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Old 07-09-2009, 09:18 AM   #113
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sorry for you

I'm right up there with Rob and Frank in being really angry with how we were treated at International. While I think the parking snafu showed poor planning and control, I know that sometimes things just happen. But what upset me was the utter lack of concern for anything but their own comfort on the part of our outgoing and incoming presidents. They didn't lift a finger to try to make things better for us. The VAC excluded us and ignored us throughout the rally. For instance, we heard about a campfire the next day.

I am so happy to be part of the WDCU. We help each other out at every opportunity - Rob, Frank and Marc all helped me with problems I had with my trailer, and we all worked together to figure out how to set up our awnings on asphalt. We had meals together, and fun together.

If your camping experience is anemic happy hours, expecting everyone to fend for themselves, and not giving a rap about anything but your own experience, then I am sorry for you.
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Old 07-09-2009, 09:28 AM   #114
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Rob,

I only used the "Mister" title out of respect. I have never met you. So sorry, you took offense. We have communications trouble here. No one had responded to these allegations, I tried my best. Obviously some of my iinformation about officer ascent was incorrect. I opologize for that.

The bottom line is this in my eyes. Volunteers, no matter who they are, are just that. The "International' is basically a once a year week long business meeting for the club. Comraderie, entertainment, etc is just an extra for this week long business convention.

It may come to pass in the future with escalating costs, the rally will be dry camping only for all. The generator rental the International incurs and maintenance is a HUGE cost to WBCCI.


I quit now, since everything I will say a fault will be found, so safe travels
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Old 07-09-2009, 09:42 AM   #115
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Paul, Frank, Rob, and any others that I may have missed.

Many things have been brought up in this thread. A few of which I will attempt to answer.

I am not a regular reader of AirForums, and would never have found this exchange let alone read through it if it weren’t for a VAC member sending me a link. Frankly, I find the sheer size of AirForums quite intimidating, but am attempting to use it to bring a little understanding…and hopefully some peace.

#1 I apologize to those who believe that I offended them, or let them down. I am merely human and I make mistakes. I have said things that I would take back if I could. I have made decisions that turned out to be bad ones. All I can do is to promise that I will do the best job that I can.

#2 Yes, the VAC Constitution and Bylaws were updated this year. Before International the president snail-mailed each VAC member a letter. In it he explained that at the upcoming board meeting we would be voting on the updated Constitution and Bylaws. He provided links to both the old and the proposed new. If memory serves me (and it doesn’t always) printed copies were handed out at both the board and membership meetings prior to the vote. In my viewpoint the main changes were to better spell out the board’s responsibilities. One of the biggest ones being attending the board meetings They can be seen at: http://www.nwflorida.net/vaccbl.pdf

#3 Paul is correct. The parking of non vintage trailers with the VAC is more of a year-by-year decision. We do not have a rule about it. To my knowledge the first instance of this was at the Lansing International in ‘04 when the current VAC president, Tom Howarth showed up in a non-vintage Airstream motor home. The frame on his ‘50’s Flying Cloud had cracked and was no longer road worthy. Yes, it raised some eyebrows, but what were we supposed to do, banish the club’s president? As for this year, after consulting with the VAC board, I made the decision to allow all VAC MEMBERS to park together in the vintage section, whether or not they brought their vintage trailer to the rally. I would like to think that the VAC is about including people, not excluding them.

#4 About my becoming 1st VP without first being 2nd or 3rd. I cannot speak with full authority, because I was not present in Bozeman, neither was Rob Baker, the 2nd VP. But here is what I believe to have happened. The 3rd VP dropped out. The 2nd VP had never been able to make an International Rally. I was under the assumption that he was requesting to NOT advance to 1st since he had not previously seen first hand what happens at International. I did not blame him as I know that it is difficult to fill a roll that you have never seen modeled. The board was scrambling to fill both 1st and 3rd VP spots. At that time I had been a member of the VAC for 12 years, attended 8 International Rallies, and until recently, been the Membership Chairman for more years than I care to remember. I understand the need to volunteer, but I never aspired to get more involved. I had been urged on more than one occasion to run for VP, but turned them down. Repeatedly. Personally, I hate politics. I dislike meetings and hate being in charge of them. I believe that rules beyond being a good neighbor should be unnecessary. Like many of you, I just want to camp in peace. If I can do it with friends, all the better. I relented my stand against being a VP because a 3rd was found, but only if I accepted 1st. For the perceived good of the VAC I accepted the position. To the best of my knowledge at that time everything was on the up and up.

#5 Parking at International. I only had so much say in things. Frankly the head of parking only had so much say. Volunteers laid a water line in such a manner to cut off access to several sites. If they were paid workers, we would have had a case to have them pull it up and re-lay it, but they were volunteers. Electric. In past years 70-90% of vintage opted for 30 amp. This year it ended up being less than 50%. When the head of parking learned that vintage had FAR fewer registrations for 30 amp sites than expected, several more sites were gobbled up. On paper it all worked, they had so many 30 amps sites sold and they had wired that many sites. But at the very end it was realized that they had set aside too many of them in the vintage section. It is my belief that the electric crew simply did not have the time to rearrange/rewire things to park these non-vintage people (who paid for 30 amp sites) anyplace else. They had paid for a 30 amp site. The grassy area was the only place left that had any. That is why non-VAC people were parked on the grass. To top it off it was decided (I do not know by whom) that we could not park in the 4th row due to flooding that occurred before our arrival. They could not jam us in closer together without giving the fire martial a fit. So what started out as a more than ample area for vintage, ended up being inadequate. When our caravan arrived in the bull-pen I was informed that some of our members would be parked over in the gravel section with the dogs and generators. Talk about being separated! I was able to convince him to park us in proximity to each other. So I do apologize for getting people’s hopes up by telling them that most of us would end up on the grass. This is, I believe, the crux of the matter. People had hopes of a grassy area. We were hot and tired. When things did not turn out as we had all hoped almost all of us got grumpy. I tend to be a person who goes with the flow. I rarely complain. I was, and still am, inadequate when it comes to handling people’s complaints. Come to me with an idea how to improve things, I’m all over it. Come to me to complain and I fumble the ball, BIG TIME. Once again, sorry, I will try to do better in the future.

However, with all the complaining that was going on, there was one woman, a first timer who was brand new to WBCCI. She also had to park on the asphalt. She tended to be a loner, so I checked on her several times throughout the rally. She was determined to have a good time, and she was not going to let the circumstances get her down. I believe that out of everyone in the VAC, she, not I or anyone else at the rally, best represented Wally Byam and his ideals.

Scott Scheuermann, the reluctant.
VAC President, 2009-2010.
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Old 07-09-2009, 10:33 AM   #116
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Parking, Hmm, the VAC Prez, Veeps, had NO control over the parking situation on the grass. There were also a number of VAC rigs that showed up without prior reservations at the pre rally. So, its a little tough to plan for more spaces when you don't know your total numbers! The WBCCI Parking Committee had issues of their own and they were confused which added to this mess. There were already newer airstreams parked on the grass before we got there. Who they were, who knows? The area of grass that was NOT used closest to the pavement was not used for a good reason:::, it was prone to flooding during heavy downpours. Majority of trailers parked on the grass were 30 amp, except for the back row against the trees was 3 amp
Most everyone was preregistered… why is it so hard to plan?


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The vagrant in the tent on site was an Alliant Event Center issue, not WBCCI.
If I’m hosting 2000 of my club members… I’d make it my issue. They had weeks to clear this guy out.

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Happy Hour: If the fair was small and unsatisfying, what was your contribution? If nothing, there is no room to complain
This was a reflection of the effort put forth… I prefer to camp with folks that “Care enough to Share” The International rally did not score highly on this account.

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Kid Entertainment. Teasing other members pets is NOT entertainment. If I did that as a kid 40 years ago, my Dad would have planted me!!
Nothing has changed in 40 years… none of the 20+ kids in our group were teasing your pets… or they would have gotten “planted” themselves. Must have been kids of some of those folks to busy polishing their shiny trailers to mind their kids.

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A whole lot of whining here…
No whining… just pointing out the circumstances so that maybe future first timers can have a realistic picture of what to expect for their $500 +/-. As I’ve said, in my book, it is not even close to worth what I paid to bring my family.

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With resignations of previously mentioned VAC VEEP set the stage for Scott to be thrust into where he is..
I don’t recall reading any “thrusting procedure” in the bylaws. As I read it, if the 1st VP resigns, the 2nd VP moves to 1st and on down the line. If Scott was to be “thrust” anywhere it should have been to 3rd VP.

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YOU KNOW HOW HARD IT IS TO GET VOLUNTEERS TO BE AN OFFICER?? AND TAKE THIS KIND OF NONSENSE FROM OUR OWN?????
What sort of “NONSENSE” are you referring to? We asked a few simple questions in a polite manner and were answered with an “I don’t care” attitude. We don’t need officers like that. If the officers aren’t in place to have concern for the membership, then why are they there?


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Why not stand up and join in and volunteer to be a participating member of the club and help make some improvements.
We all participate every time we camp… Just as PeeWee told me… the purpose of the club is to “simply have fun” As far as improvements… we offered our feedback to our leadership and were told nothing can be done to improve upon the experience. This seems to be the never-ending mantra for those in a position to do something about it and the folks with the ability to make improvements get shoved aside.


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With the cost of the Alliant Center, generators, pipes for water etc, this rally in Madison ran in the hole big time.
Yeah! … and why is it that we needed to hold the rally at a multi-million dollar convention center? After all, we are a Camping Club.

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Remember also, that it was not too long ago, that Internationals had no water, no sewer, no power to the rally. These are Airstreams and fully self contained.
Right… probably a much better time back then too. I often think this club has forgotten whence it came… I’m glad we have PeeWee to remind us.
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Old 07-09-2009, 10:37 AM   #117
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Thanks Scott.
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Old 07-09-2009, 11:26 AM   #118
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However, with all the complaining that was going on, there was one woman, a first timer who was brand new to WBCCI. She also had to park on the asphalt. She tended to be a loner, so I checked on her several times throughout the rally. She was determined to have a good time, and she was not going to let the circumstances get her down. I believe that out of everyone in the VAC, she, not I or anyone else at the rally, best represented Wally Byam and his ideals.
Scott,

Firstly, thanks for the post and thanks for the apology. Let me also apologize to you, as it was none of our intent to place blame for the situation on you. The parkers told us to take it up with our leadership and you, Herb and Dallas were it. I assure you that just a little empathy would have gone a long way.

I will also assure you that we all made the best of the circumstances and had a fantastic time in spite of them. Should we ever find ourselves camping together in the future, you and your family are more than welcome to join us for meal and conversation... it's the way we camp - all are welcome.

As far as volunteering and improvements... I think you will find that if folks see their efforts making an impact you will find a wealth of help offered.

Good Luck... and if you're ever looking for opinions... as you know I'm more than willing to offer mine.
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Old 07-09-2009, 01:58 PM   #119
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Offering insight...

I wasn't at International this year so I can't speak to many of the issues brought forth in this thread – it looks like Scott did a good job of addressing those. I have however, been emailed by several posters asking for some insight into past Board activities. It is not my intention to go point-by-point through the issues of this thread nor the emails I have received – I don't have the time to adequately reply to each of you individually point-by-point, I have decided instead to post here to give some big picture perspective of the last couple of years from my viewpoint. I hope that the readers of this post will give me the courtesy of not picking at my every word, but reading what I have posted as it is intended – as insight.

As some of you may or may not be aware, there were several years of uneasiness between the IBT & VAC Board primarily focused on the IBT's perception of the VAC's apparent apathy towards them by disregarding the IBT Seminar/Meetings which take place each year prior to the “official” start of the rally itself. Whether this perception was actual or not is up to the individuals involved - but the perception was actual. Both in Springfield and Salem issues arose that caused the necessity of one-on-one meetings with IBT & VAC Board members to try & resolve them – I can assure you, those meetings were NOT fun. It was my goal as a VAC Board member to try and do what I could do to heal the rift and to revise this perception. We as VAC members are after all a very active part of the WBCCI and it is the responsibility of the Intra-Club to uphold our end of the bargain by fulfilling our obligation of presenting the annual report in front of the IBT at the Seminar & Meeting each year. There had been a pattern for several years of the President not attending the rally during "their year"and the 1st VP taking over both their own responsibilities (VAC Gathering, Parade, 2nd Board Meeting) and the President's (Annual Report, 1st Board Meeting, Membership Meeting) which was a HUGE burden. I know, I did it in Perry and others had done it before me.

One of the biggest issues that centered around my experience in Perry in front of the IBT, was the need for there to be continuity of Board Members in attendance at International. Unfortunately, there was not even a quorum of VAC Board Members in attendance at this rally for various reasons - many justified. At Perry, the Board members that were present, discussed that the VAC By-Laws had not been fulfilled with regards to the on-going responsibility of updating them every five years. They hadn't been updated since 2000/01 and some of the issues that we as an Intra-Club were then facing had possibly resulted because of this. However due to the lack of a quorum of Board Members (only 3 Board Members were there – 4 are required) there could not be an official Board Meeting so they were discussed casually.

The VAC Board Meeting & Membership Meeting for the year was postponed until August when a quorum of Board Members could be present. The old By-Laws had no provision for holding a Board Meeting via any other means than "in person" at International - so a "Special Meeting" was called (which was allowed in the By-Laws). That "Special Meeting" happened to occur at the RMVAC Rally because it was the next opportunity to have a gathering of enough VAC Board Members & a large number of VAC Members to conduct the Business Meeting. This was all documented in the Board & Membership Meeting Minutes which were distributed and made available to all. This is actually the meeting where the 07/08 Board was officially installed - which included Rob as 3rd VP. It was in Perry where the discussions of written Job Descriptions began and they were continued in Breckenridge (RMVAC Rally Special Board Meeting) and Bozeman, as well as throughout the year amongst the Board.

One of the goals of the 07/08 & 08/09 Boards was to update the Job Descriptions & By-Laws so all Board Members, Membership Chairpersons and VAC Members would have a better understanding of what was expected of the various volunteer positions. One of the biggest issues was the lack of understanding that it is the Board's responsibility to attend the International Rally so Business can be conducted. These preliminary job descriptions were discussed at both the Board & Membership Meetings in Bozeman which are open for the entire membership to attend. Both during the 07/08 and 08/09 years, the job descriptions were distributed several times by both myself & Ed Emerick via email for discussion and comments by the Board – most email requests for comments went unanswered or with short “Looks good!” types of replies.

Written into the job descriptions, it was made clear what the various Board Member's & Chairperson's responsibilities were rather than just going with the flow and passing them down verbally (if at all) as had been done previously. In summary (the full descriptions are available in the link Herb Spies provided), the President's primary responsibility is to be the liaison to the IBT representing the VAC at the IBT Meetings, conducting the VAC Board and Business Meetings during their Presidency. This means that by assuming the position of 1st VP/President you have to in essence commit to attending 2 International Rallies in a row - the 1st being your 1st VP/Pres year and the 2nd being your Pres/PP year. It was also discussed at length several times in emails & person the likely inability of the 1st VP to be able to conduct the 2nd Board Meeting at their 1st International without never having been to an International prior to see how things were done. I was a big proponent of this having just experienced the scorn of the IBT in Perry - if I had never been to an International before I would have been even more rattled by the goings-on than I was and would have most likely walked away.

So, with this being the case and the Job Descriptions already in the approval process by the Board, these were taken into account in the decision to recommend that Rob be given another year to have the opportunity to attend an International prior to his becoming 1st VP. Scott, having been to many Internationals, was (and is) eminently qualified to fulfill the 1st VP position in order to give Rob another chance to get up to speed. Unfortunately, this decision appears to not have been communicated clearly enough in the Board Meeting Minutes post-Bozeman and it was not made clear to Rob what had transpired. Part of this is the exact symptom of the problem - without being present at the Board Meetings and only receiving the minutes afterwards, how can anyone fully grasp what takes place? Thus the importance of Board Meetings with the majority of Board Members in attendance. Hindsight being what it is, there should have been a more direct conversation with Rob one-on-one to discuss the options & decision, but it didn't happen. For that I think we are all sorry. While we have never met, I believe that Rob is more than qualified to be on the VAC Board as an Officer – however without the first-hand “International Experience” it makes for a very difficult transition into 1st VP/President. Had this confusion & these questions surfaced through better communication earlier, I trust that Rob would not have felt the need to resign.

As I understand it, this year in Madison, at the Board and General Membership Meetings – the new By-Laws which include the Job Descriptions, were voted on and approved by the members. So hopefully, this is a start towards better communication for the future.

One last additional point of clarity I do want to make is that the 2/3's vote that is required to obtain approval of Constitution/By-Law changes is “2/3's of the members present at the Annual Business Meeting” not 2/3's of the entire membership (Article XI, Sec. 1 VAC By-Laws 2000/01) and in order to make “a quorum to hold the Annual Business Meeting or any additional business meeting, shall not be less than 10% of the VAC Members attending the (International) Rally”. (Article V, Sec. 4 VAC By-Laws 2000/01) not a specific number of members in total.

Like I said, my comments here are not intended to bring 100% clarity to the last 2-3 years, it's just some additional information regarding the past that may be helpful.

Shari
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Old 07-09-2009, 03:43 PM   #120
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Question Time to stop

Isn't it time to put this subject to bed? You either want to be in the club or you don't.
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Old 07-09-2009, 04:23 PM   #121
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Actually, it sounds to me like this forum is providing open communication that may end up resolving some issues and help progress the WBCCI.

I'm of the opinion that nobody is forcing anyone to read or participate. Just cause its at the top of the page doesn't mean you have to click it!

Kinda like NASCAR, I watch the wrecks, but I prefer a good finish.
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Old 07-09-2009, 04:48 PM   #122
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Isn't it time to put this subject to bed? You either want to be in the club or you don't.

John,

That's a lot easier said than done. You have people who love what Wally and his band of merry caravanners did back in the day, and they want that spirit to live on. The problem is that this "club" is now a business, and it's poorly run by the IBT.

I, for one, would love to put 12608 on our rig (Our wedding anniversary) (used to be 8371, Sherri's Birthday) and let people know that I belong to a club that spreads goodwill, and inform Airstream owners, who don't know about the WBCCI, that it's a club worth joining.

I would love to, however I refuse to belong to a club with leadership that misuses dues, does whatever it wants, disregards by-laws, tries to change the name of the club, tries to allow non-Airstream products into the club (as long as they're Thor products).

Shari, noone should have to go through crap, the way you did at Perry; you have way more patience than I.
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Old 07-09-2009, 05:14 PM   #123
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[quote=johntavares1;719523]Isn't it time to put this subject to bed? You either want to be in the club or you don't.[/quote]

Take it or leave. If you don't like it here go home. You are with us or against us.

We need a new club... this one is beyond repair....
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Old 07-09-2009, 05:16 PM   #124
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As I understand it, this year in Madison, at the Board and General Membership Meetings – the new By-Laws which include the Job Descriptions, were voted on and approved by the members. So hopefully, this is a start towards better communication for the future.
Shari,

Thanks for the extensive reply... it makes things much clearer for me.

As I read it, nowhere in the Job descriptions for all officers above the level of regional VAC Representative do they require any efforts and or abilities regarding the general welfare of the membership. Maybe the positions should be renamed to Chief IBT Lackey and 1st Vice IBT Lackey, etc...

Seems some have forgotten that this club is about camping and have let all this reporting up the chain of command to consume their whole existence.

As with missing the forest for the trees, the club, including the IBT has lost it's way.

Our plan is to stay on the true path with the hopes that those not with us will "see what’s over the next hill, and the one after that, and the one after that" ...until they join us on the path that leads to "simply have fun"

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Also for those who have forgotten... this should be the Job Description for ALL club officers (and members)...

Wally Byam's Creed

"In the heart of these words is an entire life's dream. To those of you who find in the promise of these words your promise, I bequeath this creed... my dream belongs to you."

To place the great wide world at your doorstep for you who yearn to travel with all the comforts of home.

To provide a more satisfying, meaningful way of travel that offers complete travel independence, wherever and whenever you choose to go or stay.

To keep alive and make real an enduring promise of high adventure and faraway lands... of rediscovering old places and new interests.

To open a whole world of new experiences... a new dimension in enjoyment where travel adventure and good fellowship are your constant companions.

To encourage clubs and rallies that provide an endless source of friendships, travel fun and personal expressions.

To lead caravans wherever the four winds blow... over twinkling boulevards, across trackless deserts... to the traveled and untraveled corners of the earth.

To play some part in promoting international goodwill and understanding among the peoples of the world through person-to-person contact.

To refine and perfect our product by continuous travel-testing over the highways and byways of the world.

To strive endlessly to stir the venturesome spirit that moves you to follow a rainbow to its end... and thus make your travel dreams come true.


- Wally Byam


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Old 07-09-2009, 05:22 PM   #125
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As with missing the forest for the trees, the club, including the IBT has lost it's way.
Sounds more like missing the forest for all the pavement

*dives for cover and popcorn*
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Old 07-09-2009, 07:12 PM   #126
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[QUOTE=Ed Emerick;639218]then don't pay your dues and move on./QUOTE]

I went to Madison jung ho. Just ask anyone that knows me. I personally asked everyone in my unit and many in other units to join us going to International. I told everyone that our club needed their support. I have often been accused of being too into it. My impression of the VAC was that it was free of the politics and infighting that is thought of as status quo in the rest of the club. Unfortunately that was a false impression. I now feel that Ed is a very wise man. I am going to do exactly as he says.

I will not bore any of you anymore with my whining. I am going back to camping and having fun. If any you are inclined to experience how simple it can be stop on by to one of our rallies.
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