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Old 11-24-2012, 08:14 AM   #21
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Yep, it was the advent of common rail injection that really quieted them down. They run a tremendous fuel pressure and actually squirt a little bit into the chamber and it starts to light as they then inject the main charge. It gives better combustion, a smoother combustion, and doesn't hammer so hard as the older style did. They are more efficient due to the better combustion, and quiter due to the more gradual light off.

I find the DuraMaxes in particular to be really quiet. My Cummins is louder than a Duramax, but it's WAY quieter than my dad's older model Cummins with the old style injection. I think Ford is in the middle noisewise.

Nobody has ever complained about mine early in the morning, but I purposely don't let it idle for 20 minutes while I'm hooking stuff up. I get the hitch on the ball and then shut the truck off. I restart when we're pulling out. Just trying to be considerate

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Old 11-24-2012, 08:58 AM   #22
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The new diesels are quiet as gassers. Iv been walking by a truck idling at a local hardware store and had to stop and do a double take. I couldnt decide if it was gas or diesel! The lower rumble gave it away but to say it was loud would be incredibly wrong. I do agree before about 2008, they do get noisy. My dad owns the 6.0 Powerjoke, and it is quite noisy. The old 7.3Ls... you probably couldnt carry on a conversation standing next to them. And on the other hand, my gasser F-250 makes more noise than a diesel could ever imagine. True dual glasspacks + big block = Whatd ya say? Couldnt hear ya.

I may be showing my age but I dont think you should make a decision on a TV due to noise in my personal opinion
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:16 AM   #23
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With more and more gears, there's going to be more and more gear shifting, but since automatics are now dominating light trucks, you don't have to do it. The 6 speed Tundra transmission shifts very smoothly. Unless I'm trying to pay attention to it, I don't even notice it most of the time. The only relatively noisy time is going up steep grades fast when it drops down to 3rd for a while. The engine is very quiet most of the time. It can be hard to tell it is running when idling.

We always preferred stick shifts, but it is hard to get now. I'm not sure I'd want to do all the shifting necessary now to get lots of power and better mileage—and it seems the automatics are smarter than I am. I guess we'll see 3 transmission options in the future—many speed automatics, CVT's or electric motors powering the wheels, so no transmission. I never have figured out CVT, but it seems to hold on at the edge. Younger people may not remember the 3 speed stick on the column mated with a big, gas hog V8 that was the standard for a long time.

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Old 11-24-2012, 10:26 AM   #24
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At 27 foot, you are in that range that would be just about max without a diesel. I see a lot of people like their Tundra's, and I'd love to see the one that gets 10 to 12 mpg while towing a 27 footer.
I tow a 27FB (really 28') and EASILY get 12 mpg with my 2011 Tundra (2 wheel drive). That is to say 12 mpg is the worst I've ever gotten.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:02 PM   #25
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Mike91208; Is your truck a long box?
The one with the 164.6" wheel base?
My dream truck is a 4x2 Tundra Double Cab with the long box. 5.7 Ltr V8.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:21 PM   #26
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The Tundra has very nice accurate steering which is plus for towing. This is one heck of a truck (I've owned five overall from different mfg.).

I went from Tundra and 25' Airstream to a 24' Class C on E450 chassis. By comparison the handling and V10 powertrain of the E450 is primitive.

Love the new motorhome, but have to give a hearty endorsement to the Tundra. A neighbor just bought one to tow his toyhauler and he was raving about his too.
Apples and oranges? Sal
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Old 11-24-2012, 03:20 PM   #27
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Apples and oranges? Sal
Perhaps Sal. I thought a little cross RV insight may be interesting. Perhaps others do too. I had the Airstream/Tundra combo for a month after buying the motorhome and got some good comparison time. The handling of that particular rig was it's best quality.

FWIW I towed the Airstream for much of its life w/ 1999 F250 diesel. The handling precision of the Tundra was much better (sharper, more accurate steering) and the Tundra's ride was better on freeways (much less porpoising). The Ford got 15 MPG in situations where the Tundra got 12 MPG - steady towing cruising. The class C gets 10 MPG in these conditions.

Most of what I was getting at was strong endorsement of the Tundra.
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Old 11-24-2012, 04:17 PM   #28
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I have a 2010 Toyota Crew Max 4x4 I uesd it to haul a 86 Excella 32 foot and I now
haul our 2003 Classic. This fall, I got 12.5 miles to a Gallon hauling around Maine, New Hamshire and Vermont. We put almost 4000 miles on out Toyota.
I have had no problems hauling either Airstream and will still use this truck when I get a 34 foot for full timing (after I retire).
The truck has a tow haul buton that tells the computer that you are moving something and the computer does what it is programed to do. It starts and stops almost as if there wasn't a 8700 lb trailer hitched on.
So-- if you want a good daily driver and a great work horse, you can't go wrong with the Toyota --- ( they are made in Texas)
Good luch whichever way you go.
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:53 PM   #29
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Mike91208; Is your truck a long box?
The one with the 164.6" wheel base?
My dream truck is a 4x2 Tundra Double Cab with the long box. 5.7 Ltr V8.
No, it's a double-cab, 'regular' box. (don't really know the dimension off hand, but I know it's not the long box)
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:28 AM   #30
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You will most likely never have any problems with the Tundra. Lots of folks on these forums use them with success. Sal
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:21 AM   #31
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No, it's a double-cab, 'regular' box. (don't really know the dimension off hand, but I know it's not the long box)
It is probably 6 1/2 feet. Some of the giant cabs (crew cab?) are 4 1/2 feet. I believe there is an 8 foot one available on the regular cab, but you'd have to check on the Toyota website to see what comes with what.

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Old 11-25-2012, 11:38 AM   #32
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I pull with the 5.7 Tundra and got plenty of power. It's an OK daily driver, mine has the TRD off road package I don't have a clue why I let my sales guy talk me into that, but with the package let's say the ride is jiggly. I'm thinking about moving up to a FC27FB myself and wouldn't think I would have to change tow vehicles. I don't hear any complaints with respect to reliability on the Toyota. The mileage on diesel trucks in general has gone down the tubes with the pollution control here in California (don't know about the rest of the country). I work in heavy construction and notice most all contractors (big and small) have gone away from the diesels. They claim the maintenance and repairs are higher than gas and diesel fuel has gone up in price plus more expensive to buy up front. Food for thought, the Dodge is an Italian car nowadays. Fiat starting controlling them a while back.
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:44 AM   #33
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While gas engines now have higher torque numbers, please note the rpms the engine is turning to generate that torque value. Typically the engines will be over 3,000 rpm. My 3 liter diesel generates the max torque curve between 1400 and 2400 rpm. Thus the engine works optimally at the speeds I drive. Less engine noise and bearing wear.

Just another consideration in the engine discussion.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:05 PM   #34
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Diesels have a narrow maximum torque band. That requires lots of shifting and with automatics with lots of gears, that gets solved. Stick shifts in large diesel trucks may have as many as 16 gears; glad I don't have to shift that. Diesels with automatics are engineered to stay within that narrow torquer band. Gas engines have maximum torque at higher rpms (though there are significant differences between gas engines meaning that maximum torque may be developed at lower or higher rpms) generally; the maximum torque band is generally wider on the gas engine. Gas engine automatics are also engineered to stay within that engine's wider torque band—thus they shift less in most designs.

Each species of engine is built for these rules of torque. Running at high rpm is built into gas engines, so bearing wear should be not very different. Noise is a factor of insulation, exhaust systems and other ways to dampen noise—you can make any engine fairly quiet. What seems like noise to one person is not to another—just ask my wife what she thinks when I turn up the volume when Eric Clapton is playing the blues. Going uphill fast with high rpms generates some noise, but it doesn't bother me. It is just what the engine does and it doesn't have to do it very often. Some people associate high rpm noise with bad things, but the companies know that engines will be run this way, so they design for it. I had to make this same explanation to my wife a week or two ago.

Our Tundra typically runs at (very roughly) 2,000 rpm when cruising. It can get down to 1,500 sometimes on a slight downgrade. It is a big long stroke V8, not so different in the V8's of decades ago in that regard. On moderate hills it'll jump to 2,500-3,000 for short distances. Steep ones can bring it up to 4,000 and more. The red line has never been broached. Downshifting on steep hills can also bring it pretty high, but that sound is reassuring and makes me happy.

Gas engines used to wear out much, much faster than diesels. But they were build for different purposes. Diesels were used for commercial uses and the people who bought them wanted engines that lasted for many hundreds of thousands of miles. Gas engines were for family sedans and a few light trucks (a generation or two ago few people owned light trucks) and the companies thrived on quick turnover of cars and no one cared if the engines didn't last (some started going bad at 50,000 miles). Things have changed and so have engines and transmissions. Gas engines last a very long time now.

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Old 11-25-2012, 01:42 PM   #35
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O geez... another gas vs diesel argument...
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:45 PM   #36
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O geez... another gas vs diesel argument...
This is nothingówait 'til it is a gas vs. diesel vs. electric argument.

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Old 11-25-2012, 02:42 PM   #37
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I pull with the 5.7 Tundra and got plenty of power. It's an OK daily driver, mine has the TRD off road package I don't have a clue why I let my sales guy talk me into that, but with the package let's say the ride is jiggly. I'm thinking about moving up to a FC27FB myself and wouldn't think I would have to change tow vehicles. I don't hear any complaints with respect to reliability on the Toyota. The mileage on diesel trucks in general has gone down the tubes with the pollution control here in California (don't know about the rest of the country). I work in heavy construction and notice most all contractors (big and small) have gone away from the diesels. They claim the maintenance and repairs are higher than gas and diesel fuel has gone up in price plus more expensive to buy up front. Food for thought, the Dodge is an Italian car nowadays. Fiat starting controlling them a while back.
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TerryC,

I too have the TRD package, but have never been clear on what is different than the non-TRD other than the Bilsteins and the skid plate. I bought used and it was on the truck already. Do you know?
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:14 PM   #38
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TerryC,

I too have the TRD package, but have never been clear on what is different than the non-TRD other than the Bilsteins and the skid plate. I bought used and it was on the truck already. Do you know?
The info on that is kind of vague in the book I have on 2007 models. But it includes off road tuning of suspension, front tow hooks, sliding rear window, fog lamps, different wheel design. Strangely it does not mention the shocks and skid plates, two of the most important items. These packages change a lot, so each year would be possibly different.

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Old 11-25-2012, 04:37 PM   #39
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Not to beat a deadhorse,

But I want to throw another vote towards the Tundra. I have 6.0 Liter 1/2 Ton Silverado and just got done with an 11K mile trip pulling the Airstream, From Ohio to California and then to Maine and it did just fine.

I use a weight distributing hitch and added some extra leaf springs and drove safely, by that I mean, I drove like a was towing an expensive trailer that I want to have for years.

All the talk about "Power" to pass and to negotiate traffic is a bit much for me. A half ton truck, with the specs the Tundra has, will be more then ample. If you really feel the need to constantly pull a camper in excess of 70mph and pass traffic at greater speeds then sure- consider the diesel.

But if your a weekend warrior who only has a chance for long extended trips once a year, then MOST 1/2 Ton Trucks will serve the purpose of hauling your camper just fine, under normal and SAFE driving.

I climbed hills in the slow lane, and undoubtedly I could have accelerated, but I like my gas mileage and keeping the truck running cool and around 3k RPMs or less. I fully agree the Diesel's provide better power, just for the application of of "part" time towing vehicle I dont think the juice is worth the squeeze.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:19 PM   #40
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Glad you mentioned cooling, mgm. I see posts from time to time about overheating while towing. I have never seen any from Tundra owners. Our experience is that the needles (engine and transmission) hardly ever moves and only the slightest bit when it does.

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