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Old 07-24-2016, 10:42 AM   #1
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2014 25' International
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Off the Grid Dog and Children Control...

SteveSueMac discussed the limitations of Peace and Quiet at a structured campsite. You cram twenty to a hundred 'apartments on wheels' into a small area, people begin to guard their 400 square feet of gravel and weeds, starting at $30 to $75 an evening.

Off the Grid and Base Camping in the National Forests and National Grasslands begin to blur these... 'this is my land, this is your land'... attitudes.

Among a group there is a process of socializing dogs and humans.

First the humans sniff each other and make quick judgments of one another. Handshakes can be soft, knuckle busters or just firm, but the sniffing part is most important. It may not get down to the canine variety of sniffing, but is not much different... just more civilized in the process.

Second, the humans having fulfilled their sniffing one another bring out their 'wonderful fido the dog(s)' on a LEASH to sniff yours and other pets ID's. Males begin marking their 400 square feet and expanding to acres as time goes on. (Just stay away from my aluminum wheels and tires, or I get grumpy.) This is the Dog Socializing step to 'leash freedom' in an isolated colony of Campers and Pets. It is easier if the group are together and not intermingled among those who want peace and quiet... until a group arrives, unexpectedly.

Third. Some 'wonderful to people, children, cats and other dogs' canines may display more than posturing to see who is the Alpha and the rest just ignore and go on with their sniffing one another. Some times it is quick, sometimes there are aggressive 'wonderful fido' who want to chew their way to the top of the pack. (We have encountered several on some previous Adventures... the eating their way to the people and canine pack.)

Fourth. Once the dogs have been socialized, they can slowly be released and do whatever dogs want to do in the forest or open prairies. Some may need to be on a short leash for the entire trip or mellowed out. I use my boot to mellow out any coming after myself, and my walking stick to remove a dog from my leg. (In a loving and caring way, of course.)

Many people do not understand how dogs communicate. When a small barker gets turned over by another dog, onto its back and pees into the air... the discussion is over and these two are the best of friends.

People... they just pee over and over till they dehydrate onto one another. That is the typical RV Park crowd. I am talking about those in a group camped in isolation away from the RV Park peeing people and pets.

Yes... typical going on and on, but one sentence will not cut it.

There is a zone around a campsite where once crossed... a dog or human can do their business without care or worry. This is the Forest. You have to watch your step climbing a mountain and might have to avoid Bear Scat, as well.

Off the Grid and Base Camping has a different set of rules about leashes. Although your aggressive, bad mannered dog is still your responsibility. If you do not give the 'boot or stick or zap or whatever' to fido... someone will and you begin to piss and moan about animal abuse. No... your dog is a problem.

A long sturdy cable is appropriate to restrain an aggressive dog. Same for children, but shorter.

Children... turn them loose. They need the exercise and fresh air. "Are we there, yet?" is fulfilled. Let them enjoy being free and wild. Give them a chainsaw to play with.... the plastic battery operated one, of course. Have them gather firewood and rocks to take home. I would rather have two kids for each dog... any day.

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Old 07-24-2016, 11:02 AM   #2
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Off the Grid Dog and Children Control...

We prefer to camp where "elbow room" abounds and there are not too many campers in close proximity for the reasons cited. We don't have dogs, our daughter is a well mannered good sport, and we camp following the Golden Rule. If others do manage to intrude (say loud music all day and night), we try to take it in stride.

Now, if I could just keep work under control (i.e. leave me alone) when off-the-grid....

Regards - Ron

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Old 07-24-2016, 11:16 AM   #3
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Ray you really need to get out more. With the new truck you can haul more rocks. I really didn't think you smelled too bad, and I don't recall peeing on any of your tires.

Great minds think alike. Have a great day. Dave
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Old 07-24-2016, 01:12 PM   #4
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If you lose your sense of humor... you have already died

The last three years have been really tough for getting out and about. Almost as if everything has fallen into the 'to do file' during the camping season. Next year should be clear sailing... in an Airstream, that is.

Next week, maybe twenty tons of Castle Rock rhyolite to add to our storage building driveway. I hope Nancy is up to it...

Anyone who camps Off the Grid understands that you pee as high as possible on the trees around your trailer. Wild animals judge the size of the other animal by how high. Where I camp... use the wind as your friend...

The Bear claws up the bark for the same effect. Also Bear Scat in the middle of a hiking trail tells you to... well watch your step, and have Bear Spray handy.

Wild horses... have you ever seen what a Stallion does in the middle of a road? Will tear off your trailer's plumbing if you are not careful. Try the Red Desert of Wyoming for practice. Nevada... fewer roads to worry about.

Deer, Elk... Moose go tearing away at all the green growth on saplings. A buck sees this aggressive buck reflected on the side of your Airstream... and people are worried about a 3 pound lap dog doing... damage.

Should I go on? Myself. Do not park too close to my trailer. I was potty trained by a pack of Wolves in Northwestern Montana.
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Old 07-24-2016, 01:36 PM   #5
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In the great wide open children should be tethered at the minimum of six feet from the trailer, they are a nuisance. Dogs,however should be allowed to run free. On edit, my wife told me I had to say I didn't mean that. Ok I said it.
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Old 07-24-2016, 01:41 PM   #6
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[QUOTE=Utah Man;1825571. Now, if I could just keep work under control (i.e. leave me alone) when off-the-grid....

Regards - Ron[/QUOTE]

Well said Ron! If anyone figures out how to keep work from calling or emailing you while on vacation let me know! This could be a thread all by itself.

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Old 07-24-2016, 03:25 PM   #7
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Our technique is to ignore the phone and computer totally

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Old 07-25-2016, 10:32 AM   #8
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Our boondocking experiences so far have just been just myself, wife and dog, so no socializing with other tribes has been necessary. But the ritual you describe in your first post seems reasonable. Of course, different tribes may have different customs. I've read about the explorers of the early 1800's in the western US. Some of the tribes they encountered were just downright hostile, while others were "friendly" to one degree or another, and the challenge was to learn how to stay on their friendly side. Some of the tribes were friendly as long as you ate whatever they gave you in the first meeting, but it was considered inexcusably rude to turn anything down. You might not live long after doing that.

My semi-boondocking experiences have mainly been archery tournaments, camping in some pasture without any hookups. My tribe has been myself, Lupe, and whatever of my archery buddies wanted to tag along. Of course there have been varying numbers of other tribes camped in the same pasture, which involves socialization of the other tribes' dogs with ours. We have generally left this to the dogs themselves to figure out, which has gone remarkably well so far. People generally know if their own dogs need to be tied up, and the free roaming dogs generally give them a wide berth. Some minor disputes like who gets to put who's head on his dad's lap are generally settled with a low growl and raising of one side of the lip to show the canine tooth, and haven't progressed beyond that.

The food ritual seems similar to that described by the early explorers, with less deadly consequences for refusing. I have gotten into dutch oven cooking as a result of attending these tournaments, and find that people aren't bashful about wondering what is in my pot, and more than willing to share what is in theirs.

Here is a picture of our motley tribe at a recent tournament:

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