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Old 06-21-2013, 11:17 AM   #1
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I hate the MACERATOR system!

Forgive me if this topic has already been aired to death, but having exchanged our Flying Cloud for an Interstate, we're frustrated by the dumping process on the Interstate.
When we're hooked up, we like to be liberal with electricity and water, and my wife will happily take a 5+ minute shower - yes even in the Interstate.
So WHY didn't Airstream think about this and provide an openable grey water valve as in their travel trailers?
I'm forever worried about whether the grey tank will overflow, and consequently the macerator pump gets used several times a day when we're hooked up.
It's driving me nuts.
Is it possible/feasible to remove the macerator and go back to the valve system?
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:46 PM   #2
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I too am Leary about the "macerator only" situation. From prior experience, I know these things will occasionally fail or get stuck, and that scares me... I am considering installing a 4" valve somewhere upstream of the macerator. (no pun intended). That will give me an "either/or" option. Still studying the problem, and I too would appreciate any suggestions or ideas.
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Old 06-21-2013, 01:48 PM   #3
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We just got our Interstate and had the same concerns. We haven't gone camping yet and, before we go, wanted to know what everyone else does when hooked up. Do you leave the hose hooked up, check the status of the tanks once in a while, and turn on the pump when the tanks start to get full? Do you retract the hose after every dump? Thanks,
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Old 06-21-2013, 02:39 PM   #4
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I LOVE my macerator!

Does this mean that the Interstate has only ONE waste tank? If so, what a shame. And poor design too.

When I highly “contemporized” my 1976 ARGOSY several years ago, I had built what I call a Waste Management System. See posts 526 and 529 on my main thread here:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f227...-18448-38.html

We used the Sani Con macerator, since acquired by Thetford. See post 582 here:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f227...tml#post726471

The Sani Con has a GREY WATER BYPASS as a standard feature. You keep the grey water valve open while connected to a sewer and rarely worry about overflow.

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Old 06-21-2013, 02:55 PM   #5
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I've only had my Interstate for a couple of months but I should recount a couple of "macerator system issues" I've met so far:
1) The faucet in the kitchen sink has a design flaw in that if the water flow valve is left in the upright (hot) position, then when you close the glass lid, it pushes down on the valve and opens it. This happened once when we were connected to the City water, so the pump was switched off, and since we had the A/C running, we heard nothing. After a few minutes my wife noticed water flowing off the top of the countertop onto the floor. The grey water tank had filled completely and it was backed up into the kitchen sink and out. If the Interstate had had a conventional dump valve, that could never have happened.
2) The macerator reel and box on the Interstate is a very tight fit, and after a few uses, the hose has become severely pinched by the motor and reel, and now has a split in it. So it leaks and will need to be replaced.
I'm pretty disappointed about several details issues like that in our Interstate.
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Old 06-21-2013, 03:38 PM   #6
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Does this mean that the Interstate has only ONE waste tank? If so, what a shame. And poor design too.
No. Late-model Interstates have one 26-gallon gray tank and one 26-gallon black tank. Both feed to the macerator through separate valves. Since on-board fresh water is 26 gallons in the fresh tank plus 6 gallons in the water heater, there's little danger of overflowing either waste tank while boondocking, if you dump the waste tanks every time you fill the fresh tank.

Letting the gray tank run free is not a great option even with a macerator pump that has a graywater bypass. Since the Interstate's 1" discharge hose is permanently attached, the only way the hose ever gets rinsed out is by pumping out the soapy gray water after the black water, or by using the heck out of the black tank flush fitting until the water comes out clear.

I've been using my Interstate for a year and a half, sometimes with full hookups, sometimes at campgrounds with dump stations. I'm pretty frugal about water usage, but when I have full hookups, I make a point of setting up a schedule for dumping the tanks. For me, once every four days is plenty often, since I've been known to stretch my water supply out to seven days by judicious use of sponge baths that are even more water-saving than a Navy shower (but then again, I am a solo camper).

Pumping out the tanks isn't terribly onerous. The macerator will pump out about 8 gallons per minute, so it only takes three minutes per tank to get them emptied. The black tank does take slightly longer if there are a lot of solids to chew up.

Easy way to figure out a schedule for how often to dump your tanks, go to a campground with full hookups. Then, fill the fresh tank, and don't connect the fresh water hose. Then use water from your fresh tank until you run out. That tells you how long it will take to use 26~32 gallons of water. That's also about how often you should dump the tanks to ensure your peace of mind.

Once you've used the fresh tank for one complete fill/empty cycle, hook up to the municipal water supply like normal people, and remember to dump the tanks whenever you've used 26~32 gallons of water.

One other point to remember, even though you can use the macerator pump without unreeling all of your hose, go ahead and unreel it all anyway. Pumping out while the hose is partially spooled up traps water in the hose that would otherwise drain out.

I've never had the hose bind tight enough to split it. The fuse for the take-up reel should have blown before things got that bad. I've blown fuses three times on my take-up reel, but two of those times were on my very first trip, before figuring out how to reel the hose in more slowly— one hand on the hose to guide it, one hand on the switch to stop the reel if the hose doesn't spool up properly on the reel. That gives me the opportunity to pull the hose back out partway and try again before it binds. The other time I blew a hose reel fuse, it was in a howling thunderstorm but I had to get back home so I could report to work the next day, and I got in a hurry and forgot my own technique. Lot of good that did, because I had to change the fuse and go back out into the storm to finish reeling in the hose.

Airstream could have put in a better hose reel with a built-in guide roller. They could have put a second set of tank level gauges outside by the macerator pump controls so you don't have to go back inside to make sure you've pumped the tanks dry. They could have put in a screw fitting so that you could unscrew the hose and remove or replace it more easily. They could have made the hose reel compartment bigger so the nozzle fits inside more easily. But they didn't. I don't mind, much. It's what I'm accustomed to, now.

And, at almost every campground I go to, I see people with slinkies who tell me they wish they had a macerator pump instead, because the discharge hose is so clean and easy to handle compared to a slinky.
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Old 06-21-2013, 03:59 PM   #7
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Has anyone successfully converted from the macerator system?
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Old 06-21-2013, 04:09 PM   #8
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Has anyone successfully converted from the macerator system?
Should be doable. If you look under the Interstate, you'll see that the hoses from the black and gray tanks to the macerator pump are the same size as a slinky hose. You'd have to figure out where to store the slinky; it wouldn't go on a hose reel, but if you remove the hose reel you might be able to fit some kind of storage box in its place.
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Old 06-21-2013, 04:27 PM   #9
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How does Pleasure Way do it? I recently parked next to an (almost) identical 2010 Pleasure Way. While the Airstream had many features he liked, we both agreed that his traditional drainage system was preferable.
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:36 PM   #10
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I don't see any real advantage to a macerator; my Flying Cloud didn't have it and I stored the slinky hose in a plastic tube underneath, and an extension inside the rear fender compartment. The salesman said I could use the macerator to empty my Interstate at home (really?), but he must have been told to say that at an Airstream seminar.
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Old 06-21-2013, 06:31 PM   #11
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I don't see any real advantage to a macerator; my Flying Cloud didn't have it and I stored the slinky hose in a plastic tube underneath, and an extension inside the rear fender compartment. The salesman said I could use the macerator to empty my Interstate at home (really?), but he must have been told to say that at an Airstream seminar.
You can use a slinky to empty your holding tanks at home, too, as long as you've got a sewer cleanout plug within reach that can be used as a dump station. That's all a dump station really is, a cleanout plug with an easy-open cover, and a hose nearby for rinsing purposes.

Really, I don't see where a slinky or a macerator is superior. Both have their good points, both have their bad points. It all comes down to personal preference. Early-model Interstates had slinkies; I don't recall exactly when they switched to macerators.

I'd be entirely happy with my macerator pump, if only it had a better hose reel.
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:27 PM   #12
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I can't imagine anyone wanting to be in the shower any longer than a Navy reg shower let alone five minutes or longer. It's just not that much fun when the shower curtain wants to become one w/ you.

I agree w/ Protagonist in that you have to guide the hose back on the reel to prevent binding. The dealer still hasn't figured out why my "Valve Open" lites on the switches don't illuminate.

I bought some 1" tubing and put a fitting on the end to screw in to the macerator hose and I stick the other end in the deep sink drain in the garage and pump away.
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:59 PM   #13
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My trailer colleagues convinced us to look at, and then we went with the Sewer Solution. It does use more water, but I keep the grey valve open since there is only a 1" smooth hose and the water hookup that is used for black tank disposal also cleans the hose. I was also told that macerators can jam up and need to be pulled off and have the impeller manually cleaned. The Sewer Solution only has a water jet and so far has been 100% dependable.
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Old 06-22-2013, 04:15 AM   #14
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I didn't pay a lot of attention to what was going on but: At an AS rally I was parked next door to an Interstate. We had pump out service one day. To do the pump out, he borrowed my stinky slinky, and hooked it directly to his system. The pump out truck put his wand in the open end of the slinky and it pumped out. I wish I'd payed more attention as to what was going on.
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:09 PM   #15
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When we got our new Interstate in 2005, the first thing I did (before ever using the holding tank) was to install a macerator pump. You can read about it here:

Airstream Interstate Macerator Installation

I carefully did it so that using the slinky was still an option, and I still carry it around, but it is still factory fresh--never been used. The macerator system is completely sealed (right up to the screw-on cap at the end of the 1" hose). Absolutely no mess or smell, ever. In almost 9 years, I have never had a failure or clog involving the dump system. To each his or her own, but honestly, I just can't imagine voluntarily doing a slinky dump.

To be even more controversial: The '05 has a single black/gray tank and I wouldn't have it any other way. I know that I am in an extreme minority here, but IMHO, separate gray water tanks make no sense whatsoever. They are just one of the great many things that the RV industry does for no better reason than "that is the way it's always been done". Here is why I hold this blasphemous position:

1) Having a single tank leads to a higher percentage of liquid in the blackwater tank, reducing clogging and clumping problems and keeping things generally cleaner, especially on a vehicle that is driven regularly.
2) By pooling the tank capacity, it increases flexibility (with two tanks, you must dump when either tank is full--you can't use the extra capacity in the other tank).
3) Dumps are greatly simplified.
4) A single, larger, tank saves weight and there is less to go wrong, with fewer valves and fittings.
5) The larger volume of liquid in the tank produces higher drain pressures, leading to more complete evacuation of solids.
6) If you want a continuous drain and don't want your blackwater tank continuously connected, one can easily arrange a direct graywater drain that doesn't go through the tank at all.
7) Although two tanks may have made sense back when it was considered OK to drain graywater along the roadside, those days are long gone.

I fully expect to get slammed for these shocking ideas. Go to it!

Cheers,
--Pete
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:30 PM   #16
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Quote:
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When we got our new Interstate in 2005, the first thing I did (before ever using the holding tank) was to install a macerator pump. You can read about it here:

Airstream Interstate Macerator Installation

I carefully did it so that using the slinky was still an option, and I still carry it around, but it is still factory fresh--never been used. The macerator system is completely sealed (right up to the screw-on cap at the end of the 1" hose). Absolutely no mess or smell, ever. In almost 9 years, I have never had a failure or clog involving the dump system. To each his or her own, but honestly, I just can't imagine voluntarily doing a slinky dump.

To be even more controversial: The '05 has a single black/gray tank and I wouldn't have it any other way. I know that I am in an extreme minority here, but IMHO, separate gray water tanks make no sense whatsoever. They are just one of the great many things that the RV industry does for no better reason than "that is the way it's always been done". Here is why I hold this blasphemous position:

1) Having a single tank leads to a higher percentage of liquid in the blackwater tank, reducing clogging and clumping problems and keeping things generally cleaner, especially on a vehicle that is driven regularly.
2) By pooling the tank capacity, it increases flexibility (with two tanks, you must dump when either tank is full--you can't use the extra capacity in the other tank).
3) Dumps are greatly simplified.
4) A single, larger, tank saves weight and there is less to go wrong, with fewer valves and fittings.
5) The larger volume of liquid in the tank produces higher drain pressures, leading to more complete evacuation of solids.
6) If you want a continuous drain and don't want your blackwater tank continuously connected, one can easily arrange a direct graywater drain that doesn't go through the tank at all.
7) Although two tanks may have made sense back when it was considered OK to drain graywater along the roadside, those days are long gone.

I fully expect to get slammed for these shocking ideas. Go to it!

Cheers,
--Pete
Makes sense to me, your install on the Macerator Pump looks great.
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Old 06-22-2013, 03:37 PM   #17
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How does Pleasure Way do it? I recently parked next to an (almost) identical 2010 Pleasure Way. While the Airstream had many features he liked, we both agreed that his traditional drainage system was preferable.
We just sold our 2011 Sprinter Pleasure Way and it used a traditional stinky slinky with seperate valves for grey and blackwater. It worked great. Only complaint was the lack of a hose connector on the outside to flush out the blackwater tank. My better half would have to press on the commode flush valve to rinse the tank.
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:32 PM   #18
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back when it was considered OK to drain graywater along the roadside, those days are long gone.
No slam here but I do have a question. Since we use our Interstate mostly around town and do a lot of hand washing (our little one is in diapers and we have a changing station set up on top of the stove which we never use), we fill the grey water tank about twice as often as we do the black. I always have a full grey tank when I am dumping the black, but I regularly dump my "extra" grey tank on my lawn. I know we live in an age of greenwashing, but what could anyone possibly find wrong with dumping soapy water on the ground?
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:44 PM   #19
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No slam here but I do have a question. Since we use our Interstate mostly around town and do a lot of hand washing (our little one is in diapers and we have a changing station set up on top of the stove which we never use), we fill the grey water tank about twice as often as we do the black. I always have a full grey tank when I am dumping the black, but I regularly dump my "extra" grey tank on my lawn. I know we live in an age of greenwashing, but what could anyone possibly find wrong with dumping soapy water on the ground?
Depends on the soap. Some soaps are not good for plants.
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Old 06-23-2013, 06:08 PM   #20
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It astonishes me to read here that there are people who would consider switching out a macerator system - like the kind you find in million dollar plus entertainer’s coaches or in high-end Class A motor homes or yachts – for the same cheap, low-end plastic sewer system found in SOB trailers that cost 1/10 th what their Airstream cost them.

On the other hand, we also have an original thinker like Pittsburgh Pete who takes an older Interstate without a macerator and installs one.

Pete, however, is trying to rationalize the fact that he has only one waste tank by making that something preferable when it’s not.

With two tanks you simply have more storage capacity and MORE flexibility.

Since the grey always fills before the black you can move some of the grey into the black on occasion. That also helps with discharging the solids. Or you can use the same technique to “back wash” the black tank with soapy water after pumping.

One of the great advantages of the macerator - aside from the push button simple, no fuss no muss sanitary operation - is FLEXIBILITY.

With a macerator you are no longer tied to dump stations. UKDUDE’s salesman was correct; you can use the clean out stack at home. Or at anybody’s building that will help you by allowing it. Same thing with a toilet.

Protagonist says that you can do this with a stinky slinky as well. I doubt he really would if he didn’t have his current, simple, clean method: 1/2 turn twist of the discharge wand on the end of the 1” hose into the clean out- push the button.

Contemplating doing this with a stinky slinky - running over your shoes, sidewalk or through your rose bushes - is much less likely.

You can discharge a little bit of grey water down a gopher hole or behind some rose bushes or lots of other places without harming anyone when you have a macerator.

Like Pete fears, these words may get some reaction from the sanctimonious or Politically Correct among us. (Nothing we say here will change those minds).

The question of the Grey Water Fairy arises here from time to time. Here’s one example:


http://www.airforums.com/forums/f163...ter-90337.html


Good, common sense contributions there by Rick Davis (see #21) and particularly by TG Twinkle (#6, #22). Of course, TG is from Nebraska, were you’d expect that kind of every-day-wisdom to come from.


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