Trailer options and hitch suggestions

[Hit'the'road]

Hey guys!

You were all a big help in giving me information on a tow vehicle. Now it's on to the trailer.

I want an International 25'. I orginally talked to the dealer about getting the boondocker package (solar panels and glassmat batteries) and the video package (15" flat panel TV). Now I'm wondering if I should get those options or not. I could save $3500 by not getting them. Would it be cheaper to add those items later myself? Or would factory installation be better?

And I'm really confused about hitches. The dealer is recommending something called and Easy Lift hitch. I got a video package from Hensley Arrow. My impulse to just get all the best has me leaning toward the Hensley, but the dealers feels it is too much, too difficult to connect and too expensive. The Hensley ads make it sound like the only safe thing to do is get a Hensley.

If I get the boondocking and video packages and the Hensley, the whole package is getting much more expensive. What do you all think?

[jordandvm]

I've pulled a 2004 22' CCD with Chevy Avalanche 8.1 L, 2500, 4.10 rear axle with no problems (heated seats and backs are a must). You will do well with 2500 Duramax diesel and 25' CCD. After a 5000 mile trip recently, I've been thinking seriously of upgrading to 25' CCD. The bed and fridge are larger, and the couch would come in handy! I purchased a 3000 Honda EU generator (vs solar) to power when boondocking, and just love it! Have used our laptop as TV with Pinnacle PCTV (vs flat panel TV) add on for $90. Now just have to figure out how to pay for the upgrade to 25'!
Good Luck!
Jim

[bryanl]

The EAZ-Lift hitch is your basic load leveling hitch. That's usually sufficient for most Airstreams but does not do anything for handling problems such as sway. Sway is usually an indication of a weak tow vehicle not well designed for towing, improper tire inflation, poor load distribution, or similar things.

The most common sway control is a friction bar added to the EAZ Lift type hitch. This puts a little ball next to the trailer ball and another on the A-Frame with a bar that has a friction brake on it between them. Adds maybe $100.

Next up is the Reese Dual Cam which can also be added to most EAZ Lift type hitches. Adds about $200.

The Equal-i-zer (tm) is on about a par with the Dual cam but it is not an add-on and is a simpler mechanism - very good choice for a new hitch installation at about $400.

The Pullrite ($2000) and the Hensley Arrow ($3000) can compensate for a lot of sins and are very good sway control solutions. Most owners you hear about are quite adamant about the benefits they get from their purchase.

The Hensley is a bright orange hitch that adds about a foot to the distance between the trailer and tow vehicle and is significantly heavier in weight than most other hitches. It does require a bit more skill in re-connecting and one of those adjustable jack pad gadgets is usually a highly recommended accessory.

I would be very very wary of anyone telling you something is 'the only safe way to go' - that is called snake oil sales tactics.

[PWRSTRK]

Nothing is the "only answer." But... the Hensley is a great hitch and we've never regretted getting it. It takes a little learning but in the end it's a snap to use and it makes for the easiest towing I've ever experienced. Tom

[j54mark]

Disclaimer: I am not an expert on hitches and sway.

Sway can be caused by issues unrelated to the tow vehicle (weight and balance, misaligned axles, poorly inflated tires), but certainly the tow vehicle itself is most commonly the weak link.

The Reese Dual Cam is not really an add-on, and as far as I know it will work only with the Reese hitch system. If it can be used with other load leveling hitches it is news to me.

That said, if the choice is between Equilizer and Reese Dual Cam, I'd be inclined to go with the one offered by the best dealer as I think there is little to choose between them.

The Pullrite appears to be a great hitch, but you (usually) lose your spare tire carrier and they are more or less vehicle specific, meaning you will likely have to buy a new one if you change tow vehicles. Seems like they have some kind of trade-in policy though. The Hensley has all the advantages and disadvantages mentioned above.

Mark

[bryanl]

Originally Posted by j54mark

Disclaimer: I am not an expert on hitches and sway.

Good note. I don't think any of us are really experts and anyone thinking about using the advice or opinion of anyone in these forums should realize they are doing so at their own risk and must do their own research to weigh options carefully.

Originally Posted by j54mark

Sway can be caused by issues unrelated to the tow vehicle

this one could create an interesting debate! but I think most of those get into the definition of sway and the confusion of handling issues with unforseen external circumstances.

Originally Posted by j54mark

The Reese Dual Cam is not really an add-on, and as far as I know it will work only with the Reese hitch system.

" Attaches Directly to Round or Trunnion Spring Bars" from
http://www.reesehitch.com/sway_control.html
Note that most load leveling hitches are extremely similar and often just VAR re-labeling of an OEM product usually traceable back to Reese.

Thanks, Mark, some good stuff to chew on!

[j54mark]

I've towed too many utility trailers too many miles not to know that sway can be caused by factors connected to the trailer itself. In fact, I had an incipient serious sway incident just recently; since it involved seriously overloading a two wheel trailer with the weight centered well behind the axle, the less said here the better. I'll just mention that I towed it 35 mph or less and move on. But the point that the tow vehicle is of prime importance is entirely germain to this thread topic as no hitch system will overcome the limits imposed by an inadequate tow vehicle.

While the Reese Dual Cam does indeed bolt on, it is nevertheless part of an integrally designed system. I was just trying to make clear that it is not some bolt-on gimic that somebody thought up - not that anyone made that suggestion, just trying to keep somebody from reading in the wrong impression.

Reese does market its products under another brand name, which eludes me right now, and certainly the Dual Cam may be used in conjunction with that line. Maybe they sell under private label as well. However, it would seem to me that you would have to have the Reese hitch head for the trunions, the Reese Dual cam saddles, spring bars that would accept the trunions and saddles, and the Reese Dual cams themselves, which would not leave much of a non-Reese system. But frankly, I am just supposing; I could be quite wrong.

Mark

[Pahaska]

Originally Posted by j54mark

Disclaimer: I am not an expert on hitches and sway.

The Reese Dual Cam is not really an add-on, and as far as I know it will work only with the Reese hitch system. If it can be used with other load leveling hitches it is news to me.

That said, if the choice is between Equilizer and Reese Dual Cam, I'd be inclined to go with the one offered by the best dealer as I think there is little to choose between them.
Mark

The Dual-Cam will work with a number of other hitches. I'm using mine with a Draw-Tite. The HD Dual-Cam does require spring bars with the cam (that jog near where the chains attach), but the non-HD Dual-Cam will also work with cams that bolt to the rear of the spring bars. Spring bars with built-in cams are available or standard with several hitch manufacturers.

The Dual-Cam exerts a centering force where the Equalizer is simply a friction mechanism. For that reason, I prefer and use the Dual-Cam., even though my dealer sells the Equalizer.

I tow a 25 Classic, much heavier than the 25 CCD, and I do not feel that the expense for anything beyond the Dual-Cam or Equalizer is justified for this size Airstream. I put on about 12,000 miles in the last year in all kinds of weather and couldn't ask for a more stable trailer.

[bryanl]

Originally Posted by j54mark

I've towed too many utility trailers too many miles not to know that sway can be caused by factors connected to the trailer itself. Mark

whoops, I misread and thought I was reading sway separate from the rig as a whole.

I agree and in fact I think that a most common sway handling problem is poor trailer load distribution.

[bryanl]

Originally Posted by Pahaska

The Dual-Cam exerts a centering force where the Equalizer is simply a friction mechanism.

this doesn't explain why both have equivalent performance benefit from an experience standpoint.

the debate on this one can get real interesting (i.e. heated) so I think it is best to stick with the experience folks have had.

I get real tempted, though .... ;-)

[Hit'the'road]

Thank you again for all the thought provoking information.

Let me direct your attention to the first part of my question. What is your collective opinion on the different options available on the CCD?

Pahaska, how do you like the Silverado Duramax? Any tricks for easily finding diesel fuel?

[hookedonclassic]

I didn't see what wheelbase your 3/4 HD Pickup has but I can tell you that my vehicle GMC HD 3/4 4door short box with the Dual Cam and a 29' AS are a good match. So far I haven't regretted getting the Dual Cam. I thought I could always upgrade to Hensley if I wasn't happy with Dual Cam but I don't see that I would do that now.

[Pahaska]

Originally Posted by Hit'the'road

Pahaska, how do you like the Silverado Duramax? Any tricks for easily finding diesel fuel?

There is a long thread on diesels if you do a search.

I think the Duramax/Allison is a terrific combination. I get just over 16 mpg at 60 and 15 mpg at 65 towing the Classic 25 and 19 to 20 mpg around home. I came from Oklahoma City to Hillsboro, TX last Wednesday and was never out of overdrive except for a traffic slowdown in Fort Worth. It really feels good to go over the Arbuckle Mountains and never have it shift out of OD.

I have never had a problem finding diesel fuel except once in the Michigan UP when I didn't fuel up when I should have. I do carry several gallons in cans in the truck bed when in doubtful territory. I don't mind pulling up to the 18-wheeler pumps and getting the best price. I do have to hand-hold some of the bulkier nozzles at truck pumps.

You very quickly start to notice the diesel signs around town. With a 26-gallon tank, I have plenty of range, though.

[jordandvm]

Originally Posted by Hit'the'road

Thank you again for all the thought provoking information.

Let me direct your attention to the first part of my question. What is your collective opinion on the different options available on the CCD?

Spare tire/bracket/steel wheel : A Must!
Wrap protectors : A Must!
Stone Guards : A Must!
Entertainment Package: Great if you are an Audiophile!
Flat Screen TV : If you have a laptop, look into getting PCTV add-on for $90 instead!
Boon Docker Package: Seriously look at Honda or Yamaha Generators to meet your needs. You'll find they power your AC and Microwave, plus recharge your batteries in no time!
Other considerations: Please look at the bed closely. We have a 22' CCD (48" x 78"), and both agree, it is too small. We will be looking closely at 25' (52" x 76") to see if it meets our needs. If not we will look at 28' (60" x 78"). Besides night use, we usually take a short afternoon nap after lunch, esp on the road to rest our eyes! We are sold on CCD only interior design. We will not look at anything else.

[Silvertwinkie]

We have the 25' cousin to the CCD and I have to say that the dual batteries alone that come standard are plenty good for about a weeks worth of boondocking. I agree that if you need more than that, a Honda gen would serve you far better.

I agree with what Jordan said on list of important options. I would STRONGLY suggest you consider two items that are NOT on the list that Airstream will install for an upcharge.

1) 15k BTU A/C unit with the comfort control system. Cost something like $300 to upgrade from the 13.5k manual control unit. Well worth it...and for the naysayers who thought that it would be too much, well, after one season with it in various humid and non humid heat conditions, it worked flawlessly and was just perfect with just a touch of overkill in cooling our 25' coach.

2) Though the CCD may already come with this, if not, opt for the second fantastic fan in the rear vent. The windows on the CCD are better than that of the standard Safari line making the fan not as critical, but I will tell you this, if you boondock, the fans are a godsend. True two will chew up more battery power, but the cooling ability of 2 fans is just plain awesome.

As for the hitch, you'll find a wide range of comments. Hensely, Reese, DrawTight are among the leading brands I know. My exp with the Reese system with the Dual Cam HP has been a great combo with our 25' Safari.

[Minnie's Mate]

Originally Posted by jordandvm

Entertainment Package: Great if you are an Audiophile!
Flat Screen TV : If you have a laptop, look into getting PCTV add-on for $90 instead!

We stopped at our one and only Airstream dealer in Georgia to "Window shop" and told the salesman upfront that is what we were there for. We looked at the model we were there to examine which had the entertainment package and could not find out what is included in the entertainment package. From the description on the price sheet listed, all that was included was upgraded speakers, a AM/FM CD/DVD player, 15" LCD TV, and a swing arm wall bracket. The salesperson couldn't tell us any more than the two line description on the "window sticker".

The speakers were JVC, I think, maybe $100-$200 more than the standard installed. The AM/FM CD/DVD player was JVC also, but you can add a Blaupunkt 12v dvd player for about $125. Best Buy carries a 20" LCD TV for about $869 and the wall bracket for under $175. The wiring for the TV was run through the back of the overhead storage locker and through a tan colored conduit attached to the wall over to the wall bracket where the co-ax and power cord draped down below the TV. The attached photo has the wires run under a piece of wood with laminate attached. This allowed the TV to pivot the full 180 degrees on the wall bracket.

I would think that this would still be well under $1,400 for materials at the most. If you go with the same 15" TV you could save another couple of hundred dollars. The big question is, can you manage the wiring without having to get between any of the interior/exterior skins and would you be able to do the work yourself if you don't have to open up the skins and is it worth the savings to do it yourself. As long as you don't have to open the skins, I think I could do it myself and have a larger TV in the process.

[Hit'the'road]

Originally Posted by Minnie's Mate

I think I could do it myself and have a larger TV in the process.

That's what I've been thinking. I can't imagine how you would get between the skins. I think I would try to figure out some other way of just hiding the wiring.

[Minnie's Mate]

Originally Posted by Hit'the'road

That's what I've been thinking. I can't imagine how you would get between the skins. I think I would try to figure out some other way of just hiding the wiring.

You could probably run the wires from the a/c outlet and cable connection under the dinette through conduit or stapling the wires to the wall and then through the forward dinette bench and up the back with a small section of tan conduit running verticle from the vack of the bench to the bracket.

[Silvertwinkie]

I'd totally agree on not going with the factory entertainment package as it is VERY costly for what you get, however, they do wire it as it's being built for it. If I'm reading this post right, just for reference, pulling wire between the insulated skins is not going to be an easy task, even through the power outlets. The outlets do not use conduit or BX, it's a Romex type wire that is in between bats of insulation. One of the perks of the factory is that the prewiring I believe is done before the inner skins are attached. Of course a good stereo shop could work wonders on the coach at a possilbe savings.....

[gleng]

I have towed an Airstream (31', 34' and now 30' Classic) for 22 years and two years ago decided to change from Reese Dual Cam to the Hensley Hitch, due to my age and physical condition. I find the Hensley easier to hitch-unhitch plus the stability of the Hensley makes towing a breeze. Also, we have had two pickups and for the past 9 years, a suburban which is a far superior tow vehicle to pickups when it comes to stability and visibility plus, you have the flexibility of cooled/heated cargo space and the option of carrying 8 fans to the big game.