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Old 08-24-2004, 03:09 AM   #1
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Angry Fourteen...

Hi ALL....
It is NOT My intention 2 upset anyone at all....My Wife told Me last nite abt wot She had read on The DIBB site...abt FOURTEEN of the RESCUE DOGS from the 911 Outrage, have sadly DIED....in a mttr of months, Now it appears 2B some kind of CANCER, due 2 the DUST, Aviation fuel, & LOTS 'n LOTS of other polutents in the air at the time of the search...
An investigation IS under way, but I jus wonder IF any HUMANS R 2 suffer in the future ! ! ! ..... due 2 this awful act of Terror...
I R sorry if I set alarm bells ringing, But I believe in...IF it's out there...WE have a RIGHT 2 KN...Chris.....
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Old 08-24-2004, 04:33 AM   #2
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What snuffed out 14, 9/11 sniffer dogs?
New York August 23, 2004 1:20:26 PM IST

A new study by researchers at the University of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine, has found that an alarming number of WTC search and rescue dogs have died in the past few months, a finding that they believe could have important implications for the people who were included in the rescue operations at ground zero.

According to the New York Daily News, researchers doing further research in order to ascertain if the dogs died because they were exposed to toxic rubble. They have found that as many as 14 dogs have died in the recent past, eight out of whom died of cancer.

The researchers found that there were significantly higher numbers of antibodies in the search dogs in the first year after the terrorist attack. The elevated presence of antibodies showed the dogs had been exposed to foreign substances that pressed their immune systems into higher gear. Although the researchers agree that most of the dogs died due to natural causes, they are keeping an eye on the long-term effects. "I don't think these dogs are completely out of the woods. That is why we need to monitor these dogs until the end of their lives, for the dogs' sake and for people's sake. If there is a problem in the dogs down the line, there is a good chance a similar problem could be found in people," the report quoted Dr Cynthia Otto, the lead researcher as saying.

and



Rescue dogs' death not related to 9/11 toxic rubble: research 2004-08-23 16:33:38


NEW YORK, Aug. 22 -- Fourteen search and rescue dogs have died since their exposure to toxic rubble from the Sept. 11 terrorist attack, including eight from cancer, according to a study released Sunday.

Researchers from the University of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine, who conducted the study, said there seemed no connection between the deaths and the chemicals they were exposed to.

"We can't find any link at this point that ties the 14 deaths to events of Sept. 11," said Dr. Cynthia Otto, the study's lead researcher. "Some have passed away, but the causes of death are nodifferent than in the control group. That is good news."

Otto's team, which has been monitoring the health of 97 dogs who worked at Ground Zero, the Pentagon and the Fresh Kills landfill on Staten Island, New York, did find "significantly higher" antibodies in the search dogs in the first year after the terrorist attack.

The elevated presence of antibodies, she explained, showed the dogs had been exposed to foreign substances that pressed their immune systems into higher gear.

Although Otto was heartened to find the vast majority of dogs were in good health, given the exposure and the blood changes in the first year, questions remain about possible long-term effects.

"I don't think these dogs are completely out of the woods," shesaid. "That is why we need to monitor these dogs until the end of their lives - for the dogs' sake and for people's sake. If there is a problem in the dogs down the line, there is a good chance a similar problem could be found in people." Earlier, Sierra Club, an environmental group, criticized the Bush administration for failing to warn people of the health risks of breathing toxic smoke and dust at ground zero. The group said the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) failed at least a dozen times to change its safety assurances about the air quality at ground zero, even after it became clear that people were becoming sick, and in some cases, did not even check for toxic hazards.




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Old 08-24-2004, 07:07 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyW
.......The researchers found that there were significantly higher numbers of antibodies in the search dogs.......
OK, You've pushed my button here.........just a second, let me hoist myself up on my soapbox......

People.....it's not just the rubble......IT'S THE FOOD!!!!!

Read my lips.....Dry Dog Food Is Crap -- literally.

Does it have grains - yes....lips, feet, beaks, and feathers - yes, yes, yes, and probably -- and most importantly -- it contains huge doses of potent toxins used as preservatives to prevent the mixture of "parts" from going rancid....

Take a lead from the top breeders and trainers of show and performance dogs.....feed a natural diet.

Show and performance dogs fed the commercial dry diets (popularized in the 50's, 60's, and 70's) have exhibited a difficult time breeding true to lines - or even breeding at all! Entire lines are dying out and I, for one, think that a huge contributor to the problem is "manufactured" diets. Multiple breeds have exhibited abnormal difficulties with pregnancy, whelping, and birth defects. Also, problems with coat, teeth, bad breath, weight and odor (I have 5 dogs in a relatively small back yard, and I defy anyone to detect a "doggy smell" in the house or kennel) are all but eliminated. I have seen first hand the changes that have occurred in dogs fed "institutional crap" their entire lives - luster comes back to their coats, brightness to their eyes, and a spring to their steps....in just weeks on a diet without "preservatives". In the first half of the last century, before "off the grocery store shelf" dry foods became popular, there was hardly any mention of the above mentioned difficulties in the books I have read.

Let's face it, the "dog food" manufacturers want to maximize profit (that's the American Way), so they put "just" enough nutrient into the mixture to allow the dog to appear to thrive - and don't worry about the toxin load.

I feed the pups human quality food, keeping in mind the differences of the digestive tracts of canines as compared to humans......remember that dogs are only tens of thousands of years (in most cases, much, much less) removed from the wild, and their systems thrive on what we would consider "repulsive" food......

Give a dog a bone (BTW, that is a title of one of the many good natural food books)....what does it do with it? - Sometimes bury it? - You bet - and then dig it up to enjoy it after it has "aged".....it won't hurt them, their stomach "juices" are several times more acidic than humans, and they deal with "overly aged" meat just fine.

So...consider a "natural diet", it's really not any more expensive than a "Premium" dry "in a bag" food........your dog (and your vet) will love you for it.

There - I came out of the closet.......I Feed My Dogs a Natural Diet....and I'm Proud of It!!!!!

Checklist....soapbox put away, flame retardant shield is switched to the "on" position.
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:49 AM   #4
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just curious define a natural diet
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Old 08-24-2004, 09:57 AM   #5
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Natural Diet

Quote:
Originally Posted by FireFighter
just curious define a natural diet

As close as possible to what the most recent "diet" in the wild would be.

In the case of Canines, descended from wolves a relatively few generations ago it would mean foraging, (grains, grasses, berries, etc.), whole fowl and small mammals ("wild" canines will de-feather a large bird), and large mammals.

In the case of large mammals, the stomach and internal organs are normally the "prize pieces", and are usually the first to be consumed.

Check out the eating habits of Coyotes and Wolves as documented by reintroduction studies. Some available diets are mostly frozen “whole cow” mixtures of everything that is on and in the cow as it walks into the slaughter house. The stomach contents serve as a suitable source of vegetable material.


Certainly, natural includes bones, guts, feathers and hide, but we must have propriety, although many do feed exactly what is described above. Mostly, I try to avoid any chemical additive or preservative.

There are many "natural diets" proposed by various people, I am pretty much "middle of the line". A bit of Cottage Cheese in the mornings, one large feeding at twilight consisting of about a third each of hydrated oats with Seaweed Kelp (some people use rice), hamburger, and fresh vegetables (carrots, broccoli, peas, green beans, cauliflower, etc.). Every once in a while I’ll mix in a raw egg or two, and sometimes some Flax Seed Oil or Fish Oil. Their Stomach System has a hard time digesting legumes and corn. The little guys go nuts for lettuce as a treat. I also give them pieces of raw chicken from time to time – remember, any bone is OK, as long is it is NOT COOKED. Heat (cooking) processes make the bone shards brittle, and then the bone could be dangerous to the innards of the pups.

By buying “day old” hamburger in bulk and freezing it in “daily use” portions, catching 10 lb. packs of “stewing chickens” on sale, and purchasing frozen vegetables in large packages (institutional size) and on sale my feeding costs are about the same as a premium grade dry food – the pups are healthier overall, immune systems are not compromised, coats have more luster, and NO ODORS with either the stool or urine. The lack of odor is evident on the dogs themselves – we hardly ever have to bathe them – brushing and clipping are usually all of the body grooming they require.

Time wise it takes about 10 or 15 minutes to prepare, but hey, if you don’t have that kind of time for your dog, you ought not have a dog.
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:33 AM   #6
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Dennis, your dogs eat better than I do, but then again they probably look better than I do as well.
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:36 AM   #7
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Quote:
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Dennis, your dogs eat better than I do, but then again they probably look better than I do as well.
Tin:

IF there truly is such a thing as "reincarnation", then I want to come back as one of MY dogs.

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Old 08-24-2004, 10:51 AM   #8
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I would like to point out that most of the dogs were near 5 years old at the event is my understanding. Big dog breeds life expectancy is around 10. So these dogs are nearing a elderly status. These dogs have been used in may of these type rescues like mexico city. This could also be from Radon in their sleeping quarters or even at the site.

This is another media instigated blown out of proportion deal before all the tests are in as to WHERE this came from.
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Old 08-24-2004, 11:49 AM   #9
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I have studied 'natural' diets on the net and talked to a number of vets about them, and I don't think they are all they are promoted to be. People promote them reporting stories of their dogs being in superior health, claiming every dog would be completely healthy if they just ate the right foods. My grandma has a whole shelf of books claiming the same things for people. It isn't that simple. All creatures still can become ill through diseases, infections, and weaknesses of their own body as they age, and eventually we all die, no matter what we eat - that's life.

Many vets feel the dangers of feeding dogs raw bones and raw meat far outweigh the possible benefits. So do the research yourself and make your own well informed decision.

My grandma's cock-a-poos both lived to be 20 years old on Alpo! Now that's a pretty long healthy life for a dog, though personally I would never feed my dogs Alpo, but it certainly would make a good case for referring to Alpo as a miracle food.

As for the 9/11 dogs, it's interesting that those two news articles cover the same report with two completely different conclusions. That's the media for you.
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:18 PM   #10
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I like Alpo. Good substitute for Spam.
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:33 PM   #11
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You can use the old "common sense" approach to evaluating "dog food".

For instance, we often see places advertising #40 of dog food for $9.99 (and people are hauling it out in truckloads). What quality can you expect for $.25 per pound? Throw in shipping, packaging, advertising, and inventory costs and you know what? You are buying garbage. It is cheaper to convert garbage into this dog food than to haul it off. Use your heads folks! Read the labels and use your heads.

What can you really expect to get for $1 or $2/pound? Have they figured out some miracle transformation? The food is, for the most part, junk. 87MH is absolutely correct!

We feed organic raw buffalo, turkey, chicken, and lamb (notice - no beef). We supplement with greens, grains, cottage cheese, and eggs. Is it worth it? Ask our 12 year old German Shepherd who looks and acts like a 4 year old...
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Old 08-25-2004, 11:19 AM   #12
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Thanks, x-ray, for info that comes just in time. My old dog smells so BADLY that I was thinking to put him asleep as he gave me such breathing problems. I'll try this diet. So none of the superior canned/dryed dog food works? Like Iams? or such?
Just got back from a summer in Mexico-great air- but my son who came down to bring me back was bitten from a feral dog and is now undergoing the rabies shots. A lot nicer than the old 21 day shots in the stomach I had when I was a kid.! Silver suz
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Old 08-25-2004, 11:28 AM   #13
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Came here to learn things about fixing my AS, and now I know how to feed my dog........... Gotta love this forum.
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Old 08-25-2004, 11:51 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silver suz
Thanks, x-ray, for info that comes just in time. My old dog smells so BADLY that I was thinking to put him asleep as he gave me such breathing problems. I'll try this diet. So none of the superior canned/dryed dog food works? Like Iams? or such?
Just got back from a summer in Mexico-great air- but my son who came down to bring me back was bitten from a feral dog and is now undergoing the rabies shots. A lot nicer than the old 21 day shots in the stomach I had when I was a kid.! Silver suz
You know, Suz, many are implicating vaccines to causing allergies and autoimmune disorders in both dogs and people... Another reason to avoid those that aren't necessary. When did your MCS start? After your rabies shots, by any chance? Just a thought...

Can't think of a really good canned food. California Natural products are generally the best, IMHO, so you might try those including their dry kibble so long as you supplement with fresh meats, etc.

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