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Old 07-04-2014, 05:58 PM   #29
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Well I may be a little over what the book says but the dealer told me that my car could tow anything!

My tongue weight is 980 lbs with LP (CAT) trailer weight is 5050 empty (25')

The 45' Palacaide model in my avatar? Well it'll take down any 1/2 ton!
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Old 07-04-2014, 06:01 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post

EXACTLY! In your hypothetical case, your AS tongue weight is actually 955#s..and you comply with AS spec. Some might not see the sense in this, but I like you went over 1000# when I added my bikes and Arvika rack. I had some serious recalculating and shuffling of gear to get back to 950#.

If you added the stinger weight to what you measured at 1080...then you'd have actual receiver weight. In my case, I have RockTamers in the figure as well.
Yes the stinger was in the receiver and connected to the trailer.

I'm going to back to your explanation and see if I can see WHY you've isolated certain parts to the receiver vs tongue. Since so much of the PP sits on the tongue, it's hard to understand why portions of that weight aren't pushing down on the ball...I couldn't feel more dense right now :-)
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Old 07-04-2014, 06:02 PM   #31
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If you think about the setup of the ProPride the actual trailer tongue is simply setting on the Ball that is part of the ProPride. So if you know the weight of the ProPride Head with all of its components (maybe Shawn could tell us) then easy from from the CAT scale Ron weighing method and the spreadsheet that I have out there someplace on the forum to take the calculated 'tongue weight', subtract the PP hardware and get pretty close to the weight of a naked tongue.
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Old 07-04-2014, 06:04 PM   #32
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subtract the PP hardware and get pretty close to the weight of a naked tongue.
I can probably tell the pro pride hitch weight you since I have weights of my pre- propride and with propride. I just have to find the older CAT scale printouts.

Just looked, it is at the trailer. Will have to post later.
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Old 07-04-2014, 06:20 PM   #33
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Based on this photo of my setup, what parts of the PP don't count toward tongue weight? Even though some portion of it extends beyond the coupler/ball (toward the TV), it's all bolted on the a-frame/tongue.

Sorry to be this slow - I get that we're saying some weight sits "on the ball" and some "in the receiver" - I'm just not seeing where and WHY those distinctions are made.

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Old 07-04-2014, 06:23 PM   #34
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what parts of the PP don't count toward tongue weight?
Good question to pose SteveSueMac, the hitch is always counted in the tongue weight as per my trusty 4th edition of RV Handbook. It is payload.
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Old 07-04-2014, 07:14 PM   #35
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Good question to pose SteveSueMac, the hitch is always counted in the tongue weight as per my trusty 4th edition of RV Handbook. It is payload.
Yes it is part of payload, but when parsing an AS tongue max and a receiver max it is important to each respective spec. When everybody had 50lb hitches the phrase tongue weight was used by receiver manufacturers and trailer manufacturers as one and the same....who cares about 50lbs. It's within the engineering tolerance margin...probably. But then along comes 200 lb hitches and it becomes an issue...thats 20% of a class 4 receiver capacity...it's significant. So we need to be talking about tongue weight and receiver weight separately...at least those of us with big arse hitches and big arse mudflaps hanging back there.
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Old 07-04-2014, 07:20 PM   #36
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Apologies to the OP - I'm afraid my density has caused me to hijack your thread. Perhaps the mods could help us re-establish a "what is tongue weight" thread - or even move these parts to the Unofficial PP User Guide so the OP can keep collecting the data he's looking for.

Apologies for the hijack!
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Old 07-04-2014, 07:21 PM   #37
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Based on this photo of my setup, what parts of the PP don't count toward tongue weight? Even though some portion of it extends beyond the coupler/ball (toward the TV), it's all bolted on the a-frame/tongue.

Sorry to be this slow - I get that we're saying some weight sits "on the ball" and some "in the receiver" - I'm just not seeing where and WHY those distinctions are made.

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Ok, imagine your stinger is in the receiver AND the box/head are attached to the stinger BUT you were unhitched from the ball at the coupler and the coupler was just behind the ball. Also imagine the struts in HAHA case and the spring bars, (and the chains and umbilical, if you really want to get picky) magically stretched so they were still connected to the tongue and the head.
All of the weight of the head/box are on the receiver--none on the tongue.
since the struts and spring bars are bridging and are suspended by both the tongue and the head--it is a percentage split of weight shared between the two, I swag it at 50-50. All of the jacks and bracketry are still on the tongue and all part of tongue weight. I'll look at pic and parse it for PP since you don't have struts.
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Old 07-04-2014, 07:24 PM   #38
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Boy, having a bit of trouble with your pic, but I think, from memory, almost all of your yoke weight would be tongue weight...maybe 5 - 10lbs would be receiver weight.
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Old 07-04-2014, 08:31 PM   #39
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Last weight trip had 3500lb on the axles and did the bathroom scale method today and have 525lb on the tongue with empty water tank and 675lb with full tank.
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Old 07-04-2014, 08:33 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by dznf0g View Post

Ok, imagine your stinger is in the receiver AND the box/head are attached to the stinger BUT you were unhitched from the ball at the coupler and the coupler was just behind the ball. Also imagine the struts in HAHA case and the spring bars, (and the chains and umbilical, if you really want to get picky) magically stretched so they were still connected to the tongue and the head.
All of the weight of the head/box are on the receiver--none on the tongue.
...snip...
Ok, that's starting to make sense a bit - at least, I think I can envision what you're saying. In that "exploded" view, that absolutely makes sense. But when I "re-bolt" the unit to the a-frame in my head, I don't see how those components still apply only to the receiver and aren't added to the tongue. I see for sure that they are always included in the weight on the receiver - just not seeing how they don't ALSO contribute to the weight on the tongue.

Thanks for being patient - I really wish I was getting this!
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Old 07-04-2014, 08:42 PM   #41
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Ok, that's starting to make sense a bit - at least, I think I can envision what you're saying. In that "exploded" view, that absolutely makes sense. But when I "re-bolt" the unit to the a-frame in my head, I don't see how those components still apply only to the receiver and aren't added to the tongue. I see for sure that they are always included in the weight on the receiver - just not seeing how they don't ALSO contribute to the weight on the tongue.

Thanks for being patient - I really wish I was getting this!
In essence the stinger and the head/box are resting on the receiver and the tongue coupler is resting on the head/box (ball). Tongue weight = the weight resting on the ball.
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Old 07-04-2014, 08:59 PM   #42
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Rich, thanks for the excellent explanations. Always a confusing question.

For the o.p. (and the rest of us) to get any meaningful data, we need a standard for weighing. That is, with or without hitch head and/or stinger, as well as setting the scale at the same position on the tongue. Some place the scale under the tongue jack, some under the ball coupler, with will result in different weight readings on the same trailer. The trailer must also be level.
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