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Old 09-20-2017, 07:36 AM   #43
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5963 pounds = 2704.771 kilograms
6005 pounds = 2723.822 kg

2700 kg = 5952.481 pounds

Can't find any round numbers, except the one I made up.
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Old 09-20-2017, 07:39 AM   #44
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So, with the new info and beginning research, I stumbled across this bit, which seems reasonable, that BMW uses a standard sticker to cover all options possibly included and some vehicles may have more payload but none should ever exceed the sticker as built. The different GVWR seems to only be two different numbers depending on whether the rear suspension is air or not, not different for every trim level.
That is mixing the X3 and the X5. I have an X3 now. I sold my E53 X5. That is the one that had 6005 lbs GVWR. The new F15 X5 is the one I researched payload on. It is the one that comes with an optional third row seat, and various suspension options (one axle air, two axle air, dynamic suspension, etc). I used the factory parts books and rear spring specs.
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Old 09-20-2017, 07:44 AM   #45
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5963 pounds = 2704.771 kilograms

2700 kg = 5952.481 pounds
If you would like to do the reverse calculations and see if any particular spec published with an odd number for the US market is that way due to translation, just look up the same vehicle on a website that doesn't use lbs, ie the rest of the world. For BMW, look at .ca, .de, .com, etc, just not BMWUSA.com.
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Old 09-20-2017, 07:49 AM   #46
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Weight is weight. Rated capacities are (legal) limits.
For an axle rating, as one example, sure. See the FMVSS publications where that weight rating is defined.

Now find a legal definition of GCVWR, or tow rating, that is applicable to other than commercial carriers. Search on DOT and FMVSS to start.
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Old 09-20-2017, 01:47 PM   #47
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I actually would like to read it, it as requested, just point me in the right direction to begin the research on the internet (manufacturer information not forum input) I'm more than happy to do the research.

...Your post intrigued me, and I asked for clarification, because if actually true because it goes against everything I've researched
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Originally Posted by RandyNH View Post
The different GVWR seems to only be two different numbers depending on whether the rear suspension is air or not, not different for every trim level.
Still travelling, with only an iPad, but the following links should help your research.

https://www.bmw.com/en/all-models/x-...nce.html#tab-0

This is the global BMW manufacturer's site, not the BMWUSA marketing organization site. Scroll down to tech data. See the menu for vehicle config, from the 35i to 35d, with the 50i and 40e hybrid thrown in for good measure. The Euro only models are shown as well. Maximum weight, GVWR, is listed for each variation of the same vehicle.

I see eight different GVWRs, with all but one sport model having the same payload.

Now check out the Canadian site.

https://www.bmw.ca/en/all-models/x-s...ecs.html#tab-0

I see seven different GVWRs, due to engine variations and number of rows of seating. Payload isn't shown on this chart, and the actual figures vary from the global figures because BMW ca includes 90% fuel, a driver, and a briefcase, or at least some type of luggage that only weighs 7 kg.

But the point remains, that it is the GVWR that is varying. BMW does their engineering in Europe, but only builds this vehicle in the US, for the global market. There are differences in spring rates, and details like options, but the basic vehicle is the same.

So, if GVWR was some sort of maximum figure beyond which things would start breaking, how to explain the variability? Perhaps we could agree that GVWR matters, but to consider it as having the sort of significance that many place on it just doesn't compute. At least for this example. Now some will say that this isn't a typical tow vehicle. Fair enough. Maybe it is only North American pickups that are sold with specs so close to their design limits.
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Old 09-20-2017, 06:27 PM   #48
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I still respectfully disagree.

Weight is weight. Rated capacities are (legal) limits.

Thanks for the kind words.
What weight? Where?

Payload & Towing as Legal limits ? Nope. Zero. Nada.

You want a better set-up get a TARE weight for that TV of yours (as above). Start a thread. And on another day utilize the three-pass scale method for WD (after first roughing it in at home using A. Thomsons directions). And some profile pics while the rig is on the scale during the first (WD tensioned) pass. Then of the hitch between the vehicles. Examples on this forum. How help works.

And in those trips some work on TV tire pressures. According to Load. Ask.

Then maybe you'll figure out respect is two way. Your better rig and the record of how it was done is part of that. Not to mention that in having a numerical baseline, future diagnosis of problems is far simpler.

And you'll be part of a larger solution. Despite using a farm vehicle for a TV. It really matters getting a pickup right. It's the weak link. Will roll before the trailer. Will be the cause of an accident. Before the trailer is even ruffled.

Numbers acquired are the basis of confidence. The starting point.

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Old 09-21-2017, 05:18 AM   #49
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Still travelling, with only an iPad, but the following links should help your research.

https://www.bmw.com/en/all-models/x-...nce.html#tab-0
Thanks. It appears that they have a "max" GVWR that they work from and then reduce it from that point, based on suspension and wheels, each of the axle weight ratings also fluctuate with the GVWR, the easiest thing to notice is that actual rim size is smaller with the lower ratings, which would make sense as smaller volume equals lower capacity. They also state that MAX permissable for almost all is 715Kg, which appears will differ from what real world sticker will be (and as here) which is pretty much the same as here, BMWUSA had a spec that MAX payload was 1565 lbs (something close) again the ability to go down and a 400 lb fluctuating GVWR.
So all-in-all pretty much the same for varying locations, just presented differently.
It is interesting that the European specs are so much more readily available and completely listed whereas here they are difficult to find.
The F-series trucks work the same, look at Ford's towing chart there are like 6 different GVWRs depending on what tire size and setup is spec'd
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Old 09-21-2017, 08:43 AM   #50
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Thanks. It appears that they have a "max" GVWR that they work from and then reduce it from that point, based on suspension and wheels, each of the axle weight ratings also fluctuate with the GVWR, the easiest thing to notice is that actual rim size is smaller with the lower ratings, which would make sense as smaller volume equals lower capacity. They also state that MAX permissable for almost all is 715Kg, which appears will differ from what real world sticker will be (and as here) which is pretty much the same as here, BMWUSA had a spec that MAX payload was 1565 lbs (something close) again the ability to go down and a 400 lb fluctuating GVWR.
So all-in-all pretty much the same for varying locations, just presented differently.
It is interesting that the European specs are so much more readily available and completely listed whereas here they are difficult to find.
The F-series trucks work the same, look at Ford's towing chart there are like 6 different GVWRs depending on what tire size and setup is spec'd
The heavier GVWR are generally with the larger engines, which have the larger rims with sport tires. It is for cornering and looks, not load capacity.

The axles are generally the same, it is the coil springs which vary. I replaced two, and they had to be ordered by serial number due to the spec.

They state max payload, but my own vehicle had a door jamb sticker with full spec payload, but a higher GVWR due to installed options. This is not how pickups work. You purchase a standard or optionally higher GVWR and then options reduce payload.

So the example demonstrates the point that the vehicle doesn't have a single max GVWR, but rather a label of convenience.
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Old 09-21-2017, 08:46 AM   #51
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I drive a 2004 Suburban, the 1500 level, not the heavy duty, and I'm trying to figure out what the payload might be.

Here's the sticker ... I'm sure payload is hidden there, somewhere, but a mystery to me.

Can any decipher the code?
I drive a 2000 Suburban 1500 LS with the 5.3 engine. My sticker has the same Gross vehicle weight rating and axle ratings as yours does.

The stated payload from chevy for mine is 1820lbs. Trips to the scales land me in about the same region give or take a bit.

Practically for me that means I can fill the fuel tank (32gal. ish) and have two adults and 4 children under 10 in the truck along with maybe 100-150lbs of misc cargo spread out across the whole cabin area and my camper's tongue weight (with WD hitch) and I'm just under the maximum ratings for the axles and GVWR. My camper is a '76 23ft Safari with a factory stated tongue weight of 580 lbs... though its not factory spec'd anymore and I don't have an exact read yet on the camper's real tongue weight since some renovations are in progress.

Like others have said though use the CAT scales to verify and have them be deciding factor.
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Old 09-21-2017, 11:58 AM   #52
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Like others have said though use the CAT scales to verify and have them be deciding factor.
No truer words were ever spoken.
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Old 09-21-2017, 12:14 PM   #53
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Hey, inthewoods ... where did you find the "stated payload?"

I can't even find the weight of my Suburban on any stickers or in the owner's manual. If I knew that, at least I could do the math and get a usable figure.

I'll get to a CAT scale when I can find one and weigh each axle.
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Old 09-21-2017, 09:42 PM   #54
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Hey, inthewoods ... where did you find the "stated payload?"

Well I thought 1820 was the number but didnít have my notes handy when I posted earlier. So I looked again 1820lbs was the payload I figured I had available based on weighing the truck one time. Like yours my manual doesnít state payload. All it says is what others have posted. Read the axle ratings from the door sticker and then weigh the truck compare the two numbers and you have your answer.

I compared the scale weights to various online sources where they state a payload in specs for the truck. The sources all vary a bit so I donít hold any one to be totally trustworthy but they do help give me ballparks and a reference to compare my weigh in too. For my truck and trim level, I see figures anywhere from 1880lbs to 2090lbs give or take a bit. Iím in the ballpark so Iíve got around 1800-1900lbs available to me. One of these days when my gas tank is near empty and no one else is In the truck Iíll get a firm set of weights for the suburban so I have a clear limit to go by.
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Old 09-21-2017, 09:48 PM   #55
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I'll get to a CAT scale when I can find one and weigh each axle.

Oh and Iím not sure about your area but I usually weigh my rig for free at the commercial scales on the highway. Thereís a set of basic transport scales about 12miles from my house on a smaller regional highway and they are on 24/7 with no staff watching it so I just pull in there and roll across the scales and get my weights.
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Old 09-22-2017, 07:02 AM   #56
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I don't think you can use the state's highway scales here in Florida, inthewoods, but I'll check with The DOT office to see. Be great if I can.

If I've got anything close to 1,800 pounds payload, then I'm good to go.

That would give us plenty of margin after factoring in tongue weight, gas and two adults.

Helps, too, that we travel light.

I may get a chance to hit a CAT scale at a Pilot gas-and-go next weekend.
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