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Old 02-09-2011, 07:48 AM   #1
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Amending the Amendments.

Hello all from "Boatdoc";
Three years ago after purchasing my Argosy I wanted to become a part of the Airstreamers crowd. I submitted the application but no one responded to my request. The excuse was that the secretary does not respond to E-mails of unknown origin. The lapsed time allowed me to look deeper into the WBCCI organization. Right or wrong, I came into conclusion that the membership spends more time bickering than enjoying the time while camping. Since WBCCI is supposed to be only about having organized fun while camping, I must be missing something. It seems that organization spends much more time organizing than camping. The WBCCI Constitution used up hundred times more paper than our US Constitution, Why? Is it just so that we can get together and have fun?

I spent fourteen years as a Navy Fly-boy acting under strict rule, because I was not a part of organization for fun. I was a part of most serious assignments. Now again, I live under my own business rules, and it is not fun either. Why then should I allow myself at my age to be in the middle of bickering individuals while pretending that I am having fun? Am I missing something here? Each time as I read the WBCCI membership arguments on the Forums, it makes me wonder why I would want to join. What possible hidden benefit is there for me? While majority of the lower ranks in membership is comprised of nice fun loving individuals, they are the one's who often get frustrated with the By-Laws of their Constitution and the by-weekly Amended Amendments. One's head can go into a spin. All of that, just to be able to go camping as a fun loving group.

While I realize that organizational rules must exist, but I think that rules for having fun can fit onto two pages of paper. What is the cause of such bickering? Is it the deterioration of social morals which necessitate such bickering? If not what is it?

I am glad to be a member of TAC. At least till the time when they choose to copy the WBCCI Constitution. Thanks, "Boatdoc"
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Old 02-09-2011, 08:51 AM   #2
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WB constitution should be shortened to. You must own an AS and use it when attending rallys or carravans. All officers elected one man one vote. All other rules decided by local units only. Sort of like states rights over federal. Only those in local units know what works for them. Unit presidents report to region presidents only, no no international hierarchy. Region presidents meet once per year if necessary. All other business done at region rallys with a short time limit. Internet used for all communications between officers and members. All else is done at regional presidents national meeting and only if cannot be done electronically. No travel money for unit or region unless decided by the units themselves. Too simple? Too confusing? Food for thought.
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Old 02-09-2011, 09:03 AM   #3
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Doc, I couldn't agree more. It seems like this is a problem with many clubs, but not to this extent. This is why you will see no numbers or decals on my AS. I bought it to have fun not argue.

Doug
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Old 02-09-2011, 10:30 AM   #4
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I spent fourteen years as a Navy Fly-boy acting under strict rule, because I was not a part of organization for fun... What is the cause of such bickering?
Hi boatdoc,

I understand your apprehension about joining the WBCCI, and don't blame you for not joining.

When you were in the Navy, command and control were a necessity. But command and control in a voluntary camping & caravan club is not necessary, and probably isn't desirable. We shouldn't need 144 pages of bylaws and policy. There shouldn't be a "protocol book" that only the International Officers are "privileged" to see. But our Constitution for its part is only a few pages.

In brief, that is what the "bickering" is all about. We have a bunch of command and control minded International leaders who behave as though the club would fall apart if they let go of control. What is happening is that they are losing control for just that reason. Members are leaving, and people like you will not join.

No regular member wants so many rules, and certainly we don't want rules to get in the way of having fun, relaxing and enjoying the freedom that Airstreaming promises. Yet, the only way to change the rules, or rid ourselves of bothersome rules, is to use the existing procedures and rules. And that's the rub - it's a Catch 22. The rules are designed to maintain the status quo, and the command and control types use them to do just that.
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Old 02-09-2011, 11:51 AM   #5
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WB constitution should be shortened to. You must own an AS and use it when attending rallys or carravans. All officers elected one man one vote. All other rules decided by local units only. Sort of like states rights over federal. Only those in local units know what works for them. Unit presidents report to region presidents only, no no international hierarchy. Region presidents meet once per year if necessary. All other business done at region rallys with a short time limit. Internet used for all communications between officers and members. All else is done at regional presidents national meeting and only if cannot be done electronically. No travel money for unit or region unless decided by the units themselves. Too simple? Too confusing? Food for thought.
Hi zigzaguzzi, DougZ and Forest;
My post was not intended to rough up anyone's feathers, and I am sorry if I did. What I do not understand is, that This tug of war has lasted for ever from what I read without any indication of oncoming change. What would happen to WBCCI if all members who do not agree with the structure or the stringent rules of the club just walked away for a year? Would International Ruling conglomerate survive? I doubt it very much. It would be like walking in and buying a failed business for a nickel on a dollar of value. The rules and Constitution can then be re-written to everyone's liking. Simplest way to dry up a raging river, is to cut off by re-routing the waters which feeds it. Thanks, "Boatdoc"
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:27 PM   #6
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What would happen to WBCCI if all members who do not agree with the structure or the stringent rules of the club just walked away for a year? Would International Ruling conglomerate survive? I doubt it very much.
No feathers ruffled here. You asked a fair question.

If we walked away would the WBCCI collapse? Maybe, but speculation is that some Past International Presidents actually want the disgruntled members to leave. They would then be free to do what they want with a club that might only have a few hundred left in it. All Club assets would remain though, worth over a million dollars, in their control. So, what would they care if we left? One even stated publicly that the club should strive for quality members, not quantity.
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:29 PM   #7
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Boatdoc, you summarize well why we didn't join. I do believe a traditional organization needs more than 2 pages of an organizational document and less than 144. The length is less important than how the organization is set up and whether it can be highjacked by the leadership for their personal needs of power.

Carol's post on what makes a good or a bad board is worth reading: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f286...tml#post949725

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Old 02-09-2011, 01:55 PM   #8
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Forest, remember quality vs quantity? No matter which way you read it, it means fewer members who all tow the line. The rest of us can disappear! zz
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Old 02-09-2011, 04:20 PM   #9
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BoatDoc
We all know its all about the money. THOSE at the top who travel all over the country(just a feeling/not a known fact) on the dues money of hard working members,who have no say in how the money is spent.The higher ups keep the membership bickering so they (the higher ups) can keep on without having to tell members where the money goes.
THEY DONT CARE if they lose members or the orgization goes in the dumper as long as they can keep doin what they are doin and not have to pay. But all good things come to an end and I think I can see the end of the gravey train.
I now IGNORE THIS THREAD
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Old 02-09-2011, 05:12 PM   #10
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Since WBCCI is supposed to be only about having organized fun while camping, I must be missing something.
orgainzed.....disorganized.........how about a bit of both?

personally, i tend to lead to the dis-orgainized side of things

life is short,
have fun now,
let your heirs organize things later

just my 2c
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Old 02-10-2011, 07:53 AM   #11
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I dont know w hy this keeps going thru my head.

Airstream Forums: $20. {or free}.

WBCCI $85.

More Bang for thr buck. OMHO> Sal.
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Old 02-10-2011, 09:58 AM   #12
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WHAT? I see no sense of tradition or history in the forums, it is just a place for info and to vent. The club goes back to the 50's and could never be replaced if we let it fail. The forums are a dime a dozen, if this one ended another one would appear tomorrow. zz
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Old 02-10-2011, 12:24 PM   #13
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Hi zigzaguzzi, DougZ and Forest;
My post was not intended to rough up anyone's feathers, and I am sorry if I did. What I do not understand is, that This tug of war has lasted for ever from what I read without any indication of oncoming change. What would happen to WBCCI if all members who do not agree with the structure or the stringent rules of the club just walked away for a year? Would International Ruling conglomerate survive? I doubt it very much. It would be like walking in and buying a failed business for a nickel on a dollar of value. The rules and Constitution can then be re-written to everyone's liking. Simplest way to dry up a raging river, is to cut off by re-routing the waters which feeds it. Thanks, "Boatdoc"
I can't help myself I decided to not pay my dues, so I should have nothing to say right? I am actually very torn and angry about the state of affairs which have lead to my decision, because the real club is at the local level where the average member resides and actually does have fun. More than a decade ago, when my wife and I joined, we joined a new unit, one which did not have any traditions or rules. We threw the Blue Book (C&B) in the trash and we thumbed our noses at the foolishness we saw at International Rallies we all but boycotted Region Rallies. We organized local, we traveled, we camped, and best of all, we made friends. We grew our unit faster than any other in the club. Some of us tried to make a difference by encouraging others, but we were dragged down by the dirty, spiteful, politics of a few narcisistic personalities which seem to perpetuate themselves in this environment.

Boatdoc asked a great question, why so many rules. The answer is simple, control of the kitty. For those who donít believe this and say thatís not what itís about, let me point out that the club is in the black for more than 1 million dollars. When I was Vintage Airstream Club Prez, the Board removed our right as an intraclub to spend any money. Why, because we had over 30 grand in our treasury and they wanted control over it. We were told that no one but them could make agreements outside the club and that committing our funds was in violation of our intra-club charter. Thatís because the VAC is a non entity in the club. We had no rights, the units treated the VAC like the red headed Step child (no offense to my Irish brethren) we had no authority, except what was granted by the EC7, and still donít. If we had spent every dime of that in support of our VAC friends what difference would it have made to them? Plenty, because they view that treasury as theirs. They have no respect for the members that they are supposed to be serving and certainly not the VAC members for which there was, and still is, great disdain. While I have been removed from that situation for a few years now, I have not heard anything that would convince me that the situation has changed!

Itís interesting that even the save wally effort came down to money. Regardless of the players, the association with the Executive Board has cost members money.

This is what it all boils down to, who controls the money! Itsí easy to hide behind the history and the romance of yesteryear and say nice things about the way it used to be, dress up in funny hats and formal attire. Itís nice that there some members so removed from all this that they can avoid the cold hard facts and just pay up to have the privilege of associating with like minded company for the purposes of recreation.

And therein lies the rub, it is not recreation for the leadership, its life. Biting and scratching and kicking to the top, many of them executives or persons of some means looking for their last hurrah, itís all they have left and the key is being close to the purse. Well Iím not going to let them take me down and Iím not going to be an accessory to their mistreatment of my friends by giving them the resources to continue doing so. If any of you think for one minute that this constitutional change is about fairness, just look at their track record.

Now who wants to go camping?
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Old 02-10-2011, 12:36 PM   #14
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WHAT? I see no sense of tradition or history in the forums, it is just a place for info and to vent. The club goes back to the 50's and could never be replaced if we let it fail. The forums are a dime a dozen, if this one ended another one would appear tomorrow. zz
When a good history goes bad the tradition is corrupted. If the club cannot be returned to whatever it was (which would probably not fit the present for many members), it has history but nothing more.

One can always start a new club or forum which responds both to the best of the past and the present and make new history.

Some organizations become ossified and crumble with age, some don't.

Gene
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