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Old 05-24-2004, 05:33 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tin can luv
If the Old Farts that bug us so much would spend more time and interest reading this forum, and not out vacationing, and rallying, and doing what retired people do, maybe they one of them would put their oxygen down and invite younger more exciting events into their rallys.
Think about that, They are out doing what we aspire to do.
Glad to see that you recognize a good thing when you see it.

Sucking on Oxygen tanks may not be a bad thing, Love is like Oxygen..........

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Old 05-24-2004, 07:06 PM   #72
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If I sat down to have dinner at a non christian event, and was subjected to saying grace and morning church service, I would be very unhappy, just as I expect my non religious views will cause others to be unhappy.
I am an athiest. At my first rally, I was told that "devotions" were at 8:30 on Sunday. I politely told them "I don't devote." and that was that. I have never been subjected to any pressure to attend. As far as grace at meals, I can certainly afford to spend a half-minute studying cracks in the ceiling if it makes others happy. I also omit two words in the Pledge of Allegiance that should not be there.

Has this affected my status in WBCCI? Hardly. I'm currently a trustee of the unit and Region 9 Webmaster. I will decline to ever be President because I refuse to call for or schedule religious rites. I will willingly serve in any other capacity in the unit.
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Old 05-24-2004, 07:38 PM   #73
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I wonder, does anyone else do what I find myself doing? I must have typed out a dozen Quick Replies only to delete them, knowing how they would be read and misinterpreted without being there to explain in person. Am I the only one???
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Old 05-24-2004, 07:57 PM   #74
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Can't say about quick replies, but I've sent a couple of PM only to have them disappear into never, never land. Guess that might be a form of self deleting Just can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. Hopefully we can all voice our opinions (with in reason), with out long explanations. Fire away, if they don't like it, they can always go on to the next thread.
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Old 05-24-2004, 09:17 PM   #75
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OK, that's funny but true!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pahaska
I can certainly afford to spend a half-minute studying cracks in the ceiling if it makes others happy.
I would probably just roll my eyes at TOny, but he tends to be more religious than I. I guess agnostic is my route, but I just don't even talk about it much. More for the reason that MaxandGeorgia would probably have more to say about religion than I would have to say against it...

That isn't a slam M&G, what I am saying is I don't have anything to back up my personal belief, so the conversation wouldn't last long, I'd feel defeated....

SO, I hesitated too, to write that about not being happy about prayer, but, to each his own.

This is a good example of a thread with people of varying nature, and beliefs, getting along, without horrible arguments.

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Old 05-24-2004, 09:25 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tin can luv
This is a good example of a thread with people of varying nature, and beliefs, getting along, without horrible arguments.

Thank you Ron!

This is what the forum AND in most cases the WBCCI is like. There can be differing opinions. Discussion of those opinions/positions can be done in a respectful way. You never know who you may touch with a well penned paragraph that helps them to feel that they are not alone, no matter where they happen to stand on an issue. You may also make a point that someone had not considered and it leads them to change their position.

For the most part the members of WBCCI are not, in my opinion, what I would consider "bible thumpers". They have a respect for religion, no matter the faith, and feel that it is part of the fabric of their lives. When you get as many people together as attend a rally you will have many people with different positions.

What I think it is all about is tolerance. In regard to this issue IMHO there can only be middle ground.
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Old 05-24-2004, 09:39 PM   #77
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So you are a member of a social group (WBCCI, in this case) and you enjoy the kinds of things they do. The years go by and you continue doing those same kinds of things, more or less in the same way because, well, that's what you and the other old members enjoy. From time to time you pick up a new member who happens to like much the same sort of thing you do, so he fits right in. But as the years pass, old members move away, or die, or become inactive. Maybe a few new members arrive with bright and shining new ideas and new activities, but you and your friends put a stop to that because, after all, you like the kind of things you have been doing. And so, little by little, the group starts to wind down.

And there is nothing wrong with that. It is ultimately destuctive to the organization, of course, but what are YOUR alternatives? Go with a new program of stuff you don't like, to get in a bunch of new members you don't like, and find yourself on the outside looking in? What kind of sense is there in that? Yes, at some point the group collapses, but hey, this is just a social club - not the Khan dynasty.

I am now old enough to have seen this happen with virtually every kind of voluntary association I have ever known: clubs, churches, volunteer groups, even condo associations. When faced with the choice to change or die, they choose to die - and frankly I can understand that perfectly. Often what happens is what John described in his chapter - a competing group forms and thrives, or sometimes some vigorous new blood comes in just in time to turn things around. But ultimately their fate is just the same years down the road.

Folks, its all just fun and games anyway.

Mark
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Old 05-24-2004, 09:44 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxandgeorgia
I wonder, does anyone else do what I find myself doing? I must have typed out a dozen Quick Replies only to delete them, knowing how they would be read and misinterpreted without being there to explain in person. Am I the only one???
I do that all the time! After I delete a couple I usually decide to log off and go find something else to do for a while. By the time I get back someone else had responded and then I don't have to strain my brain any further
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Old 05-24-2004, 10:19 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxandgeorgia
I wonder, does anyone else do what I find myself doing? I must have typed out a dozen Quick Replies only to delete them, knowing how they would be read and misinterpreted without being there to explain in person. Am I the only one???
Oh heck ya!

Did it twice today on this very thread when I finally realized that it just isn't worth it as I've said my peace on the subject several times as have others.
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Old 05-24-2004, 11:39 PM   #80
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Brett,

You make very convincing counter-arguments...

Quote:
In many cases there is a pro-rated rally fee, but it is not published in the Blue Beret.
Well my whole point was......WHY NOT??? If they want to appeal to working people, it would seem a no-brainer to me.

Quote:
The club has not caught up with the Internet generation yet.
For a whole region rally and the organizers can't get an email for questions? And this region includes high-tech California, for Pete's sake!

Quote:
Just because they look old does not mean that they will act old or have old feeble minds. This is judging a book by it's cover in the worst way.
I really enjoy talking with the many seniors on my travels. And I don't mean any disrespect about them being in pictures in the BB. My point is it wouldn't hurt to show some people who are not seniors in EVERY picture if your goal was to appeal to all ages.

Quote:
All I can recommend is to contact a unit membership chairman and ask to drop by a rally sans trailer. Normally a visitor is welcome with open arms and you can at least try to get a feel of the members of that unit in a face to face way. This does not require a full weekend of travel or camping and may offer a better understanding of the intangibles that a rally , unit or otherwise offers.
Very nice advice for all of us. I am still planning going to the Region 12 Rally to see all the local units up close like you say.
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Old 05-25-2004, 08:28 AM   #81
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Ron, did I say something about religion? Are you assuming that? Even though we probably qualify as "Old Farts," you will find out when you meet us in person just how interested we are in other's ideas. You see, the older we become, the more tempered we become by life. We are VERY different people today than we were, say, 25 or 30 years ago. In fact, we may be among the most "tolerant" people you will meet, although I reallly hate that word. It really means so little-implies nothing about empathy or compassion. Through the years, life's experiences have "beaten" us into some new ways of thinking that we didn't understand when we were younger. As I said, can't wait to meet you
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Old 05-25-2004, 09:22 AM   #82
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Last year we joined our local chapter and have attended most rallies. Each rally has some component that doesn't fit me or my family but that would apply to about any gathering I've ever attended. When we joined I was curious how we'd fit in or be accepted. My expectations were exceeded. All of the much older members were very appreciative of getting new and younger members and made us feel most welcome. My 13 year old daughter and 11 year old son have been "adopted" by multiple grandpas and grandmas and they look forward to meeting their "favorites" when we go to the rallies. I view this as part of my responsibility for helping them embrace the qualities and differences of different generations while learning to respect all. My kids and family are certainly richer for it all. If everyone was my age or marched to my same drum it wouldn't be any different that a weekend bbq at my house. I thought it was cool when my kids, wife and I put our right foot on the WBCCI carpet and took the oath. During meetings when policies and rules are discussed I usually sneak out and tinker with something....just not my thing. But watching my daughter help the older ladies with meals or projects, or watching my son interact with a WW2 veteran is invaluable. On balance for me, the treasure that this diversity offers my family exceeds the differences in activity level, interests, etc.
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Old 05-25-2004, 09:28 AM   #83
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Talking Too funny!!!!

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I thought it was cool when my kids, wife and I put our right foot on the WBCCI carpet and took the oath.
I couldn't help bu think of... "Put your right foot in, put your right foot out, put you right foot in & shake it all about..." Can you imagine!!!

Shari
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Old 05-25-2004, 10:50 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxandgeorgia
I wonder, does anyone else do what I find myself doing? I must have typed out a dozen Quick Replies only to delete them, knowing how they would be read and misinterpreted without being there to explain in person. Am I the only one???
Absolutely. As a matter of fact in the interst of not being hasty, I rarely use the quick reply. I need to think about my answer, refer back to the post, reread what I wrote, make sure it won't be misconstrued, consider the demographics of the forum, and by then if someone hasn't already said it, then I post. Sometimes I post anyway, like this time, just to be heard. I try to avoid politics and religion, unless it is appropriate, just because some people are too thin skinned and it isn't worth starting an argument for argument's sake.

My keep-on-topic point: I'm sending in my new member membership dues for the new year today. This thread has been interesting, but hasn't changed my mind one way or the other. The WBCCI's problems are pretty universal for organized groups. I'm pretty confident that it will evolve and continue to grow. I got a note from our region's manager that there are 7 or 8 new members joining their group along with us in July.
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