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Old 03-02-2017, 11:36 AM   #1
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Too high or too low

From my previous post of "intentional over weight", renting a truck was the best outcome of the thread.

I have contacted Enterprise and made a reservation for an F250.

Not knowing exactly what I'll be getting begs the question:

When I get the truck and use my hitch, after adjusting the height, assume for the moment, the outcome is either too high where my tongue is higher or too low (unlikely) to being level, which would of the two be better?

Yes I understand being level is best, but since I have time to research, I am asking now before hand so I'll know relatively what to do or look for.
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Old 03-02-2017, 11:48 AM   #2
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Once you have hitched up and connected your WD bars, if you cannot nail a level setup by adjusting the hitch head on the shank it is best to have the tongue be slightly lower than the tail end of the trailer (nose down). The delta between front and back of the trailer should be < 1".

Make sure you take measurements on a level concrete pad somewhere. If you do this in the front of your house on the asphalt you will not get accurate results due to variations in the road surface.
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Old 03-02-2017, 02:36 PM   #3
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Sorry I don't have an answer for your question, but I am curious if your Enterprise F250 comes with a built-in brake controller? We lost our tow vehicle over the winter and would also like to rent one on a short-term basis. Thanks.
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Old 03-02-2017, 02:55 PM   #4
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I vaguely remember something about the hitch height being 19 inches.
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Old 03-02-2017, 03:04 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by OTRA15 View Post
Sorry I don't have an answer for your question, but I am curious if your Enterprise F250 comes with a built-in brake controller? We lost our tow vehicle over the winter and would also like to rent one on a short-term basis. Thanks.
I just called and they said yes.
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Old 03-02-2017, 03:05 PM   #6
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Once you have hitched up and connected your WD bars, if you cannot nail a level setup by adjusting the hitch head on the shank it is best to have the tongue be slightly lower than the tail end of the trailer (nose down). The delta between front and back of the trailer should be < 1".

Make sure you take measurements on a level concrete pad somewhere. If you do this in the front of your house on the asphalt you will not get accurate results due to variations in the road surface.
can you let me know Pros and Cons for either too high or low?
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Old 03-02-2017, 03:08 PM   #7
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Thanks. BTW the F250 could probably tow your 19' just fine without WD on the average highway -- in my opinion. Ditto for a longer AS up to about 25' for short-term medium speed trips IMO.

Please let us know how you make out with the rental process and towing.

Thanks,

Peter

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I just called and they said yes.
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Old 03-02-2017, 03:09 PM   #8
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But I'm in SoCal for the Van Nuys location, I would double check with your local branch.
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Old 03-03-2017, 12:44 PM   #9
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But I'm in SoCal for the Van Nuys location, I would double check with your local branch.
Hey Caz,

Speaking from 4 years experience renting truck TVs - you need to be renting from Enterprise Commercial in order to be allowed to tow, since ALL car rental companies' contracts now explicitly prohibit towing, & you'll be on the hook 100% - even with your own or their insurance, since you'd be in violation of the contract.

FYI for others reading here - Only the commercial truck rentals are now allowing towing - Enterprise Commercial is the best with trucks equipped with 7-pin electrical connectors, U-Haul mostly/only have 4-pin connectors since their trailers use surge brakes (i.e.: you can't use your trailer brakes), Penske has no tow equipped pick-ups last I checked (only big box trailers), Hertz & the other Commercial Rentals are a royal PITA & require you to set them up on your business insurance with really high $1mm/$3mm Umbrella coverage. Enterprise Comm'l. lets you just add on their insurance per rental for the coverage (i.e.: they won't accept your AAA or other auto insurance on rentals), so it currently runs me $131/day on a week rental, or $159/day daily rental less than a week including their DW & SLP insurance (truck itself is $99/day or $500/wk).

So if not with E.C. - then cancel that & call/go Ent. Comml. & then set up a business account with them if you're self-employed/own company & redo the rental, as it will make things much easier for you to tow.

Try to get the F250 with the back-up camera, as the RAM 2500 is 3-6" higher at the receiver. I've not rented their new 2017 aluminum bodied F250 yet, but I think the receivers are still at the same ht. as before (my next rental is mid- March, so I'll see then).

The guys at my Orange CA E.C. location will try to nab a F250 with back-up cam for me & hold it, if available at the time - just need to remind them to do so - & Van Nuys E.C. would do so for you I'd guess.

You can measure your ball ht. when level on the trailer at home, then take your hitch bar over to E.C. insert & measure the height. If it's too high or low, then you can get an adjustable one in advance at any store with tow gear (Auto Parts stores, Walmart, Uhaul, Harbor Freight, etc.) or from etrailer.com etc. online. If you have a Hensley hitch, then you'll need to order a 4" drop stinger bar ASAP - assuming the F250 is still at the same ht. (Pro-Pride sells their own adjustable stinger for theirs, but Hensley doesn't recco them on their hitches nor cover them under Hensley's lifetime warranty).

In any case, with the super heavy duty F250's suspension - don't expect any/much rear end drop on the truck when hitched. My 1960 Avion T20 is about 2/3s or so less than your Bambi at 3000-3500 lbs., & the F250 doesn't even know it's back there! About 17 mpg with or without the Avion, & zero droop - the WD is more for effect of evening the weight on all 3 axles!

Yes - E.C.'s truck do have brake controllers, & I think the new 2017s still require you to use a 2.5" or 3" to 2" sleeve in the receiver - so make sure to ask for one when you pick up the truck for the trip to save the trip back there!

Good news is now you can put your bikes, generator, etc. in the bed of the truck - instead of in or on the back of your Bambi!

Just get some ratchet style tie downs, a cargo net, & blue/silver tarp to put over them (moving blankets under/between/on top - if you worry about scratching the bikes laying them down in the bed). Also make sure to park where you can watch the truck, when stopping for fuel, meals, potty, etc. with your kids.

Safe Travels & Have Fun!
Tom
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Old 03-03-2017, 02:38 PM   #10
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Thanks. BTW the F250 could probably tow your 19' just fine without WD on the average highway -- in my opinion. Ditto for a longer AS up to about 25' for short-term medium speed trips IMO. Peter
Ditto, Peter. I seriously doubt that Enterprise has WD hitches anyway. You will have to supply your own ball mount and ball. You want the bottom edge of the ball mount to be no more than 17" above ground with the trailer connected. After checking the correct ball size for your trailer (2-5/16, I think) buy a ball mount and ball at an auto supply store. There are expensive adjustable height ball mounts, but my suggestion is to buy mounts with both a 2" and 4" drop. My guess is the 2" drop will work, but you can always return the one that doesn't give you a level stance.
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Old 03-03-2017, 06:28 PM   #11
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Good stuff here...but to answer your original question, you want the tongue a little low not high.

It's better perfectly level but not always possible...so lower in front if not level is best. Not a bunch low but a little is fine.
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:01 PM   #12
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I vaguely remember something about the hitch height being 19 inches.
It could be good starting point but it depends a great deal on the tongue weight and the TV suspention. And of course the lift the WD engaged will exert on the whole assy. Expect to have to adjust after the initial setup.
Before tightening the bolts, lower the toungue on the ball and measure how much the rear settles and compensate accordingly. An aggressive WD setting will lift the rear aprox .5".
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Old 03-03-2017, 08:52 PM   #13
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snip>> it is best to have the tongue be slightly lower than the tail end of the trailer (nose down). << snip.
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snip>>, you want the tongue a little low not high.

It's better perfectly level but not always possible...so lower in front if not level is best. Not a bunch low but a little is fine.


Would you please explain why you have this opinion, or provide a source for the information?

I've always heard it is better for the tongue to be slightly higher than slightly lower, if level cannot be accomplished.

I know level does not make as much difference on a single axel trailer.

It seems to me if the tongue is low, the front axel of a multi-axel trailer would be carrying more weight than the rear axle, shifting the center of gravity forward. More weight behind the center of gravity creates a higher tendency for sway. A high tongue would shift the center of gravity toward the rear, the rear axel with more weight, having less tendency to sway.

The only advantage I can see if the tongue is low is that it would decrease tongue weight slightly, since more weight would be behind the center of gravity.
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Old 03-03-2017, 09:00 PM   #14
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Too high or too low

Tongue higher shifts weight to the trailer axles, hence reducing tongue weight, hence increasing the likelihood of sway.

Tongue lower increases tongue weigh at the ball and helps reduce the likelihood of sway.



...and...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f48/...ec-153984.html

...are good examples of physics at play.
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