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Old 02-09-2011, 07:28 AM   #161
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Hey, it was a rhetorical question!

I'm just being skeptical and suspicious. The idea that the C&B Revision Committee has thought of everything, and it's going to be as wonderful as sliced bread, and if we just ratify it all will be well, sounds a little too good to be true.
Forest each time we spoke it was it a lighter tone, I don't understand all your skepticism without reading the doc.

At the delegates meeting each article will debated if they wish, then voted on, one by one.

A copy will be posted on Wbcci.org, a power point presentation is in the works which will go out to each unit, it will be likely published in the BB.

All committee members will be available to address any concerns or issues that ANY member may have via phone on scheduled call time or email.
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Old 02-09-2011, 08:36 AM   #162
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"A copy will be posted on Wbcci.org, a power point presentation is in the works which will go out to each unit, it will be likely published in the BB."

"All committee members will be available to address any concerns or issues that ANY member may have via phone on scheduled call time or email."


May I suggest the members/Unit Prez, etc… would be far better served by getting an “independent” voice on the pros/cons of the new Constitution that is being presented? The Power Point would be the equivalent of Ford car/truck marketing literature and going to a member of the committee that did the re-write would be like going to the Ford dealer asking them the pros/cons of buying a Ford car/truck.
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Old 02-09-2011, 08:55 AM   #163
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May I suggest the members/Unit Prez, etc… would be far better served by getting an “independent” voice on the pros/cons of the new Constitution that is being presented?
Nice to have the idea, but how would you suggest that happens?
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Old 02-09-2011, 09:00 AM   #164
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LiPets,
Think about the most recent timeline of events and others in the past: do you REALLY need to ask why there is skepticism and cynicism?. The carrot being dangled here is far from fresh.
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Old 02-09-2011, 09:09 AM   #165
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From the fewer registrations signed up for this year at DuQuoin I wonder how many units will not have a delegate or alternate present at all. Of those present I wonder how many will be instructed by their units to vote their conscience? Who was it that said that the only ones left will be the segment of passive membership that will agree with leadership no matter what? Boondocker? He may well be right. The convention doesn't fit the fun fellowship or adventure or affordability criteria of most members. Neither does the delegate meeting seem to fit its bill as a delegates meeting when the agenda and meeting is led and presided over by the EC. Here we face an even stickier wicket, yet again originating not from membership, but originating from the Executive Committee and may attempt to dissolve the checks and balance of the deliberative body of delegates entirely in exchange for a single vote 1M1V. More deals? Feeling lucky?? Instead of proposing amendments you will each get your individual vote upon the ones that are presented for you to vote upon. And while they are at it they may remove that "not necessary" method of passing amendments circumventing the IBT too. Afterall we asked for a smaller body of leadership and its for sure the EC is not agreeable to eliminating themselves or relegating any of their power. And has been the WBCCI gold row standard, your only choice will be to choose what they want to give you to choose from. That's our free election system.
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Old 02-09-2011, 09:14 AM   #166
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Can we carry on these Constitution issues here?
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:51 PM   #167
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Actually, this thread is still very much valid, as it has to do with the constitutional amendment proposed by Region 11 which is still in progress. If ratified by the units, it will go into effect in the event that the proposed new constitution is not adopted at the 2011 delegates meeting.
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:55 PM   #168
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Region 7 or Region 11?

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Actually, this thread is still very much valid, as it has to do with the constitutional amendment proposed by Region 7 which is still in progress. If ratified by the units, it will go into effect in the event that the proposed new constitution is not adopted at the 2011 delegates meeting.
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Old 02-09-2011, 01:12 PM   #169
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Region 7 or Region 11?
Sorry, Region 11. (I corrected my post.)
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Old 02-12-2011, 11:06 PM   #170
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It appears that we have stopped moving backward with the DENCO motion. A few days ago, Int'l President Beu and Unit President Reed reached the compromise mentioned earlier. The compromises made by the DENCO Unit are that the motion will be resubmitted to the Units in Region 11 for them to vote on, but this time with the "benefit" of Chairman Shafer's report (letter of recommendation). This puts the motion back to where it was in May of 2010.

This morning, just prior to our Unit business meeting, Unit President Reed received Chairman Shafer's report. This means that President Beu has made good on his "accord" with her.

For their part, Region 11 Units will only need to vote once (not counting their vote in 2010). This is an improvement over what was said at the Mid-Winter when Region President Neumarkel was told his region would have to vote two more times.

Another concession is that the DENCO Unit will be allowed to write a rebuttal to Chairman Shafer's report. Then the motion, the report and the rebuttal will be sent to HQ. From there it goes to Region 11 Units. If passed by them (again) all documents go back to HQ with proper letters of certifications (from Unit Presidents and Region President). If that is accomplished the documents will be sent out to all the other Units in the Club.

Cindy Reed, Corporate Manager, has been authorized to create Certification forms for the Unit Presidents and Region President to use. This will assure uniformity of reporting and language.

As for me, I've been authorized by my Unit board to write the rebuttal. That will be done in the next few days. Then it will be up to the Region 11 Units to get together asap to vote (being careful to follow their own Constitution and Bylaw requirements).
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Old 02-13-2011, 07:29 AM   #171
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Forrest what was the jest of Chairman Shafer's report?
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Old 02-13-2011, 08:06 AM   #172
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Motion not feasible, of course!
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Old 02-13-2011, 08:24 AM   #173
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Freudian slip?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LI Pets View Post
Forrest what was the jest of Chairman Shafer's report?

Jest:
1
an utterance (as a jeer or quip) intended to be taken as mockery or humor
2prank b : a ludicrous circumstance or incident
3 a frivolous mood or manner <spoken in jest> b : gaiety and merriment

Gist
1: the ground of a legal action
2: the main point or part : essence <the gist of an argument>
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Old 02-13-2011, 08:51 AM   #174
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you'll never know
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Old 02-13-2011, 08:54 AM   #175
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you'll never know
No, in fact, I am pretty sure I do.
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Old 02-13-2011, 10:07 AM   #176
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Motion not feasible, of course!
I would like to know as well. I hope Forrest will post it with his rebuttal statement in a couple of days.

This new constitution certainly upended all the focus on Forrest's members' initiative and away from all the flim flam of the EC obstruction.
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Old 03-04-2011, 10:52 AM   #177
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Update - the motion, the C&BC report and DENCO Unit rebuttal are in the hands of the Unit Presidents in Region 11. There are only six Units left in Region 11 (Colorado West merged). We need four Units to pass the motion for it to go out to all the other Units in the country.

DENCO does not have to vote on this again though, so we have already approved it.

I have received emails from four Units (Arizona, 4cu, NM, Utah) that it is on their agenda and should be voted on no later than the end of April.

Given what happened at the Mid-Winter IBT, I firmly believe that the DENCO Motion is the last, best hope for saving our Club. It will, at the very least, give the membership the feeling that they have control of its destiny. It has the potential of developing into a full blown convention process where knowledgeable, assertive delegates resolutely represent the desires of their respective Units.
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Old 03-04-2011, 11:01 AM   #178
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Exclamation Flow chart

A number of people have asked about flow charts as a visual aid to understand the amendment process. So, this is what I've come up with. This first chart shows why I believe our current Bylaws tend to not be consistent with our Constitution - that is, there is a disconnect between the Bylaws and Constitution.
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Old 03-04-2011, 11:05 AM   #179
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Thumbs up Flow chart

This flow chart shows how the DENCO Unit Motion will help keep the Bylaws subordinate to, and consistent with, the Constitution. I visualize the Delegates acting as a filter. Any Bylaw, procedure, policy or protocol can be put on the agenda as a motion by any Unit Delegate at their annual meeting for debate, and vote to repeal.
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Old 03-05-2011, 05:41 PM   #180
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Several recent posts have been removed from this thread. Please keep your remarks on the topic of this thread and suitable for polite company.
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