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Old 06-22-2017, 11:39 PM   #155
jcl
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Originally Posted by dkottum View Post
The 1987 Suburban 3/4 tons used to tow 1987 Avion 34s had less torque and at least half the transmission gears of a modern 1/2 ton. Yet we loved them for towing our big travel trailers. I wonder what the 1987 Suburban 3/4 ton "payload" number was, and receiver hitch rating. What type of brakes did it have front and rear.
GM Heritage has the dealer info on the 1987 Suburban.

454 had 230 hp, but the standard 350 had 195 hp in the 3/4 ton model.

3 speed auto in the 3/4 ton, or a manual transmission.

Brakes were disc/drum. Note that the front discs were smaller diameter than the oft-derided Toyota minivan (which of course has four discs).

Lots of payload on the 3/4 ton. 3800 lb front axle, 6000 lb rear axle. Actual payloads varied because everything was an option. Like headliners, and AM radios, and two optional fuel tank sizes.

Never owned one myself, but I recall working on them.

https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...t-Suburban.pdf
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Old 06-23-2017, 08:10 AM   #156
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I guess my sarcasm didn't come across very well! Did sell the truck, though. For many reasons I am done towing, but really enjoyed it. Wish everyone luck no matter what your choices are.
Avionstream...are you "hanging up your hitch" for good then? Are you looking at a MH or what? Too much country not to have something... I think we would be nowhere, if we had nothing to go somewhere, and then found out we really wanted to camp along the way... LoL Hope you everything works out for you.
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Old 06-23-2017, 10:45 AM   #157
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GM Heritage has the dealer info on the 1987 Suburban.

454 had 230 hp, but the standard 350 had 195 hp in the 3/4 ton model.

3 speed auto in the 3/4 ton, or a manual transmission.

Brakes were disc/drum. Note that the front discs were smaller diameter than the oft-derided Toyota minivan (which of course has four discs).

Lots of payload on the 3/4 ton. 3800 lb front axle, 6000 lb rear axle. Actual payloads varied because everything was an option. Like headliners, and AM radios, and two optional fuel tank sizes.

Never owned one myself, but I recall working on them.

https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...t-Suburban.pdf
Hi

The Suburban of the 1970's and early 80's was a *very* different vehicle than the one we can buy today. I could actually sit up in the standard front seat of a 1970's Suburban. Not so much by the end of the 80's.

Bob
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Old 06-23-2017, 11:14 AM   #158
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Avionstream...are you "hanging up your hitch" for good then? Are you looking at a MH or what? Too much country not to have something... I think we would be nowhere, if we had nothing to go somewhere, and then found out we really wanted to camp along the way... LoL Hope you everything works out for you.
Yea, we are done. Sad. Avion will be listed as soon as it is cleaned up from our last few weeks on the road. Quite frankly, we need the money as we are living on SS. I'll still be here, can't let this stuff go. Love the forums.
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Old 06-23-2017, 03:52 PM   #159
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Yea, we are done. Sad. Avion will be listed as soon as it is cleaned up from our last few weeks on the road. Quite frankly, we need the money as we are living on SS. I'll still be here, can't let this stuff go. Love the forums.
Best of luck to you AvionStream. Glads to know that you'd be around.
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Old 06-28-2017, 12:18 PM   #160
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Yea, we are done. Sad. Avion will be listed as soon as it is cleaned up from our last few weeks on the road. Quite frankly, we need the money as we are living on SS. I'll still be here, can't let this stuff go. Love the forums.
I spent 40-hours cleaning a clean trailer when I sold the last one. And took a couple hundred photographs as practice. Used lights covered by wax paper, etc. wanted to do justice to the TT. (Link in sig). As I was off beaten path I sent out about fifty CDs with as many photos and several thousand words of text.

Waited awhile, but then had competing buyers making 500 mile roundtrips, cash in hand. Got asking price.

I recommend using sales brochures as guides. Decoration and angles.

1969 Streamline is best, IMO. See at Tom Patterson site.

What I didn't have then and also recommend is an ozone generator. Takes care of "old age" smell. Overnight, then air out. And if a smell comes back, get the source.

First impression (sight and smell) sells these things.



And guys will travel for that Dodge. Just tell 'em you're an old fart RVer. Don't know much about the truck mechanical details, but hate to sell it nevertheless (ha!). It'll be a race to git thar!!
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Old 06-29-2017, 06:53 AM   #161
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As a followup for those not familiar:

Still want the solo weight, same day, Pat. See Three Pass Method by Ron Gratz I linked over here in 2010 or so.

I like "zero" as my Steer starting point. Same Steer Axle solo or loaded, WD tensioned.

It's the "best" point to get individual wheel loads on the TV. Whichever tire has highest load on an axle, that's the pressure minimum.

And getting weights on TT is good also. TT will always favor (pull towards) heaviest side. Hopefully (usually ) it's curb side. Main thing is axle equalization: no real difference in load per trailer axle. That's how to define "level".

With TT tires to sidewall max, the experimentation with TV tire pressure range is easier to feel.

There's a minimum, and there's a range of "best"

CapriRacer recommends 1.5-hrs steady state driving for full warm up. With an easy as possible stop in a rest area, check for pressure rise of 5-7%.

Much more than that needs more air. I use 5-lbs with LT E-rate. Find the minimum. Then changes are easy.

Try it at "zero" first. Then change WD settings. Get tire pressure squared away earliest.

If you run TT tires lower, leave that till last.

If you aren't running KONI or Bilstein shocks, it's worth the change.

Same for replacement polyurethane bushings on anti-roll bars.

And I'm guessing you avoided the cracked GM hitch receiver problem of that era.

Good luck.
Could you resend a link to Gratz three pass method.
Thanks
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Old 06-29-2017, 07:36 AM   #162
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...

I recommend using sales brochures as guides. Decoration and angles.

1969 Streamline is best, IMO. See at Tom Patterson site.

What I didn't have then and also recommend is an ozone generator. Takes care of "old age" smell. Overnight, then air out. And if a smell comes back, get the source.

First impression (sight and smell) sells these things.



And guys will travel for that Dodge. Just tell 'em you're an old fart RVer. Don't know much about the truck mechanical details, but hate to sell it nevertheless (ha!). It'll be a race to git thar!!
Hi

All good advice. A few more:

Remove all personal belongings and "stuff" from the trailer. They need to see big empty spaces when they look in here or there. Toss the well used drain hose. You'll never see a dealer include that in a pre-sales pitch. Put all the odd cables, adapters and other fittings in a big box separate from the trailer. Let them go through them if they wish.

I'd add a good wash and wax for the outside. Make it *sparkle* Same spray out / wash out thing for stuff like the bumper storage area and the undercarriage.

Bob
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Old 06-29-2017, 09:38 AM   #163
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To Slow Mover:

I don't mean to be argumentative but some of your statements need to be responded to.

I am 73 and got my experience driving semis and before changing carers drove Semi Tankers hauling chemicals and oil products for three years.
I don't ever recall pulling a 8k GL tanker that wasn't compartmentalized or baffled. It would be suicidal to drive one that wasn't always fully loaded. There are chemicals out there that weigh up to 14 lbs per gallon and the most you could haul is 4k in a semi trailer due to weight restriction.

As to your comment that there isn't an Airstream out there a half ton can't handle, pulling stopping yes, however a 30' AS will shove an air stream around even a slow curve where you have to slow down considerably to maintain full control, not so with a heavier 3/4 ton. I learned this through personal experience. I pulled with a 1/2 ton for 4 years and recently switched to a 3/4 ton and the driving experience is day and night.
Yes, one would be just fine with a half ton, toting around at 55 MPH or less at all times but that doesn't work for most of us.

My My F-250 will stop on dime if I lock them up without a full load or a trailer behind. Better than my car. When towing or loaded to the max everyone should make sure to maintain a safe speed and distance dictated by road and traffic conditions that is just plain common sense.
You couldn't even stop a fully loaded semi with air brakes on dime, I know that from personal experience driving thousands of hours a fully loaded tanker through Chicago's and the Metropolitan areas notorious traffic jams.
Well, you haven't seen or heard it all, that's certain. 7k-gl smoothbore tanker with 5,150-gals. A tick under 47,000-lbs of product. 79,525 at this Load-out. Product slosh is impressive. A few beers and the spellbinding of colliding wave periodicity charts, ha! In every direction.

I'm going to guess you're a big boy, so:

There's a good deal you may wish to learn given the earnestness of your posts. You're not there, yet.

The great threat to TTs are adverse winds. Followed by overcorrection at the steering wheel. You miss that first, and seem to believe "magic" will overcome the second. Don't misunderstand. If you've driven commercially you should be the first to know you can be taken unawares.

A VPP hitch has no peer. You've never used one. We'll take your superior and smaller rig and put against my larger and inferior rig (suspension and electronic gizmo-wise). I'll not only run rings around you (given equalization of skill), I'll do maneuvers that'll roll you.

It's insurance. Once you've tested what is possible, not just reasonable. For when we are taken unawares.

Etc.

I'm third generation at this, with this trailer type. Could be also I'm not the only one where depth of experience ought to give you pause.
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Old 06-30-2017, 06:47 AM   #164
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Hi

Well as long as we're drifting off topic a bit (how unusual ...). Here's one that almost gave me a heart attack last week.

We're chugging through the ever popular PA turnpike curves and hills west of here. I'm pretty far back (800' ?) from a Fed Ex guy pulling a pair of what look like 28' trailers. As we go in and out of the wind shadow of this and that the wind hits pretty quick.

He's headed into a curve, down hill and the second trailer starts to sway. It comes out pretty much all the way across the second lane at least twice. Fortunately he did calm it down rather than crash. I was a bit more focused on slowing down incase he rolled than watching all of the gyrations.

So here's the question: I don't ever remember seeing brake lights. I may have missed them. If he didn't brake, how did he get things back running right?

Bob
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Old 06-30-2017, 06:54 AM   #165
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Hi

Well as long as we're drifting off topic a bit (how unusual ...). Here's one that almost gave me a heart attack last week.

We're chugging through the ever popular PA turnpike curves and hills west of here. I'm pretty far back (800' ?) from a Fed Ex guy pulling a pair of what look like 28' trailers. As we go in and out of the wind shadow of this and that the wind hits pretty quick.

He's headed into a curve, down hill and the second trailer starts to sway. It comes out pretty much all the way across the second lane at least twice. Fortunately he did calm it down rather than crash. I was a bit more focused on slowing down incase he rolled than watching all of the gyrations.

So here's the question: I don't ever remember seeing brake lights. I may have missed them. If he didn't brake, how did he get things back running right?

Bob


A guess - gassing it is like pulling a thread so if it was wobbly and he gave it more gas that could have straightened it out - I wonder if braking would have been worse - meaning, the trailer box is pushing its way around so if he slowed the truck it would be MORE susceptible to getting pushed around by the trailers - no? I don't understand physics so go easy if this is totally wrong!
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Old 06-30-2017, 06:57 AM   #166
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Generally speaking, braking only worsens a trailer sway condition. Accelerating slightly while applying trailer brakes with the brake controller can help straighten things out.
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Old 06-30-2017, 06:57 AM   #167
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uncle bob,

If the FedEx driver manually applied the brakes on the rear trailer only, would this have lit up his brake lights? Not sure how those lights are set up. Maybe from the main brake pedal only?

When hitchhiking decades ago, I got a ride in a semi in a snow storm, and he demonstrated applying the trailer brakes only, to induce an out-of-control trailer fishtail situation, which he promptly corrected. Just a single trailer back then. And he was not correcting a sway condition, just demonstrating the trailer brakes.

Can a semi driver manually apply only the rear trailer's brakes on a double rig, in order to calm down a sway situation?

Thanks,

Peter

PS -- Wikipedia article on Long Combination rigs:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Combination_Vehicle

B Train: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-train
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Old 06-30-2017, 07:30 AM   #168
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The FedEx driver most likely applied trailer brakes by hand while applying slight fuel.
Not sure the trailer brake hand control illuminates the brake lights.
I will check- I always check the trailer brakes with the hand control at the beginning of every trip.
I may need to enlist the help of my wife to see if the brake lights come on using the hand control only.
Somehow I doubt the hand control only will Illuminate the brake lights.
The brake lights are illuminated by a brake light switch down by the service/foot brake.
The service/foot brake is likely the only means by which the brake lights are illuminated.
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