Rear storage leak - 2004 Classic?

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by SilverCottage

I lifted the vinyl floor at the back of my 2007 under the dining table and it was damp across nearly the entire width of the trailer. I have the wood drying now and it still feels firm but is discolored.

It makes you sick that for the price of these units there is a huge gap where the water can run in after sitting on the rear bumper storage area.

SC,
Sad but true...this SHOULD NOT be happening, especially on the newer units.

I'm just getting past the filiform problems....now this.

Is it entering thru the same area?
Could you post some pic's to show how your dealing with it?
May interest other FB owners. Where are you planning your repairs?

Keep on keep'n on. Best of luck.

Bob

[Airslide]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Same spot on both seams....






It's been drying now since 'bout 1pm yesterday....You can see how much better it looks already. Guess the fancy drying rig is doing ok, still a little damp though.

Thanks for the picture. I understand now what you mean by drilling near the seams. I poured a glass of water on the bumper and it seems to puddly right in the middle. I was thinking I need to drill a hole right there but it will for sure drain in the rear pan. Thoughts? The pan is better than the storage compartment i suppose?

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by Airslide

Thanks for the picture. I understand now what you mean by drilling near the seams. I poured a glass of water on the bumper and it seems to puddly right in the middle. I was thinking I need to drill a hole right there but it will for sure drain in the rear pan. Thoughts? The pan is better than the storage compartment i suppose?

Vinnie,

Not surprised. I was looking at a photo in your gallery of the rear of your coach. When I enlarged it, it did appear the center was the low point.
Not a big concern with a little water getting in the tray.
Ours always fills a little in a good downpour, drizzles in over the lip, a few holes in the pan and some of those lock together rubber mat squares helped get around that.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Hi, well so much for the theory that the Classics with a lip from the bumper, under the moulding, can't get the rear floor wet. On my Safari, the lower belt moulding sits tightly on top of the bumper cover. I have checked for leaks and found none, but I still sealed the moulding where it touches the bumper cover and each end of the moulding in-line with my frame. I removed all of the plastic carpet cover around my queen bed, but left it in my storage compartment. No signs of wetness or moisture has been seen. I did feel cold air from under my bed, so I used "D" weather seal around both edges of my street side compartment door.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Well the trunk has finally dried out.

Just for S&G's I pulled up the carpets/pads in both rear storage compartments, guess what?.....

Not as bad BUT....

[SilverCottage]

I know this has probably been discussed but given that a 4*8 sheet of 3/4" marine plywood is $65 (Overton's® > Greenwood PlyDek XL Plywood Panel 4 x 8 each - Boating & Marine > Carpet & Flooring > Marine Lumber & Re-decking : Boat Flooring, Boat Decking, Marine Flooring, Marine Decking) why the heck is it not being used in our $50k+ trailers?

What would the difference be on a whole trailer? $150?

[Airslide]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Well the trunk has finally dried out.

Just for S&G's I pulled up the carpets/pads in both rear storage compartments, guess what?.....

Not as bad BUT....

This plywood thing is the achilles heal of the airstream. Thats why I opted to store the dang thing inside since I got it. I will never be doing a shell off restoration on an S/O.. Im afraid it would have a for sale sign on it before that happened. I am going to do the same drilling trick to mine.

Thanks Vinnie

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Hi, pictures of double "D" seal on storage compartment door. This makes for a snug fit and is somewhat tight opening and closing this door. I don't think the original black seal does very much. Both white "D" seals wrap all the way around the door.

[art]

did you actually see the water seeping in after a rain storm?

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by art

did you actually see the water seeping in after a rain storm?

I did AFTER the plastic, carpet and padding was out. (POI...NOT an easy task) The rear trunk floor was soaked right in front of the largest gap's between the moulding and bumper, bumper was low at both seams. You can see the drain holes I drilled in the bumper cover to drain the area. (see above post's)

On the storage compartments, there were LARGE gaps in the sealant applied to the top of the belt moulding right under both piano hinges.

I wasn't a big fan of the carpeted interior from the beginning but the DW kind'a liked it after our 63. I know it's a lot easier to carpet the entire floor during the build but why that should include the non people areas is beyond me.

As for the quality of the build materials, well what can I say? The FIRST thing I did after delivery was replace all exterior fasteners with stainless. Cost...$13.00.

Change of plans on putting the carpet back in, will be at the BB home stores today looking to get some snap together drainage tiles for all the compartments, same used on the 63.

I really don't mind the maintenance stuff. It's this poor design and materials that gets 'ya down after awhile. I sure am tired of be'n piz'd off!!

On the plus side.....I did find a half eaten candy bar and a Bic lighter under the carpet next to the water heater.

[ROBERT CROSS]

It's dry and done, everything packed away, let's get out'a here!!!

Couldn't find the tiles locally, ordered them on line from Ace Hardware.
Not as flexible as the ones I've used before but workable.
Had to use a cutting wheel and wire cutters to trim.

I'll go and finish that candy bar now.

[dznf0g]

Guys, I've spoke up on this one before. I still believe we all need to be looking not so strictly at the lower beltline as THE culprit. As has been stated the fiberglass center bumper as well as the plastic bumper ends do have a 1/2 to 3/4" lip which acts as a water dam. I happened to see a Classic on the line at JC with the moulding not yet installed. It was VERY well sealed......not to say the build quality is consistent....we all know it aint. The weak spot in my mind is the joints between the bumper ends and the center section. If that is'nt well sealed, there would be a good path for water entry. I don't think it should ever be necessary to seal the bottom of the moulding. I like the water exit theory. To me sealing the bottom is a band-aide fix.

All that being said:
1) Annual inspection of ALL exposed sealed seams MUST be done and corrected.
2) ALWAYS look up when you find water DOWN. I, too have found other potential water entries at the license plate housing (I used closed cell foam tape for ease of bulb maintenance, instead of sealer), tail light housings, compartment door, Window frame, AWNING MOUNTING RAIL, as well as rear running lights. Anyplace which allows water through the skin will run down, fill and exit the c-channel to the interior.
3) Look forward of the rear compartment....and up: Water can and will run long distances and the c-channel is a super highway for water.

So far, regular inspections and maintenance of sealer has worked for me. No moisture in the trunk (I think!!!!??????) I do like the "easy tile" look and functionality. May just add that to my list!

Another hint. Not sure how effective it is, but I have a moisture meter which is designed for the horticulture industry to measure soil dampness level. I stick it deep into the carpet pile and look for a reading. Not sure how effective it is, or if it gives any accuracy at all, but have found no moisture thus far. No clue where I got it.....many years ago.

Question though? For those of you who still have carpet AND plastic...isn't the condensation which I believe would show up, a good test? Has anyone NOT had condensation under the plastic AND found water in the carpet?????

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

........I don't think it should ever be necessary to seal the bottom of the moulding. I like the water exit theory. To me sealing the bottom is a band-aide fix.

Are you saying that if you had a 1/2in gap between the lower edge of the molding and the bumper cover at both seams you wouldn't seal that area?

Lipps…you wann'a talk lips.

My skylight had lips like Mik Jagged, my black tank vent, like Anjaleeka Jolee…
I'm sure the lip on the very substantial bumper cover is a well designed piece, but so were the vent & skylight, is not out of the realm of possibility that the "builders" at JC built all three 'til they broke?

I'm go'n for the obvious, if that don't do it we'll try another approach.

That's my story and I'm stuck to it....

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Are you saying that if you had a 1/2in gap between the lower edge of the molding and the bumper cover at both seams you wouldn't seal that area?

Lipps…you wann'a talk lips.

My skylight had lips like Mik Jagged, my black tank vent, like Anjaleeka Jolee…
I'm sure the lip on the very substantial bumper cover is a well designed piece, but so were the vent & skylight, is not out of the realm of possibility that the "builders" at JC built all three 'til they broke?

I'm go'n for the obvious, if that don't do it we'll try another approach.

That's my story and I'm stuck to it....

Is it really 1/2" or a estimate? In your pic, it doesn't look like 1/2", although it is definitely wider than mine. I worry that something else is going on with your AS if there is really 1/2" of gap between the bumper and molding. Is it an even gap from side to side? IMHO, the real, effective sealing of that area is done at the skin/floor seam, rivets along the c-channel and the skin/bumper/corner lip. I believe the molding is there to act as a beauty cover and "umbrella" for the joints. So sealing the upper skin/molding seam is appropriate, but sealing the bottom provides for the eventual likelihood of trapping water behind the molding. That is never good.

If you think the gap is so wide that the bumper lip/skin seam is exposed, I would recommend removal of the molding completely and performing a thorough reseal of the components underneath.

[idmtman]

Having battled this issue for quite a while, and after resealing nearly every seam from the bumper rail, taillights, rear window eyebrow, marker lights, all rear lap seams... it appears to stay dry. Yesterday I decided to remove the carpet and pad. I have always dried everything out with heat when I noticed any moisture but I thought it prudent to get rid of the carpet. I didn't have any mold and no significant damage to the plywood. I was surprised to find a strip about 10 inches wide running along the very back just under the storage door that looks like the waterproofing material you can apply to a foundation.

I did a wipe out with a bleach solution (just in case) and my plan is to apply 2-3 coats of Kilz primer and then install vinyl. It makes more sense to me to have a vinyl floor there anyway versus the carpet. I left about a 1/2 inch of carpet (tacked down) around the perimeter near the bed frame so that I wouldn't have issues with the carpet inside the trailer. Once I glue down the vinyl and caulk the edges, I will finish it off with metal transition strips to provide a finished look and to keep the small of carpet from fraying.

The disadvantage is that items placed in the compartment will likely have a tendency to move around more, but I'll be able to tell if I have any water entry more easily and I won't feel guilty placing dirty items into the compartment. I never really understood residential carpet for such an area.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Actually dz the gap was right at both bumper cover seams. At least 1/2 on the curb side, slightly less on the street. Not only the gap but it's a little low in the same spot and the water pools. POI...both side covers cracked at the rivet's during first season. Dealer went out of business... dressed them with gel coat glass and 'kinda forgot about it till now...
I realized after I found the wet trunk that that pool dried up pretty quick, and with the amount of wetness on the floor right in the same area I'd go after it the way I did. I checked everything topside when I replaced the skylight last month. Re-sealed the antenna and both FV's. Awning mounting looked good. Still want to re-do both rear side & back windows, they don't show any obvious problems but what the hay...

The way the skylight lip was cracked I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing didn't happen to the cover lip. Just to be safe I been shopping for a different style molding, one that stays bright and not so stiff.

Bright side....got a good stock of sealer.

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Actually dz the gap was right at both bumper cover seams. At least 1/2 on the curb side, slightly less on the street. Not only the gap but it's a little low in the same spot and the water pools. POI...both side covers cracked at the rivet's during first season. Dealer went out of business... dressed them with gel coat glass and 'kinda forgot about it till now...
I realized after I found the wet trunk that that pool dried up pretty quick, and with the amount of wetness on the floor right in the same area I'd go after it the way I did. I checked everything topside when I replaced the skylight last month. Re-sealed the antenna and both FV's. Awning mounting looked good. Still want to re-do both rear side & back windows, they don't show any obvious problems but what the hay...

The way the skylight lip was cracked I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing didn't happen to the cover lip. Just to be safe I been shopping for a different style molding, one that stays bright and not so stiff.

Bright side....got a good stock of sealer.

Hey Robert, can you post a pic of the end rivet repair? One of mine is cracked and I am trying to figure out how to cleanly repair with fiberglass matting w/o removing the whole thing. I think a rubber fender washer between the pieces when re-riveting might allow for movement between the pieces without stressing them.

Let us know how the resealing goes and what you find!

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

Hey Robert, can you post a pic of the end rivet repair? One of mine is cracked and I am trying to figure out how to cleanly repair with fiberglass matting w/o removing the whole thing. I think a rubber fender washer between the pieces when re-riveting might allow for movement between the pieces without stressing them.

Let us know how the resealing goes and what you find!

dz.. Marine-Tex Epoxy
This is what I used for the rivet hole repair. (The grey one in the drill bit pic above) I just drilled out the old one and used the Tex to secure a plastic trim rivet. I had it left over from a gel coat fix on the boat. Didn't use glass or mat...... that Tex stuff is tuff, holds really well too.

It does come in grey that matches the cover pretty good. If my leak repairs are successful I think I'll get some of the grey and fill in those seams.

[NOAZRK2690]

It really pays to read these forums.

My 2004 has spent most of its life in a pole barn. But since I've had it, its been outside and unprotected. Last June, after reading this post, I decided to check under my trunk plastic. Sure enough, it was soaked. Frankly, it is a no brainer. I completely removed the plastic covering, including the area behind the electrical access panel. I now through my bars on an old oriental carpet. (LOL) If you yank on the plastic hard enough and make appropriate cut, it will all come out. As suggested in other posts, I caulked everything at the rear bumper area, but didn't stop there. From my rear airconditioner base down everything got caulked. After the next rain, more wet carpet. Okay so what was the answer? Get out there and watch what was happening in a rain storm. Sure enough, there was one roof rivet that created a fairly deep bird bath on the flattest part of the roof. After caulking all the rear roof rivets, there has been no more wet carpet. Out of concern, I went on to discover damp carpet around the refrigerator and slideout. Sure enough, there were fairly large bird baths on the roof in those areas, so I put a dab of caulk on all the roof rivets. Everything is dry as a bone, finely. My floor is solid as a rock and I have no concern about mold any more.

Nip it in the bud.

~A

[Bluto]

Before I start drilling. And since some time has past.

I'd like to know from R. Cross and anyone else that drilled the holes in the Classic bumper cover if that helped solve the puddling of water in that area, and if the drill hole size is the right one or is a larger one needed?