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Old 07-08-2011, 09:44 AM   #99
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How did I miss the 4 plastic torches? The lamestream media has failed again. Do these have plastic flames lit by batteries, or are those real flames?

As for the ceremonial photos, it looked like something from a banana republic—the march of the retired officers of the presidential guards.

I must have been isolated too long in this rural backwater. I had thought the 21st century had come, but apparently somewhere in North America certain people who died in the '50's have been given a special serum to allow them to come back and bring us back to the '50's. I always thought zombies had grey complexion and never smiled; modern science is amazing, isn't it? We'll ban that rock 'n' roll yet! I don't have those '50's clothes, but maybe I can wear doctoral robes to these things. I never did have a chance to wear that academic regalia before.

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Old 07-08-2011, 10:43 AM   #100
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I am glad the picture has finally been explained. I had no idea what it was.
Now if some one can tell me how to look at the Facebook links with out having to sign up.? It let me look at a couple pictures before shutting me off
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Old 07-08-2011, 12:16 PM   #101
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This thread has evolved from asking how to save the WBCCI to it's hopeless and let's make fun of it. As one if the perps of the latter, I thought I'd point out how we have taken the easy way out, or maybe the only realistic approach, confess our shameful or shameless behavior (how can both mean the same thing?) and save the WBCCI, perhaps by freezing it like the Nederland dead guy Frozen Dead Guy Days - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and saving it for future generations to see how life was once lived.

I guess I haven't been reformed.

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Old 07-08-2011, 03:30 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by 65GT View Post
When FB asks you to sign in just close the window and I think it will continue...


You mean that there isn't anybody here that bought their Airstream for this kind of fun, really?

Yeah, times are a changing... NOT!

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Clicking past the log in screen every few pictures worked.
I had just looked at the pix from the Second Birthday Bash prior to seeing these shots.
I guess different folks have different ideas of fun
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Old 07-08-2011, 03:38 PM   #103
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The title of this thread is "Let's fix the WBCCI".

Why?

The leadership and many of the members believe that it doesn't need fixing and don't want any change. Quality over quantity as PP JF has stated and the IBT has adopted as policy.

Sometime things are too broken to be fixed. I say let it go the way of the dinosaurs. It makes interesting history but I wouldn't want to be living it.

Let's not waste our time by throwing good money after bad. Let those stuck in the 50's enjoy that era. Life is too short to worry about this stuff or to care about the WBCCI. Let it die.
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Old 07-14-2011, 08:46 AM   #104
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I will be 50 next year, somewhere between the young guard and the old, I suppose. I understand that when I'm 70 or 80, no matter what I do or what I wear... I will probably seem dreadfully antiquated to all of the "cool kids." I also will be old enough to see that most of what the "cool kids" wear and do is little more than "old wine in new bottles."

Unlike many, I think the world is getting better. I suspect I have far less nostalgia than the average WBCCI member... because I remember/know some of the not-so-Leave-it-to-Beaver things about the 40s, 50s and 60s. And frankly, even life in white bread suburbia doesn't seem particularly swell compared to now.

I don't see any real point in mocking a species destined for extinction. The WBCCI, like many clubs, groups or gatherings, is trying to preserve a small habitat of "what was" while the rest of the universe is remaking itself. Who knows... years from now there may be a WBCCI reenactment group have "Caravan fairs."
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Old 07-14-2011, 10:13 AM   #105
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The title of this thread is "Let's fix the WBCCI".

Why?

The leadership and many of the members believe that it doesn't need fixing and don't want any change.
What is that opinion based upon?

Dave you are actually incorrect about the leadership not acknowledging the need for fixing or wanting change.

I have that from them first hand, face to face.
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:51 PM   #106
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Quite frankly, as a younger person and member, I find this whole “Fix It” thing somewhat amusing…

I watch members get older and want a motorhome. But whoa, Thor doesn’t make Airstream motorhomes. Oh man, there goes another couple; friends that have been with the club for what 30 – 40 years … and now they can’t come to the party? Hum, more loyalty to Airstream Inc. then to the people that have been called best friends for the last 30 years? Really? Wow – and why did you join WBCCI???!!!

Seems to me it would be easier and more profitable to come up with a way to maintain existing members before worrying about how to get new and younger.

Come on, a new loaded 34’ Classic limited cost what – about $117,000? And how may thirty something’s do you know can pay out that kind of cash?

How many camping clubs were there when Wally started the WBCCI? How many are there now? How many past WBCCI members do you know who are now members of Good Sams Club?

As Units dry up and older members have served and “paid their dues”, more pressure mounts for the newer, younger, and most often working members to step up and keep the current WBCCI alive. This will drive the new members away. They were not there when the older members “served”, and most likely would prefer to defer their “dues” till their retirement. After all, once the older members retire from WBCCI, who’s going to be there to keep things going?

Kind of reminds me of the whole social security fiasco!!

If the club survives anther 10 years, it’s because the members start thinking and acting past themselves…
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Old 07-14-2011, 05:05 PM   #107
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[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]

Club?

As Units dry up and older members have served and “paid their dues”, more pressure mounts for the newer, younger, and most often working members to step up and keep the current WBCCI alive. This will drive the new members away. They were not there when the older members “served”, and most likely would prefer to defer their “dues” till their retirement. After all, once the older members retire from WBCCI, who’s going to be there to keep things going?

Kind of reminds me of the whole social security fiasco!!

If the club survives anther 10 years, it’s because the members start thinking and acting past themselves…
My observation is just the opposite. I have seen many younger members step up and contribute to the club as officers, planning outstanding rallies, lend expertise in various areas now neglected like electronic forums, communications etc. A number of these younger folks have left the club due to the resistance to change and harassment from the club "management"
So far as other clubs, while I am not a past WBCCI member (at this point) I do belong to Escapees, Good Sam , and TAC. Plenty of opportunity to socialize with other RV people of all types and brands.
I have been the younger member, joining in 72 and have waited a long time to obtain old goat status. Unfortunately the WBCCI did not do a very good job of meeting my needs as a younger member and not much has changed in 39 years.
Almost every effort to bring about meaningful change has been blocked at every turn by those in power and as a result many enthusiastic members have given up and gone in other directions.
The motorhome issue will only result in an increased exodus from the club.
There is no reason that a younger, or any member has to dig up big bucks to have an Airstream , Many have been bought and rebuilt for a few thousand dollars..
With out these enthusiastic younger members there will soon not be a WBCCI but I bet the guy who finally turns out the lights will be wearing a suit and tie
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Old 07-14-2011, 05:17 PM   #108
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Many of us are old, but don't act like the 1950's never ended. It is a culture wars thing—the WBCCI is run by those who hardly changed in the years since the '50's ended. That group just gets smaller and smaller. They probably never liked rock 'n' roll, didn't understand why we needed civil rights laws or to protect the environment, and believed in the domino theory. In fact, I'm not sure they represent the '50's either since they believe in an autocracy.

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Old 07-14-2011, 05:56 PM   #109
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""I watch members get older and want a motorhome.""

actually the though of older and older members buying bigger and bigger moho's scares the p**p out of me. i often see them drifting down the highway; using the lane lines as opotional guides.

""...Thor doesn’t make Airstream motorhomes. Oh man, there goes another couple; friends that have been with the club for what 30 – 40 years …""

unfortunatley there will always come a time when we will no longer be able to come to the party. but, sometimes you just have to find a new party. that's why there are no 80 year old airline pilots. remember the height bar at Disney? sometimes you are just too young, sometimes just too old. so, buy a moho, join a moho club and have fun. no - you probably won't have all the same perks and power but hey, gotta pass the torch sometime, right?

""Hum, more loyalty to Airstream Inc. then to the people that have been called best friends for the last 30 years? Really? Wow – and why did you join WBCCI???!!!""

know when to say when. sometimes you just have to do what's best for the group/club, not just yourself.


""Seems to me it would be easier and more profitable to come up with a way to maintain existing members before worrying about how to get new and younger.""

wrong! at one point all you would be left with is a bunch of old members, slowly dying off until there is no-one left. the life-blood of any club is new members.

by 'maintain' existing members, you mean change the club for the benefit of a few without regard for the rest of the members.

and they don't have to be 'young'. new members can be in their 40's 50's 60's even. we joined when we were on the wrong side of 50. when we can no long pull our AS we will either sell it or pass it along to the kids/grandkids [the new, younger members]

""If the club survives anther 10 years, it’s because the members start thinking and acting past themselves…""

um...sorta the point i was making above.


So - do new members join and adapt to a club because they are joing a club that they fit, or does the club warp and change itself to fit the demands of a few long-term members.

where i live in AZ there is a small town with a fairly small aging population [not sun city]. instead of these older residents understanding that at ome point it is simply not safe to drive, the city managers slowly:

- decreased to speed limits from 40, to 30, to 25
- made all the signs larger
- made the sign posts shorter [so the shrunken drivers could see them over the steering wheel that blocked most of thier sightline]
- put reflective stickers all over the roads so the semi-blind could see at night.
- lined the road edges and center line with raised bumps so that these same folks would 'feel' when they were drifting into another lane.

what this primarily did was tick off so many other people that they will no longer drive into or through this town with a resulting loss of revenue.

just because you can not longer DO what a club IS, you shouldn't be able to change what the club IS into what you can DO.

- NOW i'm ready for my nap
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Old 07-15-2011, 07:46 AM   #110
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If the club survives anther 10 years, it’s because the members start thinking and acting past themselves

It is likely the WBCCI will limp along for another 10 or 20 years... or perhaps more. It will just become smaller and less relevant over time. So it goes.

The motorhome question seems like a theological difference between the Gnostics and the Calvinists. What does "Airstream" really mean? Is it the height of diesel-powered opulence and luxury with the "badge" as a side note? Or is the spirit of the unmistakable aluminum monocoque?

I suspect this is why the Gnostics (with whome I sympathize) favor vintage trailers and who are less happy with the WBCCI. I further suspect it why the Calvinists are more open to motorhomes and happier with the current Club.

With all due respect, I think "az" misses the point badly. This isn't about who's willing to do the work of keeping a club together. It's a fundamental difference about what "Airstream" means. The WBCCI isn't about just getting together with friends any more than church is just about singing a few hyms. And as with any theological divide, there is a struggle to even find a common language. The "rule book" is an article of faith for fundamentalists. For the more mystically inclined, the rule book is often an impediment to spirituality. Frankly, it is generally easier for both sides to dismiss the other than to find common ground... which is why the Gnostics will continue to pick the low hanging fruit of Lawrence Welk jokes and the Calvinists will continue to feel morally superior for not engaging in the discussion at all.
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Old 07-15-2011, 03:55 PM   #111
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hampstead 38, i re-read your post #107 and i actually think we have more in common than might be expected.

however, i took my nap and feel ready to address some of your issues:

""What does "Airstream" really mean? Is it the height of diesel-powered opulence and luxury with the "badge" as a side note? Or is the spirit of the unmistakable aluminum monocoque?""


- i think that most of us never have, or will, think of Airstream & diesel-powered in the same sentence.

""..this is why the Gnostics (with whome I sympathize) favor vintage trailers and who are less happy with the WBCCI. I further suspect it why the Calvinists are more open to motorhomes and
happier with the current Club.""

- i'm with you there. altho i lean neither vintage nor new; i do see the AS club as an "AS" club; not an RV club that happens to be currently made up of mostly AS's.

""With all due respect, I think "az" misses the point badly. This isn't about who's willing to do the work of keeping a club together. It's a fundamental difference about what "Airstream" means. The WBCCI
isn't about just getting together with friends any more than church is
just about singing a few hyms.""

- actually, the just getting together with friends part is just about exactly why we joined the wbcci - the FCU/AZ chapter specifically. in order to join the FCU and have fun, we had to join the wcbbi first. i think there are many people who go to the meetings and rallies wanting to make the club better, more fun, more friendly, only to see silly side issues like moho inclusion get all the time and effort. so, of course, these good folk retreat to their local rallies where they are really appreciated.

- so why are the few Calvanists trying to force their hymnbook on all the happy Gnostics?

- are the moho-ites really working towards 'keeping the club together' or are they trying to re-make the club in their own image. when a clear majority of a group/club are obviously opposed to an issue, why is that issue repeatedly re-entered into the discussion? maybe we can invoke some sort of three strikes and yer out rulle on repeat attempts?

- i truly feel that many/most of us who joined the wbcci see it as an AS club, not an RV club. similarly, if we had a moho we would have joined a moho club.

- um... isn't the term 'Airstream' fairly self-explanatory? how would you define 'Airstream' as other than what AS's primarily are - travel traillers, not moho's. again - most/many/all[?] people would eaily define an AS as the famous silver tube, not the square motorized moho. not that there's anything wrong with them.

for the pro-moho group to try to institute such convoluted schemes as grandfather clauses, part/multiple ownership, lifetime member privileges, etc. seems to me to be a clear indication that they are indeed thinking about themselves rather than the good of the wbcci.

the moho group seems to feel the this is purely a 'class' dispute over letting moho's into the wbcci. it's not. it's the attempt to change the wbcci from an AS club into an RV club.

[yes, i know that 'airstream' is not part of 'wbcci' - but remove all the 'airstreams' and is it still the 'wbcci'?]
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