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Old 07-11-2019, 07:10 AM   #57
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JMorgan, since you are an experienced trucker, under what load are the rear axles when itís most likely to jackknife?


https://youtu.be/3nGQLQF1b6I
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:18 AM   #58
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Perfect!
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:27 AM   #59
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Stand up and take your chance.

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Originally Posted by J. Morgan View Post

A jackknife is almost always caused when the rear axle(s) of the tow vehicle lose traction.

With that said, making the rear axle of the tow vehicle lighter than it needs to be can in general set a combination up for a jackknife.


Further, contrary to what many people think, sway has very little to do with the tow vehicle except that on combinations that tend to sway, the hitch center is almost always well behind the tow vehicles rear axle center.

Sway always starts with the trailer moving out of line of the tow vehicle track, this misalignment becomes magnified when the this misalignment acts upon the end of the leverage point of the hitch ball setting up the conditions for oscillations to begin.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:08 AM   #60
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I agree that when you remove weight off the rear axle you reduce traction. So once a trailer starts to sway and the tires can no longer hold the rig will jackknife. So a rig with less weight on the rear axle will jackknife sooner than one with more weight. The rig with more weight has a better chance to come out of a sway event should it happen or handle higher lateral acceleration before jackknifing. My god what a revelation!
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:17 AM   #61
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Here is a little video for ya. Since we are all speculating.

Probability of improper loading of trailer and driver error (tow vehicle driver) is more likely the contributing factors.
my .02

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Old 07-11-2019, 08:24 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Profxd View Post
I agree that when you remove weight off the rear axle you reduce traction. So once a trailer starts to sway and the tires can no longer hold the rig will jackknife. So a rig with less weight on the rear axle will jackknife sooner than one with more weight. The rig with more weight has a better chance to come out of a sway event should it happen or handle higher lateral acceleration before jackknifing. My god what a revelation!
I guess I'm confused. More tongue weight, better. more weight in the rear of trailer, bad. Don't get confused, It has nothing to do with rear axle. 10%-15% of the trailer weight should be forward of the axle(s)....
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:24 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by Profxd View Post
I agree that when you remove weight off the rear axle you reduce traction. So once a trailer starts to sway and the tires can no longer hold the rig will jackknife. So a rig with less weight on the rear axle will jackknife sooner than one with more weight. The rig with more weight has a better chance to come out of a sway event should it happen or handle higher lateral acceleration before jackknifing. My god what a revelation!


Yeah, and still none of the dozen or so trailers I have designed and had built have jackknifed. Imagine that.

I was blessed with a natural understanding of how things work, (that's just how it is), the hard part is putting it into words for people who don't have that understanding in a way where they won't make fools of themselves while trying to prove how smart they are.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:26 AM   #64
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Here is a little video for ya. Since we are all speculating.



Probability of improper loading of trailer and driver error (tow vehicle driver) is more likely the contributing factors.

my .02



-Dennis


Where did the sway start?

With the trailer perhaps?
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:36 AM   #65
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Stand up and take your chance.

there are in general two kinds of simple mindedness regarding this subject.

1. "Whatever a person might cobble together will work just fine".

and

2. "There is only one way to do it right".

Results matter the most.
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:42 PM   #66
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After reading this post and several more like it, I have reached the conclusion that pulling an Airstream with anything less than a Diesel 250/350/450 2500/3500/4500 (with the 250/2500 being on the ragged edge) is certain death!!!

Furthermore, I have learned that any attempt to tow one without a ________ weight distribution hitch with sway control it will certainly kill you in the first few miles.

I had no idea Airstreams are this dangerous when I ordered one!!!

I actually was naive enough to believe that an Airstream would tow slightly better than the many other type of travel trailers that I have towed over the years. I have decided to cancel my order for the 2020 19cb Caravel. I was even going to tow it with my 2019 Ford Ranger. I would like to thank everyone for saving me from certain death.

(For those that do not get it that was sarcasm)
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Old 07-11-2019, 04:12 PM   #67
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Sranger, that was most fantastic!!!

5 posts in and you've got if figured out. Good sense of humor is helpful when reading any social media and this forum.

Between all the opinions, editorials, my beliefs, I only do it this way, my way or the highway, know it alls, grumpy whatever age folks there are the best intentioned most helpful group of Airstream enthusiast's with lots of skills and super helpful.
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Old 07-11-2019, 04:57 PM   #68
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Sranger, that was most fantastic!!!

5 posts in and you've got if figured out. Good sense of humor is helpful when reading any social media and this forum.

Between all the opinions, editorials, my beliefs, I only do it this way, my way or the highway, know it alls, grumpy whatever age folks there are the best intentioned most helpful group of Airstream enthusiast's with lots of skills and super helpful.
Thx,

I have been on social media forums since the Wildcat BBS days before the internet even existed. You have to have a bit of a thick skin to participate. I also understand that not everyone will appreciate my rather cynical (old grumpy engineer) sense of humor.

For the record, I have read many post here with excellent advise from obviously knowledgable people and I do appreciate their efforts.
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Old 07-11-2019, 05:20 PM   #69
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Us cynical, grumpy, old engineers are still quite capable of contributing to the font of knowledge hereabouts.

A sense of humor is always welcome, since I for one used to be young and crazy, and I am now no longer young.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:56 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post
After reading this post and several more like it, I have reached the conclusion that pulling an Airstream with anything less than a Diesel 250/350/450 2500/3500/4500 (with the 250/2500 being on the ragged edge) is certain death!!!

Furthermore, I have learned that any attempt to tow one without a ________ weight distribution hitch with sway control it will certainly kill you in the first few miles.

I had no idea Airstreams are this dangerous when I ordered one!!!

I actually was naive enough to believe that an Airstream would tow slightly better than the many other type of travel trailers that I have towed over the years. I have decided to cancel my order for the 2020 19cb Caravel. I was even going to tow it with my 2019 Ford Ranger. I would like to thank everyone for saving me from certain death.

(For those that do not get it that was sarcasm)
Sarcasm or not, you have captured the essence of this discussion and everyone like it.
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