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Old 03-31-2018, 08:58 PM   #1
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Cool Towing with 2017 Audi Q7 tongue weight

Hi Airstream Fans,

Need some advice on towing tongue weight. The Audi Q7 2017
has a Tongue weight max of 770 Lbs. The Flying Cloud RB25 has a tongue weight
of 837 Lbs. Is the only thing I have to do is Move about 80 Lbs. to the rear
of the trailer. I was thinking moving the Spare thats 20Lbs and maybe the
batteries. That would certainly be at least 80 LBS.

As a novice just want to make sure I'm thinking right.

Silverbuckle
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Old 03-31-2018, 09:32 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverbuckle View Post
Hi Airstream Fans,

Need some advice on towing tongue weight. The Audi Q7 2017
has a Tongue weight max of 770 Lbs. The Flying Cloud RB25 has a tongue weight
of 837 Lbs. Is the only thing I have to do is Move about 80 Lbs. to the rear
of the trailer. I was thinking moving the Spare thats 20Lbs and maybe the
batteries. That would certainly be at least 80 LBS.

As a novice just want to make sure I'm thinking right.

Silverbuckle
Not an expert here but was exactly where you are at. Also had a Q7 when we happened upon our 25ft 750TW AS. Yes, it connects and daily driver stylish, hoped it all works, cause thatís what we already have /had. If youíre on flat easy driving...less of an issue. Hills, mountains, downhills, you may feel some concerns. In weeks, due to towing sustainabiltity Sold the much loved 1500 suburban, sold the Audi Q7 all for a better rated vehicle. (2014 GMC Sierra 1500, 5.3, 9600 Tow cap.). Even after yanking the 5300/6300 (wet) trailer on trips, wondered if we have enough....

Many opinions here but itís your safety overall
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Old 03-31-2018, 10:56 PM   #3
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First, there is a lot of info on how to tune the lashup for a German SUV. Do the research and figure this out for yourself. If you do not have the capability to do that, buy a Tow Vehicle with the capacities that cover your coach and payload when loaded out for travel.

The 25 mentioned above is an older coach. They weigh less. Your late model is likely close to 1000#s on the tongue. Switz did a lot of tuning to get a 25 in trim to tow with his Merc. Was not happy with the result and ended up with a big truck and a 30 when all was said and done.

Good luck with your investigation. Pat
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Old 03-31-2018, 11:03 PM   #4
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Use a weight distributing hitch. With proper set/up you can relocate about 30% of the tongue weight to the front tv axle and the trailer axles. Your challenge will be payload. Everybody/everything, including tongue weight all count towards your payload limit.
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Old 04-01-2018, 03:58 AM   #5
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Silver - Whatever you do make sure you weigh your tongue weight afterwards. It's non linear , I.e. Moving 80 lbs to the back doesn't translate into reduced tongue weight. I would not pull that trailer with a q7 personally (I had a 23 FB and a q7 and never would have felt comfortable towing it with the q7 for a bunch of reasons.
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Old 04-01-2018, 09:13 AM   #6
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Itís not about the ability of the Q7 to pull the trailer.
Itís about the ability to stop and resist the pull of an 18wheeler rushing by on a windy day.
To say nothing about what you do on an 8 degree hill when forced to slow down or even stop due to an accident ahead of you.
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Old 04-01-2018, 09:24 AM   #7
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Iíll chime in with this... Insurance companies/lawyers have become quite savvy. Any Exceedance of limitations will void your coverage.

The new mega truck campers and fifth wheel toy haulers are the biggest culprits. But your situation could easily be problematic.

As mentioned above, look at your sticker in the driver door jam. You payload includes the tongue weight.
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Old 04-01-2018, 09:56 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by troubadour1 View Post
-- snip -- Moving 80 lbs to the back doesn't translate into reduced tongue weight. -- snip --.
TR makes a point - Never use the teeter totter method to reduce tongue weight on any rig. Move weight to the center over the axles. Move weight lower in the coach. Leave heavier items at home. Use a lighter version when possible. Run with less fresh water and empty waste tanks. Run slower and smoother. Pat
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:25 AM   #9
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And that my friend, is why many of us have chosen pickups; payload and stability towing a 25' or longer AS makes the trip a whole lot less stressful. Unless you enjoy a challenge, and want to spend a bunch of money making your Q7 a TV, get yourself a better suited TV. Think about a generator, a bbq grill, firewood, gas can, lounge chairs, etc...do you want that stuff inside your TV? I went thru 2 new Tahoe's before I moved to my first PU; and F150 EB which did a great job pulling our last 2 25's AS's. World of difference, great to drive with or without the AS attached. Now we have the F250 with our 28', and it is much better suited for pulling, braking, and payload for this size AS.

There is a whole thread going on this Forum with different foreign SUV's contributing. Believe me, they are very proud and brave bunch of folks! if your so inclined, you should connect with them for sure, including Andy of CanAm who helps many with advise and service to get you set up properly...it's all just time and money. (just remember payload and the "other" gear you likely will want to bring along!)
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:26 AM   #10
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It's marginal.

Some have made it work with custom hitch reinforcements (Can-am RV). The stock hitch is not really built for this type of load, along with the weight distribution torsion forces of a larger trailer. You can brave it as others have, but you run the risk of hitch distortion and fatigue type failure over time. Along with the safety related risks of running over designed capacities.

Moving the weight to the rear is also questionable. You can do this to a degree, but part of the stability of a trailer is from having a measured portion of its mass as tongue weight. Weight behind the axle will only serve to reduce stability. If any mass is moved, best to put it over the axles.

Are you generally a weekend/short trip type camper, or are you going into this for full timing? That may steer you into the type of solution or compromise you're willing to live with.
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:34 AM   #11
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Tongue wt is about 837 lbs. before you add a Wt Distribution hitch and personal items in your Airstream. Our 25FB exceeds over 1000 when ready for the road, plus fun stuff in our truck like a generator, Weber grill, chairs, tools blocks of wood (for blocking up in the camp ground) and then there is fuel for our truck, dog and wife. We run close to our trucks 1500 hauling capacity when hitting the road. I think you are fighting a losing battle to travel safely in your vehicle.
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:58 AM   #12
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I recognize 837 as the Airstream specified tongue weight. It was what I use to spec my first tow vehicle. We have a FC25FB. It's tongue weight, ready to travel, is 1250 with an Andersen hitch (< 50 lbs.). I eventually traded my new F150 for a GMC 2500 because of the discrepancy.

I have observed here that the RB you interested in tends to be closer to the factory spec, but the comment about the weight of the hitch and cargo is well taken. But do not take the factory spec to the bank.

I know people who happily towed a FC25RB with an X5. They had the receiver strengthened in some way by Can Am. I would not recommend that and it would certainly be a red flag to an insurance adjustor.
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Old 04-01-2018, 11:43 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverbuckle View Post
Hi Airstream Fans,

Need some advice on towing tongue weight. The Audi Q7 2017
has a Tongue weight max of 770 Lbs. The Flying Cloud RB25 has a tongue weight
of 837 Lbs. Is the only thing I have to do is Move about 80 Lbs. to the rear
of the trailer. I was thinking moving the Spare thats 20Lbs and maybe the
batteries. That would certainly be at least 80 LBS.

As a novice just want to make sure I'm thinking right.

Silverbuckle
No problem! A few things to consider
  • Audi specifically calls out on page 94 of the new Q7 manual to "Never mount a weight-distributing or "load balancing" trailer coupler as the vehicle was not designed for it and can cause the hitch to break off", so that's out
  • Moving weight to the back of a trailer is generally a really bad idea, it's exactly the thing that causes trailer sway
  • Audi also notes that the capacity on pg 337 only applies under 3,200 feet, they note that the actual capacity above that is 10% less
  • Unless you weighed the trailer with all of your stuff in it + water the actual tongue weight will likely be ~900lbs

It's pretty safe to say that the trailer exceeds what the Q7 is rated to tow. Look at the Expedition, Suburban/Tahoe, or Big Nissan / Infi SUV's.

m
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Old 04-01-2018, 11:47 AM   #14
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20% margin or more

All this is good info to ponder. Often read that 20% safety margin (after loading everything up) would be a wise target. Already knocking on the door of full capacity or exceeding) = not safe and camping should be to relax and de-stress.

Donít think anyone would feel comfy getting in an aircraft loaded beyond rated capacity.

We will be the recipient of our own decisions.... so why not choose safe.
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Old 04-01-2018, 11:48 AM   #15
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Do not use a weight distribution hitch on a Q7

I have a 2018 Q7 and a 2014 25 FB FC. The Q7 manual stresses to NOT use a weight distribution hitch. The vehicle is not designed to handle more weight on the front axel. Unfortunately the selling dealer did not know this and I discovered it after the 4000 mile trip began

Power is no problem, but horrible even dangerous handling. Also the Q7 electronics go haywire when towing the AS.

I ordered a new RAM 2500 and now use the Q7 for going to the grocery store.
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Old 04-01-2018, 11:50 AM   #16
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Great vehivle but....

I agree with above, marginal, mountains, or big hills will be an issue. I looked at the older Q7 with the 4.2 V8, but decided on a 2500 HD GMC Sierra, love it, out west and back, Rockies, didn't even notice... now it's not a daily driver, weekends etc... so we have that luxury. Can am here in Ont can set it up for you, and recommends the Chrysler 300 Hemi, low centre of grav etc... but then he camps with a set of golf clubs in the back. For us it'll be chain saw, extra gas, tools, etc.... so the car/SUV was not really practical when we thought about the long term. Also, was going down onto the Skeena River to do a bit of fishing and was happy I had the extra clearance of the 4x4....
Having said that, ove the Audi, have an A4 myself. Enjoy the camping !!!!
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Old 04-01-2018, 01:32 PM   #17
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Rather than say that you can or cannot set up your Q7 for your 25' AS - I'd suggest that you do 2 things Silverbuckle:

Go read through the topic on Tauoreg/Q7/Cayenne below & contact other Q7 owners on there:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...rs-134917.html

And also contact Andy Thompson at CanAm RV to talk about what can & cannot be done:

http://www.canamrv.ca/

There is also a lot of misinformation about the use of weight distributing hitches on Euro SUVs, because they are not allowed by law in Europe since the 1960's, when their Euro & UK lightweight trailer manufacturers lobbied their governments to outlaw them so that the then numerous USA trailer mfgrs. couldn't threatened their businesses. Ergo, it was a non-tariff way of protectionism enacted into their laws & still is today.

Most of the manufacturers there don't bother to change the language in their manuals on WD for the USA & Canada - where WD is expected on any TV. However, if you look at the sticker on your Audi factory receiver, you should see both load bearing & WD ratings (or they used to do so up to 2016).

I'm surprised to see that Audi has added such strong anti-towing language to their 2018 manuals (& `17 ?), as that combined with no longer offering TDI & V8 options make them more of just another kid-hauler (albeit nicer than most), rather than the all around SUV it used to be touted as!

Keep in mind that the longer 3-row Q7 loses some towing & GVWR & GCVWR capacity due to the added weight of that added length/row, so they're rated lower than their corporate cousins Cayenne & Touareg.

Also the gas V6 may be able to tow it by spec, but the droning of higher revs on long trips, grades, headwinds, etc. - as well as less throttle response in merging, passing, & emergency etc. maneuvers, & slower on steep & long grades.

Good Luck!
Tom
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Old 04-01-2018, 03:56 PM   #18
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I'm surprised to see that Audi has added such strong anti-towing language to their 2018 manuals (& `17 ?), as that combined with no longer offering TDI & V8 options make them more of just another kid-hauler (albeit nicer than most), rather than the all around SUV it used to be touted as!
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Old 04-01-2018, 04:12 PM   #19
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I’ve said it before and I will say it again a tow vehicle should be made/manufactured to tow not Forced/Begged to. The Q7 is not a vehicle that should tow that trailer. Dry weight and ready to camp weight are two different things.
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Old 04-01-2018, 04:36 PM   #20
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Just completed our 6,000km inaugural trip pulling a 2018 FC 25 FB with our 2014 Touareg diesel. WD hitch, 2 sway bars, setup by CanAm. We are careful with loading the AS and the Treg. Handling, fuel economy while towing was excellent. Can’t really speak to a gas Q7, but our specs are similar. That said when it comes time to say goodbye to the Treg I will consider a light truck provided the truck safety specs and fuel mileage improves. The gap appears to be closing.
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