visited CAT scales - the numbers are in...

[azflycaster]

I need to do this with my setup. How much do they charge for this service and do you pay extra if you reweigh (is that a word?) after you change the settings on the hitch?

[nickcrowhurst]

Originally Posted by azflycaster

How much do they charge for this service and do you pay extra if you reweigh (is that a word?) after you change the settings on the hitch?

FWIW, I've done the weighing twice, and there was no charge on either occasion at Old Town, North Florida, on Route 19. No charge for changing the links and re-weighing, but I checked the previous day, and asked when would be a quiet and convenient time. I certainly wouldn't do it in a line of hard-working 18-wheeler drivers on a tight time schedule. Nick.

[2airishuman]

hi azflycaster and others

i paid 8$ for the initial measurement and 1$ for each reweigh so a total of
10$ for the numbers posted. then doing the truck alone(f/r) and the trailer (tongue/axel) added 2$ more.

i think reweights are defined as each addition set of measurements that day....so for very little $ you could get measures at each possilbe setting on the wd bars.....and even before/after fuel or water or with and without bessy. for <20$ you could load/unload and move all sorts of gear around while collecting weights......

of course this would qualify you for the obsessive/compulsive/anal retentive division of the forum (looking sheepishly around) AND i agree holding up truckers during a run would be a no no.

ymmv

visit www.catscale.com for more info on this common scale service co. and the process.

cheers
2air'

[2airishuman]

sorry folks that should be www.catscale.com

unless you want to read about the folks who make and sell scales......

btw for us newbies the CAT stands for "certified automated truck" scale.


sorry for the red herring link BUT since we can only delete/edit briefly.....the post shall remain in perpituity (sc).....

cheers
2air'

[azflycaster]

Thanks for the info. I agree about holding up the truckers.

[nickcrowhurst]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

the problem is on the truck which has e rated tires that "e" rating is only valid IF the tires are properly inflated which means 65-75 at a minimum. and for the full load rating they need to pumped up to 80!!!
while i'm not planning to roll the truck/trailer combined, many truck rollovers can be directly traced to under inflated tires....for the bf's on the truck 55 would be significantly under inflated.......but i do realize the trailer would like the softness.2air'

The Rubber Manufacturers Load Inflation tables for Light Truck (LT) tires can be found on several websites, including http://www.goodyear.com/truck/pdf/da...dInflation.pdf
Page 7 lists the table, which shows loads suited down to 35 psi.
I use these tables, after a visit to a weigh station, to set my Dodge Ram 2500 diesel at the recommended pressures. IIRC, these are about 55psi for my "e" rated tires when towing the Excella 25. It tows like a dream.This has been discussed at length on other occasions, but I feel any newcomer reading this thread should be aware of this alternative approach. For those who have not studied this subject, passenger vehicle tires (P rated) are kept at the pressure on the vehicle plate, but light truck (LT) tires may have their pressure adjusted to the load carried, up to the maximum listed on the plate by the driver's door. I don't claim any specialist knowledge of tires, so I just follow the manufacturer's recommendations. Nick.

[RichardT]

My local landfill has a scale and said I can weigh my Airstreams anytime for free!
I may just drive it over there one day this coming winter when I have some time.

[2airishuman]

be careful about visiting the land fill richard, they guy might know the scrap value of all o' that aluminiummmmmm.

hi nick

i'd really like to know more about how you commute from the the uk and work out the details for happy livin'. i've considered doing this myself. maybe you could post a note on what the uk/us cycle of living is like....

no doubt for your rig you've done all the measurements, made lots of adjustments and ultimately dialed in what you percieive as the best settings....and the 25er is barely an effort for that dodge ram!

i'm aware of the variable pressures for variable loads on light truck tires.....and i've worked through the tables a time or 2......they are sort of like the irs tax tables......anyway you run the numbers i still end up oweing more that i want......and end up back at 75 psi....

the tables do require a first hand knowledge tv/tongue/carrying loads---which is my goal with this thread.....gettin' folks out for the weigh in....

AND a realistic awareness of driving speeds.......since adding speeds above 55 means adding 10psi ......also i'm not sure if we can measure individual wheel loads or can believe that loads are balanced side to side in the tv......my 38gal tank is on the left, so am i, so is the dog, and in the bed i don't try to balance loads.....and i regularly drive at 65 or above without the tow....and sometimes with it....i know the trailer tires are rated at 65mph.....

so let's all remember tires fail from excessive heat. extra heat comes from under inflation. rollovers are linked to under inflation, poor fuel economy is linked to under inflatioin, poor stopping is linked to under inflation, premature wear is linked to underinflation......heck maybe even obesity is linked to under inflation.

except for perceived comfort very little is linked to max sidewall inflation....

instead of trying to use the tables and potentially ending up under inflated, i prefer to use an infared temp gauge and a pressure measure of what happens once the tires are warm.....if they go up >10% in pressure, i'll get out the compressor and add air at the next stop.

this exercise has been covered here too and it works....tires run cooler and pressures go up less with higher cold inflations....up to the sidewall max.

on the temp side the trailer tires run much cooler than the truck and at 65 psi the triaxles all measure at the same temps too.....i do love numbers.


cheers
2air'

[nickcrowhurst]

[QUOTE=2airishuman]i'd really like to know more about how you commute from the the uk and work out the details for happy livin'. i've considered doing this myself. maybe you could post a note on what the uk/us cycle of living is like....

2air, my son and granddaughter are in the USA, so I spend 5 months, 1st November to 1st April in your country each year. I store my tow truck at my son's place, and the Airstream at a friend's farm. My wife and I spend our time exploring the coast in our tandem sea kayak. Living in the Airstream is, of course, a great pleasure, and we often stay at State Parks. The main challenge is to ensure that the home and vehicle on each continent are safe and secure when not in use. This would be trickey, and perhaps expensive, without family and friends in each continent. I leave the vehicles with a sophisticated "battery minder", with all oils and fluids just changed, and the trailer is carefully winterized. The air fare is about $600 return each, flying British Airways. We have a ball!

"no doubt for your rig you've done all the measurements, made lots of adjustments and ultimately dialed in what you percieive as the best settings....and the 25er is barely an effort for that dodge ram!"

Yes, you're right. I like playing with the numbers. I'm a mathematician by training. This means I'll spend hours working out these details, and forget to bring the Airstream keys from England!

"instead of trying to use the tables and potentially ending up under inflated, i prefer to use an infared temp gauge and a pressure measure of what happens once the tires are warm"

Yes, I have one of those infra-red thermometers, and use it at every stop. It's a great comfort to know, rather than guess, that the tires and bearings are at satisfactory temperatures. Last year I was using the infra-red at a rest stop on I95 when an RV with a toad pulled in. The driver asked me about the tool, and requested that I use it on his rig. Sure enough, one tire on his toad was in trouble.

Nick.

[jcanavera]

[QUOTE=nickcrowhurst]

Originally Posted by 2airishuman

Yes, I have one of those infra-red thermometers, and use it at every stop. It's a great comfort to know, rather than guess, that the tires and bearings are at satisfactory temperatures.
Nick.

Nick, I am curious regarding the tempatures that you consider "normal". I'm sure it has some correspondance to ambient air temps, amt of sunshine, road surface etc, speed you are traveling at. Can you provide some numbers to us all to give us an idea of what you are seeing with your infra-red device?

Regards,

Jack

[nickcrowhurst]

[QUOTE=jcanavera]

Originally Posted by nickcrowhurst

Can you provide some numbers to us all to give us an idea of what you are seeing with your infra-red device.
Jack

Jack, I tow mainly on the east coast I95 and the Florida section of I75. These have no hills or mountains, so my use of the brakes is minimal. Ambient temperatures are usually about 70 degrees. Under these circumstances I usually see 90 degrees on the tow truck hubs, and 110 degrees on the trailer hubs. This is immediately we have stopped after applying the brakes gently to come to a halt. I always point the device through the slots in the wheel covers, directly at the hubs. I also measure the tire side-wall temperatures, and IIRC, these are about 90 degrees, perhaps ten degrees higher on the sunny side. I also use the device to adjust the brakes. After initial adjustment by feel, I take the rig for a 5 mile run, applying the brakes several times. As I come to a halt, I measure the temperature of all 4 trailer hubs. If one of the hubs is more than ten degrees hotter than any of the others, I loosen that brake adjuster by one click, at the roadside. If just one is more than ten degrees cooler than the others, obviously I tighten just that one by one click. It sometimes takes 3 or 4 minor adjustments to equalize the brakes. I purchased the device from RadioShack. On the toad I mentioned, 3 wheels were about 90, and one was 140, probably because of under-inflation of a tire or a binding brake. Nick.

[flyfisher]

2Air -

Thanks for your post. This subject has been on my mind for the past couple weeks.

I did my first Cat scale weigh-in earlier this month in Missoula, MT, and paid $8.00 for a single weight, and would probably have paid the same as you, if we'd done a second or third weight as you did. My total gross weight was 16460#.

Not knowing much about how to do the weigh-in, I put both of my truck axles on the front scale platform, so we got just one total weight for the truck and a second weight for the trailer.

I have a 2000 F250 psd with the regular cab, long bed, 4x4, an A.I.R.E. fiberglass cap (maybe 200# I'm guessing), sprayed-in bedliner, Hauler Aluminum ladder rack (under 100#), Enkay Mudflaps, and Reese High Performance Dual Cam hitch (with 1200# Reese bars).

My total truck weight came in at 9000#, which included a full tank of 38 gallons of fuel, and included my wife, and various items in the truck bed, including my inflatable boat (about 100#) a Honda eu200i generator with electric cables, etc (another 100#), my mountain bike, some fishing gear, a few tools and other miscellaneous items probably not weighing more than another 200# max.

What concerned me is that I would add another 200# to the truck weight, making the total actual truck weight about 9200#, but the GVWR on my truck is just 8800# (the front axle GVWR is 4800# and rear axle GVWR is 6084# per the sticker on the door truck's door panel).

The only thing I can figure is that I must have an awfully heavy trailer tongue weight, because I never dreamed that my truck would be overloaded. ??? Airstream shows my hitch weight at 1125# in their sales literature.

I have a 2004 30' Classic Ltd, which has a GVWR of 8700#, and the scale weight for the trailer came in at 7460#. So I think our trailer weight was OK in comparison. We almost never carry any notable amount of water in any of our tanks, and we don't have much extra weight in the front of our trailer (maybe 100# of "stuff") beyond what the factory installed, including 2 full 40# propane tanks.

This coming week I want to weigh the truck without the trailer attached to see what it weighs by itself, and then weigh each truck axle separately when we have the trailer hitched up again (which won't be for another month, since we are residing at the Yellowstone's Edge RV park until then).

In the meantime, I don't think there is anything in the truck that we'd want to carry in the trailer, and there isn't much else in the front of the trailer that we can put elsewhere farther back to reduce the tongue weight.

Since I'm still a novice at this, does anybody have some suggestions?

Incidentally, I've been keeping my front truck tires at 75# and rear tires at 80# inflation. 80# is the max inflation shown on the tire sidewalls.

John

[2airishuman]

flyfisher

my truck is a bit longer (crew cab) and the long bed ARE shell may weigh 300 or so....but your steer/drive weight is just a few hundred lbs less than mine....and we're carring a lot of the same stuff....you may have a bit more in the shell (no wifey in mine)....but those numbers are close.

i think ford increased the payload #s this last year with beefier front axle and bigger brakes?

yes you want to know your tongue weight since that is part of the truck load....and if you've got too much on the tongue, moving stuff back to the center or aft in the trailer will 'lighten the truck some'.....

how much?

well it depends on that next go round at the scales. also given your potential tongue weight PLUS the 7460 on the trailer axles.....you could be at or near the trailer limits. let us know what the numbers are when you do get to movin' again.

i found the www.catscale.com had a nice little tutorial on axle placement. by drawing a little schematic it's possible to plan the weigh-in to get the most specific measures while unhitching and moving the least times.....and don't forget to measure with the wd bars adusted in multiple settings.....this is only 1$ and requires no vehilcle movement so it takes just seconds to do....

might be time for a little spring cleaning......those brass plated fuzzy dice might need to go...and any fish you are catching can be drop shipped to me!

montana....i'm jealous right now.

cheers
2air'

[flyfisher]

2Air -

Thanks for your observations. I looked at the catscale.com website and it has been helpful.

Perhaps if I could just get my wife to ride in the back of the trailer that would solve multiple issues! Just kidding (she might read this and then I'd be in even bigger trouble).

I think I'll try shifting more items to the rear of our trailer before re-weighing, plus get a weight on each trailer axle (mine have a 4200# rating per axle).

Will let you know when I get the results.

John

ps - All of my fishing is catch-and-release. Nobody can disprove my fish stories that way. Sorry.

[hookedonclassic]

Stopped at the CAT scale tonight for the first time for a weigh-in. Didn't have wife with me and didn't have the clothes/food in the camper. Fresh water was full, gray and black tanks were empty as that is how we travel. STUFF I typically take along was in the back of the TV. Propane and diesel tanks were full.

I tried two different setting on the Hensley to get an idea of weight on the front and rear axles of the TV. I'll refer to the marks on the Hensley as 1, 2, 3. With the tension set at the middle mark (2), the front axle was 4,040 lbs, rear axle was 4,360 and the trailer axles were 8,220 for a total combined weight of 16,620. With the tension set at the tightest (1), the front axle was 4,140 lb, rear axle at 4,260, and trailer 8,220 for total 16,620. I have the 1400 lb bars on it. Ride is good on smooth highways but rough on concrete highways. I'll probably keep the bars at the middle setting to keep the ride decent. I know that some owners use 1000 lb bars while others use 1400 lbs bars. Would the 1000 lb bars improve the ride on concrete highways? Hensley said I could go either way.

[2airishuman]

hi rich

one question i'd offer....

did you weight the truck without the trailer attached?
this is important...knowing what was on each truck axel...without the trailer.
also did ya measure the trailer tongue again without being connected?

as for 1000 vs 1400lbs (i'm using 1000)......
i'll have more on this in a few days.....
i'v got some new data and ideas....
will post more.....
after i talk with the hensley rep at the rally.....

cheers
2air'

[silverback]

I've got the truck height(s) measured and will get that weighed solo first. Our camping plans are preempted due to the Sedona fire (we were going to Munds Park but they're under an evacuation order) so I might as well visit the Cat scale. How did you weigh the tongue? Unhook at the cat scale? FYI - we're using the 1000 lb draw tite bars and I'm thinking about going down to 750.
-Ken

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by silverback

I've got the truck height(s) measured and will get that weighed solo first. Our camping plans are preempted due to the Sedona fire (we were going to Munds Park but they're under an evacuation order) so I might as well visit the Cat scale. How did you weigh the tongue? Unhook at the cat scale? FYI - we're using the 1000 lb draw tite bars and I'm thinking about going down to 750.
-Ken

hi ken and others....

yes if using the cat scales, unhitch with the trailer axles on the 3rd platform and the tongue on the 2nd.....get the trailer reasonably level front2back...
and ask the operator inside for an additional reading....usually each added reading is only a dollar or so, after the first 6-8 dollar weight...

one can also measure ft/rr tv axles as part of the full process, unhooked (but loaded with gear) and again hooked up while adjusting the spring bars....see the first post in the thread for my go round doing this...

cheers
2air'

[TIMEMACHINE]

2airishuman,

Thanks for the info on the CAT scale adventure. .....What did you think of the factory tour and your service at Jackson Center? Did you see anything new?

[2airishuman]

Originally Posted by TIMEMACHINE

2airishuman,

Thanks for the info on the CAT scale adventure. .....What did you think of the factory tour and your service at Jackson Center? Did you see anything new?

hi time machine and welcome to the forums....

the factory tour is great, i've done it 7-8 times now and learn something new each visit....seeing how an airstream is built really helps one understand the issues (good or bad) in our own trailers....

there are several threads here on factory tours and even some photos....but really the virtual tour on airstreams own web site has pretty good pix of the key steps...

the service center guys are FANTASTIC......and i mean it.

great workers, very skillful and amazing people skills....airstream owners can be pains......if ya know what i mean.

some of them were flown out to the international rally, so i'm having some expert service done here in oregon next week!

as for new stuff this thread is old now........

but the new stuff right now that is also 'hot'.......
safari 25s rear door, ls, se are the big sellers and the models are pretty nice.
there is supposed to be a rear door classic at the rally next week, so i'll report on it......and maybe a base camp.....

now back to the weigh ins........everyone should visit a scale at least once!

cheers
2air'