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InterBlog · 07-22-2018, 12:30 PM

Every ICE-driven vehicle has:

(a) a battery
(b) an alternator

So it's surprising to me to find so much variability in the information pertaining to what is supposed to constitute "right" with these things.

I took it to O'Reilly's for a second opinion (or third, or fourth). They put their meter on it and proclaimed the alternator as "weak" but not to the point of needing replacement. It was providing 13.5 V when the guy said 13.7 or greater was preferable (although 13.5 would charge the battery). The alternator is now 17 months old.

The guy who did this measuring seemed like a nice young man, and this was clearly not his first rodeo. He also said that a standing battery charge of 12.5 V was just fine (100%). The written literature also says that, but that contradicts other suggestions.

It should be a simple decision tree.

If the number reads A, then I respond by doing B.
If the number reads C, then I respond by doing D.
And so on.

I even made myself a written decision matrix to capture this information for clear future reference, except it's not that easy when there's NOT a consensus and we're talking about tenths of a volt this way or that way.

I wouldn't be as concerned if the rig didn't strand itself already once this week, but here I am, no further ahead than I was yesterday.

Tincampers · 07-22-2018, 01:14 PM

12.5 is 90%. 12.7 is 100%. In your earlier pictures you showed a battery at 100% and an alternator putting out more than the minimum at 13.9 volts. Was there a warranty on the alternator or has that long passed?

Boxster1971 · 07-22-2018, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InterBlog

Apparently the OBD is a lying sack of ****. I don't know why this is the case. Maybe there's a way to calibrate it.

Simultaneous readings, engine running.

It's possible the Carista or OBD Fusion software is just grabbing a voltage on the OBD data port and not the ECU battery/charge voltage. I looked at the Carista web site, could not find any documentation. Also noticed the compatible vehicle list does not include T1N Sprinters.

Looked at the OBD Fusion app info and it does say battery voltage. But there are about 50 different voltages in the OBD II PID (Parameter IDs) standard, most don't apply to your Sprinter as they are low voltage (>2) for emissions sensors.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OBD-II_PIDs

Just looked at the owners manual for my Ultra-Gauge. It mentions that there are two "Battery Voltages" available.

One is commonly know as the gauge voltage: Vehicle battery voltage is passed through a fuse and delivered to pin 16 of the vehicle’s OBDII
connector. This could be the voltage your OBD Fusion app is displaying. You could meter pin 16 on the connector and see if it corresponds to the 12.8V displayed on your app.

The other is "Control Module" or "ECM Battery" voltage. This is the voltage I monitor on my Ultra-Gauge.

You will have to contact OCTech for details on what there OBD Fusion software measures on your Sprinter.

Lotus54 · 07-22-2018, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachuko

Cable that goes from the Alternator to the Starter to the Battery... has an inline resistor that degrades over time.

BTW, I’m sure that is a fuse NOT a resistor. Although if it has connection or other issues it certainly could act like a resistor.
I’d be temped to just run a separate cable.

No idea if the T1N has that setup or not. Some looking in the parts manual would show.
Reading voltage off the back of the regulator (on the back of the alternator) would give a more accurate condition of the alternator/regulator.
but of course, I believe that is rather inaccessible...

I always like anything to charge about 14-14.2Vdc. That is a good value, some batteries don’t like much more, some don’t like much less. Most AGMs are very close to a ‘standard’ Flooded, although not are all the same (we used a lead/calcium flooded with high specific gravity- for cold weather use. It would freeze at a lower temp)

I would always suggest taking the earths off, cleaning and reinstalling. If you are super paranoid use some silver conductive grease (very expensive). it will improve conductivity and help keep corrosion from happening.

(All just my experience of course)

Mark

Boxster1971 · 07-22-2018, 04:13 PM

T1N, Model 903 Sprinters do not have the same Y-cable found in later Sprinters.

I pulled a VIN from a typical 2006 Sprinter for sale on AutoTrader and got the parts diagram and parts list from EPC. Copies attached for info.

InterBlog · 07-23-2018, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tincampers

12.5 is 90%. 12.7 is 100%. In your earlier pictures you showed a battery at 100% and an alternator putting out more than the minimum at 13.9 volts. Was there a warranty on the alternator or has that long passed?

You appear to be correct. Everyone's brain is baked here due to the heat. We need to return to seasonal "normal" for cognition to resume.

We put it on a charger for a few hours yesterday and brought it to a level where the OBD was reading 13.0. I'll wait about 48 hours and go re-read it in storage to see if it is maintaining.

Edit: I couldn't recall yesterday whether the T1N Sprinter chassis thermometer reads into the triple digits or not. It seemed to peg at 99 degrees (exterior temp). Of course it was far hotter than that inside the van, but our furnace thermostat only has a two-digit readout, and I've yet to install a better general thermometer.

Tincampers · 07-23-2018, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InterBlog

You appear to be correct. Everyone's brain is baked here due to the heat. We need to return to seasonal "normal" for cognition to resume.

We put it on a charger for a few hours yesterday and brought it to a level where the OBD was reading 13.0. I'll wait about 48 hours and go re-read it in storage to see if it is maintaining.

Edit: I couldn't recall yesterday whether the T1N Sprinter chassis thermometer reads into the triple digits or not. It seemed to peg at 99 degrees (exterior temp). Of course it was far hotter than that inside the van, but our furnace thermostat only has a two-digit readout, and I've yet to install a better general thermometer.

Yeah that happens at the most random moments...

Tincampers · 07-23-2018, 05:48 AM

Our a/c failed us from the get go on our Alaska trip. When we had it checked in Wausau, the tech said there was a pinhole leak in the lower right hand side of the condenser. At that time, it was very small. By the time we were leaving Canada heading home and needed the a/c again, the coolant had all leaked out again. It was a long and hot ride home. Doing some reading over on Sprinter-source found that there is an issue with the fan being mounted too close to the condenser causing it to rub until a hole develops. This is where we are now. We need a new condenser and dryer/accumulator. The fix is to shim the bottom of the fan at point ‘A’ in the photo about 1/4” or so to get it away from the coils.

https://sprinter-source.com/forum/at...3&d=1532198115

InterBlog · 07-23-2018, 06:12 AM

This is good information. Previously I had known about the a/c units needing long-period recharge (ours was recharged in 2014 and, knock wood, has held ever since). At the time I was told by MB that it's a common occurrence - something about the way the seals were constructed. But I was unaware of any potential flaws such as this.

InterBlog · 07-23-2018, 07:19 AM

Similar to the reference posted above, but with less wasted space and extraneous info removed. Our OBD only goes to one decimal place, so I rounded. I printed this out in color, laminated with packing tape, and will put on my behind-the-driver's-seat magnetic bulletin board for reference.

Hint: if you make one for yourself, laminate front and back of that section of the page with clear packing tape BEFORE you trim it down. Easier that way.

If I am ever able to answer the question at the bottom, I will update. When our battery died last week, it was too weak for the OBD to even give me a SOC reading at that time. It just gave me a voltage error. LB_3 hooked up the free-standing charging device but I do not recall what it was reading at that time, because we were focused on just getting the rig out of the storage garage.

InterBlog · 07-24-2018, 05:00 AM

FWIW, this was on Instagram last night, referring to the NCV3.

It's not every day that someone memes a Sprinter maintenance item... heck, I don't recall seeing it done ever... so I thought I'd post it. The IGer sounded like they knew what they were talking about. Clamps can sometimes work their way loose, they say.

wachuko · 07-24-2018, 06:41 AM

^ Yikes ^

Bring your kid to work day and they let them play with the hoses and clamps??

Lotus54 · 07-24-2018, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InterBlog

Edit: I couldn't recall yesterday whether the T1N Sprinter chassis thermometer reads into the triple digits or not. It seemed to peg at 99 degrees (exterior temp).

It most certainly will read hotter.
I’ve seen about 112 f on the Sprinter thermometer readout

InterBlog · 07-24-2018, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachuko

^ Yikes ^

Bring your kid to work day and they let them play with the hoses and clamps??

I appreciate it when people put use-able information on Instagram. Instagram largely wants to degenerate into a bunch of pictures of young women's bums. I have a bum of my own - I don't need to see any others, even if they do have higher centers of gravity than my aging rendition.

wachuko · 07-24-2018, 10:15 AM

Another task that I am adding to my maintenance scheduled list: Clean EGR Valve. For my year AI it is a 400.00 replacement part. So best to keep it in great shape by cleaning every time I do the oil change:

For newer Sprinters (2010-2016)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fad1Av3gRkI

Earlier Sprinters (2004-06)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX14wcmmmrQ

Tincampers · 07-24-2018, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachuko

Another task that I am adding to my maintenance scheduled list: Clean EGR Valve. For my year AI it is a 400.00 replacement part. So best to keep it in great shape by cleaning every time I do the oil change:

I wonder how much Mercedes wants for that EGR removal tool...errr...rusty hammer?

wachuko · 07-24-2018, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InterBlog

I appreciate it when people put use-able information on Instagram. Instagram largely wants to degenerate into a bunch of pictures of young women's bums. I have a bum of my own - I don't need to see any others, even if they do have higher centers of gravity than my aging rendition.

I have never seen it as a source of information... always as just a photo-staging/captured place... Only thing that I use it for is to keep up with work my daughter is doing:

https://www.instagram.com/danidiazriv/?hl=en

Some times I learn of something she is working on by Instagram.... and yes, she still lives with us

... but she would be in her room and only come down to eat and does not like sharing her work with me until it is done...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tincampers

I wonder how much Mercedes wants for that EGR removal tool...errr...rusty hammer?

wachuko · 07-24-2018, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tincampers

I wonder how much Mercedes wants for that EGR removal tool...errr...rusty hammer?

I had not seen that video... I only watched the one for my year...

Oh goodness... that was awful. And did you see the amount of silicone gasket sealer!!! Instead of using the proper factory seal!!!

Another video on that EGR...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX_zK9HQeyE

Lotus54 · 07-24-2018, 03:04 PM

The EGR on mine was very difficult to remove. It was really stuck in there.
But I used a plastic deadblow- until that wouldn’t do anything and I had to switch to a brass one.
Even at that it took my a very long time to get it to move at all (even with Kroil, moderate heat etc)- and since it was shot anyway, I didn’t worry too much about it.

I used anti-seize to reinstall the new one. No use making it harder if it needs to be removed again.

That is about the only reason I can think of to remove at 10k, make sure it is still able to move and pop some anti-seize on it. I would think ever 20k would be more than enough to clean. But I guess you will find out when you take it out.

BTW, mine was not stuck, but failed electrically. So rather than monkey around I binned it.

Mark

amirm · 07-27-2018, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InterBlog

State of charge is (almost) immaterial when it comes to high-current, short-term load of a starter. Internal impedance of the battery is unknown from those readings. High impedance means that as soon as the starter engages, the voltage will drop like a rock and engine will not start.

When it comes to engine start batteries, you either have a good one or not! Anything in-between is liable to fail at the most inopportune time.