Action
Buttercup,
I think YOU missed the point. This is the focus of their post. ------
"My purpose for joining was to get out with our Airstream trailer and enjoy it with my family and other like-minded people."
The name is not important, it's the people.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action
Actually, I think both the name and the people are important. My purpose for joining WBCCI was (based on my own interpretation after looking into what Wally Byam was all about) to find the joy that Wally Byam found in getting out with other people who appreciated the Airstream design and were up for the adventure, travel, and comraderie. The BB information on the upcoming vote said that those urging the change were operating under a survey comment that potential new members, new Airstream owners, didn't relate to Wally Byam. I find the opposite to be true. I don't relate to "Airstream Owners Association". To me the club is about what Wally envisioned, not about being in a group of other owners of the same brand of RV. Thanks, Action, for giving more to think about.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefrobrts
I am not shocked that they do not feel compelled to freely fill you latecomers in on everything you missed once you woke up and noticed what was going on.
Stef - I know you were talking to Buttercup, but I'm also one of the "you latecomers" and I just want to say that I don't think the "you snooze, you lose" argument works here. I joined last year just as the issue was coming up and I was not in on the vote. I received all the new member information from national and local and read as much as I could get through and I just didn't see anything on the issue. The WBCCI really has some communication problems that they need to work out and I'd just like to see them work these problems out before they make any more decisions of this magnitude.

-Jamie
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Old 03-10-2006, 09:08 AM   #64
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Name Change

Hello,
I'm new to everything Airstream, but I'm going to add my 2 cents worth.
I owned my Airstream less than a week when I found the WBCCI and I couldn't wait to join (I even requested the original number that is still visible on my '66). I got my first Blue Beret with my new member packet and read about the name change.....what the F@#%* (excuss my explitive deleted), but why would they want to change the name? As far as I can tell the WBCCI is recognized around the world and it's members are heralded as some of the nicest folks on earth, so why would anyone want to lose that? I think the new name is aweful and it is not memorable in any way, in fact I can't even recall what it was??? BUT, I can tell anyone who asks what the WBCCI stands for and is all about, not bad for a 2 week old member ay!
So, they can change the name, but as far as I'm concerned I'm a WBCCI member period! (sorry for the anger, but this just gets my chonies in a knot)
Robin out
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Old 03-10-2006, 09:15 AM   #65
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Thank you!

Your comments are the essence of want a few of us whiners and complainers have been saying and what many of the proponents have been trying hard to ignore - the name ain't what's broke.

And by the way, your expletive was exactly what my wife and I said when we heard about this as well.
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Old 03-10-2006, 11:04 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsideOut
The question on the ballot for the delegates to vote on will be whether or not to accept the name being presented, "Airstream Owners Association International Incorporated" per the recommendation of the IBT.

"Thus, Airstream Owners Association International, Incorporated will be the name presented to the membership for their vote."
.
.
.
If this new name is not accepted, the task of selecting a different new name will go back to the name selection committee to be voted on by the Delegates at a later date. Based on the Delegates vote in June 2005, the name will change, the only vote now is "to what".
I have another question -- this question is for those people with "vote no name change" avatar's. Why do you have avatar's that say "vote no name change" when the name change is a done deal? I'm just trying to understand where you are coming from.

From what Shari indicated in her post, the delegates voted "yes" to the name change last year so voting "no name change" doesn't seem to be an option here. It seems the only option is to vote on WHAT the new name will be not IF the name will change. Again, I'm just trying to understand.
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Old 03-10-2006, 11:18 AM   #67
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I hope someone else jumps in here that has a better grasp of the situation than I, but to be brief the way I understand it is;

It is a done deal in that the name (AOAI) is the name selected to be voted on, (rather than adding Airstream to the existing name as represented to the club initially,) at the upcoming International in July by the delegates. The proposed name is a done deal, the acceptance of it, is NOT! The vote taken was for the name to be presented to the club. That is why it is being stated and restated. I suspect there are more members in the club that don't realize they can vote locally to have their delegates refuse the name change. That fact is not being expounded upon and probably stategically so to insure its passage.
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Old 03-10-2006, 11:24 AM   #68
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While it is true that the delegates voted to ADD "Airstream" to the name, that is not what we got. Instead the name change committee, chaired by Roy Berndt, decided to create a new name altogether and a new identity (logo). In other words, it went way beyond what was ever proposed in the first place.

The "No" vote is important because it was not what was mandated for one and it is pure folly for another. In fact there are a whole host of reason that you can find on the forums here. But it is just simply a very bad move.

A no vote sends the whole thing back to wherever it came and also gives everyone the time to assess the process that is being taken here. Again, please do read some of the other threads on this - it can be quite enlightening.
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Old 03-10-2006, 11:26 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheel interested
I hope someone else jumps in here that has a better grasp of the situation than I, but to be brief the way I understand it is;

It is a done deal in that the name (AOAI) is the name selected to be voted on, (rather than adding Airstream to the existing name as represented to the club initially,) at the upcoming International in July by the delegates. The proposed name is a done deal, the acceptance of it, is NOT! The vote taken was for the name to be presented to the club. That is why it is being stated and restated. I suspect there are more members in the club that don't realize they can vote locally to have their delegates refuse the name change. That fact is not being expounded upon and probably stategically so to insure its passage.
I thought the "done deal" was that the name IS going to change. What I thought was NOT the done deal is WHAT the name will be. So, my understanding is that this June the delegates will vote either yes or no to if the name will be AOAI. If the majority is "yes" then the name will change to AOAI; if the majority is "no" then a new name will be decided on and presented to the delegates for voting. Am I missing something?
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Old 03-10-2006, 11:32 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
If you think I'm a miserable SOB you should be able to say that. There's playing nice, and there's being honest. I think you should play honest.
Now you know I never said anything of that sort. If that's what I thought I wouldn't have bothered responding at all! Saying that implies that that is my underlying motivation for stepping in with my opinion - and it's completely untrue.

As I understand it, it is a fact that the name change is a done deal - the only question is what will they change it to.

My opinion is that you can shout out to the forum forever and it won't do a damn thing to change the name change vote at International because you're not shouting to the right people. You're not accomplishing anything but bad feelings and giving outsiders a bad impression of what the club is about.

My opinion is that you (65GT and Buttercup) love having an issue to rant about, but I think in the process you are harming the club you claim to love so much. And the club exists no matter what the name is. If it ceases to be the WBCCI and becomes AOAI, it's still the same club. If I go to a rally before the name change and another after a name change, I don't think the rally will change much. Isn't that what really matters? Well, that's what matters to me anyway. What matters to you might be different.

I still think you are not going to change anything doing what you are doing here.

But that's all my opinion, and I'm entitled to it.
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