visited CAT scales - the numbers are in...

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by Mikethefixit

...It is very important to Use the CAT scale and get the balance correct.

good info roger! and the numbers look great.

are you using w/d bars?

if so, what rating and adjustment?

cheers
2air'

[mustang]

It Is great info Air, I have a question. is it proper to load a steering axle the same as a drive axle? as with case number 3

[Mikethefixit]

2air
I'm sorry U ask a question in June that I don't remember even seeing.
The hitch is an OLD Duel Cam Reese I believe.It has no names or ratings on the bars. I thinks there is a number and 1 word "TOP" at the base of the bars to show which side should be up.
I think there are 7 links in the chains of which I use the very last one. I tried goin up one link to 6 but WHOW NELLIE that was the wrong thing to do. The ride and handling went bye bye. I'm glad we wear seat belts. It was rough.
I need to get back across the scales to see where we are since I changed axles on the trailer. I gained about 4" in ride height. I had used a BLUE OX 4" drop in the drawbar, to get the ball height down and keep the trailer level because of the hitch height of the 1 ton.I have since removed the drop and I am only the tip of a bubble off from level. I use 2 different levels that are not attached to the rig. I do have points where I check for level.Works for me.
I do check tire temps when we stop (check only with my hand) temps seem to be running normal all around the rig.
I am satisfied with the set up and the comfortab;e ride it gives us. We even leave things (no breakage of course) on the table and counter tops,nothing on the floor yet.LOL
Will keep you informed 2 air
Roger

[Mikethefixit]

Mustang
I wouldn't shot for equal weight on the steering. U know I have the 7.3 liter Harvester Diesel. F350SW/Crew/8ft.
Before I change trailer axles my weights were
Steering 4120
Drive 4580
Trailer Tandem 5060
Total Gross 13,760
This gives us as perfect a ride as I can get.
Hummm 45 yrs of big trucks has come in handy
Roger
PS Possibly we will make the Rally on the lake.Wife said yes. So we will see how the weather shapes up.

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Mikethefixit

Mustang
I wouldn't shot for equal weight on the steering. U know I have the 7.3 liter Harvester Diesel. F350SW/Crew/8ft.
Before I change trailer axles my weights were
Steering 4120
Drive 4580
Trailer Tandem 5060
Total Gross 13,760
This gives us as perfect a ride as I can get.
Hummm 45 yrs of big trucks has come in handy
Roger
PS Possibly we will make the Rally on the lake.Wife said yes. So we will see how the weather shapes up.

Mike.

Idealy, the front and rear axle of the tow vehicle, should be about the same weight.

The maximum difference is 10 percent.

Your weights show 5 percent.

What is the rating of your Reese bars?

Measure the top of the square bar as it goes into the trunnion.

1 " = 550 pounds
1 1/8 " = 750 pounds
1 1/4 " = 1000 pounds.

Andy

[HiHoAgRV]

Wow, a classic 2air thread.
Thanks for the info and it's cool seeing the "Years" old thread being used NOW!

[Airstream01]

Went to the scales a couple days ago. Brand new ProPride 3P with 1000lb bars and 8" drop on the adjustable stinger, pulling a 2008 Sarari SE 25FB that is pretty empty.
So I hitched up, set the W/D jacks at 12cm from bottom on each side, which nearly leveled the truck as best as I could tell sitting in my driveway, then I added 25 psi to both airbags on the rear axle, which finished leveling the truck and trailer, and I went back to the scales. New guy knew what was up, and I got everything weighed.

Truck is a 2001 F250 SD 4x4 Ext. Cab, short bed, 7.3L with a full tank of diesel (~30 gal), normal compliment of tools I carry in the toolbox, ginormous (and heavy) front bumper, and ~40 gal of fresh water in the potable water tank on the 'Stream, full propane, but I was not in the truck since I couldn't reach the button to tell the guy I was set up.

Front Axle----4140 lbs
Rear Axle-----4380 lbs
Trailer---------5460 lbs
GCW-----------13980 lbs

I was pretty happy with these numbers, and there was a bit of a line, so I decided not to reweigh.

With me in the truck, it would probably make the front axle about 4250 and the rear 4450. Add my dad or my girl and we're over 4300 on the front and its only rated to 4400 so I think I'm close enough for gov't work.

Based on my stop at the dump today (scale said 7540 empty), I've distributed ~900 lbs of tongue weight onto the truck, so the weight of the 'Stream makes sense.

Additionally, prior to this I towed right on the ball, no W/D or sway control at all. The ride was soft. With the ProPride 3P and everything dialed in, my butt can't tell any difference in the ride. Still nice and soft.

[Inland RV Center, In]

You must not have more than 10 percent of the total tow vehicle weight, on the rear axle, that's greater than the front axle, for safe towing.

Your rig, is well within that number.

Andy

[CanoeStream]

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

You must not have more than 10 percent of the total tow vehicle weight, on the rear axle, that's greater than the front axle, for safe towing.

Please break this down into more than one comma-nist sentence. I don't know the relationship either of the 10% you mention or "greater than the front axle." And certainly you don't mean "tow vehicle weight" in the first clause. Simpler is gooder for my simpler noggin...

[Airstream01]

I'm fairly certain he means that the front and rear #s should be within 10% of each other, with the rear axle carrying the extra 10%.

My #s are w/in ~5% with the rear axle carrying the extra weight.

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by CanoeStream

Please break this down

see post #7 bob.

the 10% notion is a nice idea but doesn't apply to ALL vehicles.

and as discussed in many threads,

the PRIMARY goal with w/d is to RESTORE steering axle loads to UN hitched values.

which may NOT mean EQUAL values for the load front/rear when towing with trucks.

SOME trucks have rear/drive axles with 1000 lbs+ higher capacities than the front/steering capacity...

so the 10% guide would NOT be useful then, OR IF it means OVERloading the steering axle.
________________

Originally Posted by Airstream01

Went to the scales a couple days ago. Brand new ProPride 3P with 1000lb bars and 8" drop on the adjustable stinger...

Front Axle----4140 lbs
Rear Axle-----4380 lbs
Trailer---------5460 lbs
GCW-----------13980 lbs

...With the ProPride 3P and everything dialed in, my butt can't tell any difference in the ride. Still nice and soft.

that's a really good starting point and certainly the numbers look great.

tow with, see how it all feels and rides over several 100 miles and varying conditions.

it also supports the notion that we can get pretty close by using good wheel well measurements, when a scale isn't handy.
____________

some random thoughts to consider or ignore...

-my truck has 6k axles front/rear, that must be the primary reason for higher tow capacity versus your 2001...
____________
WHAT is the rear axle rating?

-with air bags you have yet another factor for tweaking the arrangement,

which i'd be inclined to fiddle with several times.... fiddling is fun.
____________
there are WIDELY different views on how to use the bags, which to adjust first (bags or bars) and so on...

including the view that bags should NOT be used with w/d bars.

((be prepared for a deluge of posts on this issue))

i don't accept that view EXCEPT with hitches that RELY on bar tension/flex for sway control (like the dual cam)

your pp has full sway control REGARDLESS of w/d bar tension, even at ZERO...
____________

consider (as a trial) first adding air to the bags and THEN adjusting the screw jacks to reload the steering axle.

it will take less tension (i think) on the w/d to restore front axle loading this way...
_____________

you've got a ~400 lb front bumper on the truck???

that's a LOT of mass and uses up a lot of the front axle rating.

it' might be wise to ditch that for a normal bumper.

because after LOADING the motor bike and ALL your gear in the truck bed, the PAYLOAD may be OVER the ratings...
_____________

of course it's important to include YOUR driving assessment and road feel to each/every tweak...

i've reweighed my rig >10 times and learn something new with each of these exercises..


cheers
2air'

and THANKS for using this thread, the old posts are still useful and the value of weighing important for all of us towing streams...

[Airstream01]

2air,

the rear axle is rated at 6800lbs if I remember correctly.

front is 4400lbs rated

I'm not entirely sure what the front bumper weighs, all I know is its very heavy. It is an older Ranch Hand. There is a lot of steel in it. I'd like to ditch it for something with a little less weight, but the truck came with it, and I haven't found anyone who wants to trade yet.

Brian

[2airishuman]

gotcha!

so the rear axle is 6800 lbs vs 4400 lbs up front?

that's quite a difference are you sure about the front rating with a DEISEL powerplant???

4400 seems low given how much that 7.3 weighs.

my recollection is these trucks were ~5k front/rear.

the AXLE RATING is printed on the drivers door/near the latching mechanism...

what was the truck axle loads (especially the front) UN hitched???

here's another older thread that BElabors the axle loading issue but has some useful info buried in it too...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ion-44825.html

cheers
2air'

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by CanoeStream

Please break this down into more than one comma-nist sentence. I don't know the relationship either of the 10% you mention or "greater than the front axle." And certainly you don't mean "tow vehicle weight" in the first clause. Simpler is gooder for my simpler noggin...

Bob.

If the tow vehicle, when rigged to the trailer, weighs, as an example. 6000 pounds, then ideally, 3000 should be on the front axle and 3000 pounds should be on the rear axle.

The 10 percent means, in this example, 600 pounds.

Therefore, ideally, the front axle should not be less than 2700 pounds and the rear axle should not be more than 3300 pounds.

Andy