first service

[gmillerok1]

There is no way I would wait that long. I don't care what MB recommends. It can't harm anything by changing it sooner. I would, at the very least change it every 10k; I myself try changing at 5-6k along with the filter. I change the fuel filter every 10k. The intervals are recommendations-and you can do it sooner if you want to spend the money and it makes you feel better about it. It does me. It can't hurt anything but your pocketbook.

So, I guess I am old school.

Originally Posted by Kwils25

Does anyone else think that 15K is too long of an interval for an oil change? I guess I'm just old school, but I've had my oil changed twice already and have just over 14K on my 2014 Ext.


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[73shark]

Originally Posted by Mjgman

My understanding is if you have used regular oil it is not a good idea to switch to synthetic... But I could be wrong about that...

Urban legend. If you have an engine w/ 100K on it and it's only had conventional oil used, then it wouldn't make sense to switch and it's rumored to possibly cause gunked up seals to leak but haven't seen any proof of this.

Originally Posted by gmillerok1

It can't hurt anything but your pocketbook.

So, I guess I am old school.

Right on both counts.

[avanti]

Originally Posted by Kwils25

Does anyone else think that 15K is too long of an interval for an oil change? I guess I'm just old school, but I've had my oil changed twice already and have just over 14K on my 2014 Ext.

I think that the engineers who designed the vehicle have a better right to an opinion than I do.

[Sebtown]

Our 2006 has the Assyst oil analysis system. The standard interval is 10k but the Assyst is supposed to constantly analyze the oil and then makes oil change recommendations accordingly. It can be more or less than 10k based on driving conditions. I am old school too when it comes to my gassers but I'm trying to trust the engineers when it comes to the diesel.

[73shark]

My MB service advisor told me that the extended interval applied to the 2014 Sprinters and might get longer for the 2015s. He also said that MB wouldn't tell them what changed to allow the increase.

[RoadJager]

Originally Posted by avanti

I think that the engineers who designed the vehicle have a better right to an opinion than I do.

You are correct about the engineers but they do not have the 'influence' they enjoyed in years past with their employers. The accountants and marketing executives are in control now at both Mercedes and BMW. The marketing group is trying to have the lowest cost per mile, the accountants are trying to produce a cheaper vehicle and meet stock holders expectations of profit. I pose the question, Why do these two vehicle manufacturers, who, in previous years prided themselves in producing vehicles that could go 250k-500k miles (with proper maintenance) and give mileage grill badges out when these milestones were met, do not offer them anymore. "Lifetime" fluid fills....come on get real! Long interval oil services...Not on my vehicles. Engines are being made out of lighter alloys and assembled with aluminum bolts. All components are candidates for lightening up for fuel economy reasons. For manufacturing cost savings, vehicles are unitizing sub-assemblies that have no repair components, throw the sub assembly away and replace it. The EPAs around the world do not want older technology-vehicles on the road. Ideally they want no older than 5-7year vehicles on the road. They want clean a clean environment. Me too but I keep vehicles forever.
Synthetic oils were primarily developed for the closer tolerances that new engines have. Sure there are other reasons that have validity. Keep in mind, synthetics are not exempt from sludging issues. What I have seen in my shop over 32years, is a exponential increase in problems/failures related to slugging. This, I believe is caused by long intervals between oil services and the increase of engine components that require clean oil to function correctly (i.e., vanos units that control cam advancement, pollution control devices, etc.) The alloys utilized in new engines have lightened them but have also decreased their tolerance for issues like overheating, oil quality issues and in general, lack of maintenance.
As a Bosch service center, our training from Bosch, the manufacturer of the injection system have instructed us to change fuel filters ahead of the vehicle manufacturers recommendation for vehicles with direct injection(including gas). This is because of the high pressures of injection through the small orifices/pintel of the injectors. The smallest contaminate in the fuel will scar the injector. When looked at under a microscope, this scarring looks like the grand canyon. This affects the spray pattern and ability to seal properly. Fuel filters are inexpensive as compared to repairs required because of fuel quality issues.
Contrary to some vehicle owners opinions, a quality service center is not out to overcharge or suggest unethical repairs. We are committed to the proper repair for the longevity and safety of our clients and their vehicles.
Road Jager

[russ240]

Agree 100%. 10k and 15k mile oil changes are driven by the marketing machine. The engineers just cringe. Anyone like RoadJager that works in the business has seen the coked up, crudded up engines that result from the ridiculously infrequent oil changes that are so popular with the manufacturers marketing departments these days. If you only intend to keep a vehicle while it's under factory warrantee, infrequent maintenance works great. If you want to keep it for the long haul, ignore those BS recommendations and maintain your vehicle. 7500 miles or 1 year, whichever comes first is what I'd recommend on oil changes. I actually do something more like 5k/6 months on my vehicles, but I readily admit that its overkill. I also add ZDDP (zinc) to oil in my older vehicles and recommend that for any vehicle that does not have a roller cam. My two cents.

[UKDUDE]

Since some of us have strong opinions about the pros and cons of long and short oil change intervals, thought I'd post this email I just received from my local dealer:

"At the beginning of 2013 Mercedes- Benz set all of the Sprinter Van’s Service intervals to 15,000 miles and then found that was much longer than they needed to be and asked that they be set back to 10,000 miles. Due to them changing it back to we reprogrammed your computer to read the 10,000 mile interval which is why you only have 9900 miles until the next service is completed."

[avanti]

Originally Posted by UKDUDE

Since some of us have strong opinions about the pros and cons of long and short oil change intervals, thought I'd post this email I just received from my local dealer:

"At the beginning of 2013 Mercedes- Benz set all of the Sprinter Van’s Service intervals to 15,000 miles and then found that was much longer than they needed to be and asked that they be set back to 10,000 miles. Due to them changing it back to we reprogrammed your computer to read the 10,000 mile interval which is why you only have 9900 miles until the next service is completed."

I would be EXTREMELY interested in seeing a single shred of evidence (beyond self-serving hearsay from a dealer) that the above claim is true.

Here is the MY2014 Service manual that you can download directly from the MB website:

http://www.mbsprinterusa.com/files/m...nce_Manual.pdf

which specifies 15,000 miles.

Here is the prepaid maintenance brochure:

http://www.mbsprinterusa.com/files/b...M_Brochure.pdf

which specifies 15,000 miles.

There have been press reports that for 2015, the intervals have been raised to 20,000:

Daimler sharpens focus on U.S. van market | Equipment content from Fleet Owner

I have seen this claim made before, but despite extensive effort, I have never been able to locate any credible written source for the 10,000 mile reduction claim. I don't suppose your dealer will share the MB Service Bulletin in which this rather dramatic change has been announced.

I, for one, do NOT have strong opinions on service interval. What I DO have strong opinions on is basing my actions on actual, reality-based evidence, rather than what my father told me about cars in the 1950s or what I read third-hand on the Internet.

The claimed change would be seen as a VERY BIG deal, bordering on bait-and-switch, especially by fleet owners, for whom this matters very much. I kind of suspect that if it were true, it wouldn't be received with the resounding silence that appears to be the case.

Unnecessarily-frequent oil changes are bad for the environment and they are a waste of time and money. The manufacturers put a lot of time and effort into establishing them, and their data are better than your dealer's.

I am very prepared to be convinced on this, and if I were convinced, I would change my behavior immediately. But an email from your dealer isn't going to do it.

[UKDUDE]

Originally Posted by avanti

I would be EXTREMELY interested in seeing a single shred of evidence (beyond self-serving hearsay from a dealer) that the above claim is true.

Here is the MY2014 Service manual that you can download directly from the MB website:

http://www.mbsprinterusa.com/files/m...nce_Manual.pdf

which specifies 15,000 miles.

Here is the prepaid maintenance brochure:

http://www.mbsprinterusa.com/files/b...M_Brochure.pdf

which specifies 15,000 miles.

There have been press reports that for 2015, the intervals have been raised to 20,000:

Daimler sharpens focus on U.S. van market | Equipment content from Fleet Owner

I have seen this claim made before, but despite extensive effort, I have never been able to locate any credible written source for the 10,000 mile reduction claim. I don't suppose your dealer will share the MB Service Bulletin in which this rather dramatic change has been announced.

I, for one, do NOT have strong opinions on service interval. What I DO have strong opinions on is basing my actions on actual, reality-based evidence, rather than what my father told me about cars in the 1950s or what I read third-hand on the Internet.

The claimed change would be seen as a VERY BIG deal, bordering on bait-and-switch, especially by fleet owners, for whom this matters very much. I kind of suspect that if it were true, it wouldn't be received with the resounding silence that appears to be the case.

Unnecessarily-frequent oil changes are bad for the environment and they are a waste of time and money. The manufacturers put a lot of time and effort into establishing them, and their data are better than your dealer's.

I am very prepared to be convinced on this, and if I were convinced, I would change my behavior immediately. But an email from your dealer isn't going to do it.

Actually Avanti, I'm as skeptical as you, but since I usually cover less than 10,000 miles per year, I haven't thought to pursue it, only to report on what I'd been told.
I did download both the 2013 and 2014 Service manuals and can see clearly that for 2013 models, service intervals are 10K, and for 2014 they are 15K.
I will try to get more info from the dealer.

[UKDUDE]

Originally Posted by UKDUDE

Actually Avanti, I'm as skeptical as you, but since I usually cover less than 10,000 miles per year, I haven't thought to pursue it, only to report on what I'd been told.
I did download both the 2013 and 2014 Service manuals and can see clearly that for 2013 models, service intervals are 10K, and for 2014 they are 15K.
I will try to get more info from the dealer.

Got an email response from the dealer today:

"First I will talk about the update that was performed on your I/C back on 3/21/2014. As an authorized dealer we have to perform any service or recall campaigns that affect any vehicles from Daimler that populate on the VMI(vehicle master inquiry).Your particular VIN was tagged in the VMI to have a Service Campaign performed, (along with an SW update to the engine control module). Daimler had determined that the service interval had been incorrectly set on 4,056 vehicles. The service interval had been reset to the correct interval of 10K as stipulated in owner’s manual and or work shop information system, neither we or any dealer can manually change the service intervals, they cannot be edited. I have attached the service sheets for a 2013 and 2014 Sprinter. Yes in 2014 the service intervals were increased on Sprinters in the US, as far as we can tell here at the dealership level this was done after a careful long term maintenance study was performed by Daimler (some contributing factors were service costs). For 2015 all models are sharing a new maintenance process, it is still under development at present time, mainly it will be based on what your vehicle displays in the instrument cluster, either ‘A’ or ‘B’..
As for mileage intervals, that information has not been published at this time. However let me explain how the service assist system operates, and this started back in 1998. At that time Mercedes went to an ‘A’ or ‘B’ service, which it still uses today. The service intervals were determined early on by use of an oil quality senor in the oil pan, that sensor has since been discontinued, too many issues. The maintenance interval system has now morphed into a complex algorithm based on engine data and time. Basically its really either 1yr or 10K whichever comes first. Truly I wish it would be just simply 10K or 15K, it would be less confusing to all.
Just an FYI, our dealership sells the used oil to an environmental company (Thermo-Fluids), we are required to, the used oil is then used in home furnaces, power stations to name a few. The pre-paid maintenances you mentioned are relatively new, they are solely based on what is stipulated in the Service Maintenance booklet, nothing differs from what we do normally here at the dealer if not pre-paid."

So the dealer set the interval to 15K earlier this year, and then had to put it back to 10K.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by UKDUDE

The service interval had been reset to the correct interval of 10K as stipulated in owner’s manual and or work shop information system, neither we or any dealer can manually change the service intervals, they cannot be edited.

Service intervals cannot be edited, yet they reset the service interval from 15k to 10k. Those two statements do not go together; clearly they CAN manually reset service intervals, else you'd be stuck with 15k forever.

[UKDUDE]

Originally Posted by Protagonist

Service intervals cannot be edited, yet they reset the service interval from 15k to 10k. Those two statements do not go together; clearly they CAN manually reset service intervals, else you'd be stuck with 15k forever.

They cannot edit the service intervals, but they can change the software with the hard-coded intervals.

[avanti]

OK, I was assuming that your Sprinter was Model Year 2014. I see now that I got the "2014" from the AI model year, which may or may not be the same as the Sprinter year. The dealer's admirably detailed story is plausible if and only if your Sprinter is model year 2013. Otherwise it is self-contradictory. Can you confirm your model year? If it is 2013, then I cede the argument to your dealer, who seems to have a consistent story. I also tip my hat to his or her willingness to actually answer a nuanced question.

Actually, if the story is true, it probably explains the rumors that have been around to the effect that the intervals have been scaled back from 15K to 10K. People say (apparently incorrectly) that this happened in 2014. Looks like this may be the kernel of truth in the story.

In any event, thanks for reporting what you have found.

[UKDUDE]

Originally Posted by avanti

OK, I was assuming that your Sprinter was Model Year 2014. I see now that I got the "2014" from the AI model year, which may or may not be the same as the Sprinter year. The dealer's admirably detailed story is plausible if and only if your Sprinter is model year 2013. Otherwise it is self-contradictory. Can you confirm your model year? If it is 2013, then I cede the argument to your dealer, who seems to have a consistent story. I also tip my hat to his or her willingness to actually answer a nuanced question.

Actually, if the story is true, it probably explains the rumors that have been around to the effect that the intervals have been scaled back from 15K to 10K. People say (apparently incorrectly) that this happened in 2014. Looks like this may be the kernel of truth in the story.

In any event, thanks for reporting what you have found.

Yes, the Sprinter is a 2013.
The dealer is a high-ranking MB dealer in Scottsdale, AZ, so they have their good reputation to protect, hence the wordy response. High servicing prices too!

[Jeff64]

Someone mentioned tire rotation in this thread. I know I've posted on this subject before but want to make sure all are aware. I want to remind all of you of the nightmare awaiting you when you have this done based on my own very expensive experience. The front wheels are centered on six steel fingers. The vans were designed by Mercedes to have steel wheels, therefor the fingers are not long enough to catch all the width of the wheel and considering that aluminum is a much softer meatal than steel they are very easily damaged during the reinstall. I've had two sets ruined, the first I assumed the guy was just careless and threw the wheel on and started hammering with an impact (which he did) the second shop did the same damage by installing the wheels with the center cap on (he couldn't see if the wheel was properly placed evenly over the fingers) and only using a manual torque wrench. It is extremely important that the wheel be placed over the fingers evenly then the lugs tightened by hand then torqued, I would even be very careful about dropping the weight of the van on the wheel until the lug nuts are reasonably tight, if not the steel fingers will cut thee notches on one half of the inner circle of the wheel and your steering wheel will definitely shake.
There is no repair for this, the only option is to replace the damaged wheels. My policy from now on is I dismount and remount the wheels and will take to the tire store. The carelessness in tire shops is mind boggling!!

[David M]

Originally Posted by Jeff64

Someone mentioned tire rotation in this thread. I know I've posted on this subject before but want to make sure all are aware. I want to remind all of you of the nightmare awaiting you when you have this done based on my own very expensive experience. The front wheels are centered on six steel fingers.

Thanks for the reminder. I remember reading your prior post, but totally forgot about it. I copied and pasted your post in my notes this time as a reminder.
David

[73shark]

I believe these wheel/hub mountings are referred to as hub-centric where the wheel is centered by the hub as opposed to lug-centric where the lug/nut center the wheel.

Here's more info.

[PSchw]

32k miles and needed new front tires. I got lucky even so the tech working on my wheels was neither skilled or motivated. I could watch through the window at Discount tire.
Just finished the 30k service and they send me out with unsafe tires. My sprinter service seems not too good either


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[xrvr]

When I owned my AI , I replaced the steel wheels with the alloy ones ordered through Dodge at that time. They replaced the lugs with the correct sized ones. Actually gave me one set for the spare in case if it were ever used. So if you replace your steel wheels be sure you can still use the spare, keep one set of lugs. Jim