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Old 06-29-2016, 05:51 PM   #113
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PSS on Yakima Swing Daddy etc. bike racks -

Bottom line - you can't use the Yakima Swing Daddy on the back of your trailers ....

... but it will work great on the back of the self-powered RVs & Class B Van Campers/RVs, your regular Cars/Vans/SUVs/CUVs etc. for better rear hatch/door or trunk access & clearance, on your TVs when not hitched (or maybe with one of those over-under double receivers when hitched - but then you may have more than ideal distance hitch to TV-rear-wheels that Andy T. talks about).

Note that the Swing Daddy is not an inexpensive rack, nor are the AS & Fiamma racks either!

Cheers!
Tom
///////
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Old 06-29-2016, 06:59 PM   #114
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Additional information about PDF file on Traverse FC23FB rig

Quote:
Originally Posted by OTRA15 View Post
Yes, you are right. It would also be helpful IMO to know, however, what the actual tongue weight is before WD hook-up, just to make sure that the trailer is loaded within AS specs.

In the case of the OP here, knowing the tongue weight before and after loading would seem to be a very important data point to have.

Thanks,

Peter
The PDF file refers to my rig that I have since 2011. You are right about the absence of tongue weight information. I do not have this info. At the moment that I take measurements, I do not unhitch my travel trailer on the balance. But for your information, I do not fill fresh water in my TT when I leaving home; this is the case on these measurements. Also note: the two 30 lbs. propane tanks was full when I was on balance with my rig.
This set up was perform by CanAm (Andy Thomson) from London, Ontario, Canada and I am totally satisfied of it! Great job...
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Old 06-30-2016, 12:37 AM   #115
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Thank you all for caring and continue to give me insights.

AVDESIGN, I appreciate your encouragement. I was fortunate enough when I was a young lad that I had great mentors to teach me the ways of the world in my industry (Audio/Video) and in life. Imagine when I was 20 running a crew of 6 to 10 guys who were at least 10 to 15+ older than me in another state and sometimes in another country. Talk about learning LIFE quick! That is how I am able to take brutal honesty, sort through the say'ers and do'ers with a smile on my face.

There is/are ALWAYS a solution. Trial and Error is one way to find out. However, in my case, this was too dangerous to do trial and error without any insights.

Through this forum, I have received many many insights. I can tell by the responses if they are do'ers or just say'ers. I'm not saying neight is wrong or right. Any insight to help my problem is welcome.

For me, I am a do'er.

AVDESIGN, you must be of age to know what a "sparky" is.

One of the things I will "try" to do is find someone to cut my bike mount so it can go closer to the frame and redrill the holes for the locking pin. My next trip is not until Sept 2016, so I have a little time to do some research.

For those of you worried about me being a weapon, I will be leaving last weekend of Sept, around 11a. I am should be on the 101N heading to Morro Bay.

My sway bar already arrived.

I even looked at one of the suggestion which was to put the hitch in front of the TV, I saw some great pictures. The wife was opposed it since it would block my view. Also, the way the Traverse front is, I don't think it would look good in the process.

For the moment, my solution is:
1. One bike in the back (I am very temped to try two, but one I know will work)
2. I'm gonna try to get the mount shank shortened.

I will continue to read up and listen to anyone who has the insight to care enough to help me through this problem.
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Old 06-30-2016, 12:48 AM   #116
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I see you took my advice about getting the bikes closer to the trailer.

Now, you MUST secure the top of the rack and bikes to the midline of the trailer so they absolutely cannot move whatsoever. You MUST do this. This is the cantilever action that will not only lead to sway but ALSO rear end separation.

Do NOT ignore this step!!! That little anti-rattle crap is NOT strong enough at the top of the bikes to stop all movement!!!
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Old 06-30-2016, 12:59 PM   #117
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For Caz & Others Showing the Bike Rack Alts. -

Good info. & good rack options above for Caz & all to see,

But a word of warning on some other bike rack option(s):

For my `60 Avion I don't need access to a rear storage hatch, although I was initially hoping to utilize one 2" receiver mounted bike rack for both our `88 VW Vanagon Westfalia (& our cars) - which has a huge up-swinging rear hatch - with the Yakima "Swing Daddy" bike rack, which allows you to swing the entire rack on a pivot arm over to the curb side & grass strip or sidewalk to load/unload, & to fully access the rear hatch unobstructed (there is also now one other swing-out rack out there since I got ours, but I don't recall the maker).

I thought this Swing Daddy would be great for us on the back of the Avion too - just for the loading/unloading at curbside.

However, I found out that Yakima & other mfgrs. making various types of Auto/Truck/SUV/RV rear receiver mounted bike racks - including our Swing Daddy - specifically tell you NOT to use them on the back of trailers due to the amplified movement & bouncing back there.

So you really have to pick bike racks which are specifically designed for trailer use, & to take the amplified forces & bouncing on the back of any trailer. I think the ones pictured above were designed for such service.

As is the Stromberg sold at CW, eTrailer, etc. - although it sticks out too far as in Caz's pix on the prior page (his is Stromberg or similar I think, which I also have - but untried as yet). They can be drilled for a 2nd retaining pin hole further rearward on the tube, in order to bring it closer into the rear of the trailer body (the bikes handlebars'/pedals' width allowing), & may also need to have it's tube cut shorter for clearance to the trailer body &/or frame at that new innermost position. But don't cut the tube unless necessary, so you can still use it in the further out position for clearance/etc. with the full tube lenght for bearing within the tube.

Bottom line is - you can't use the Yakima Swing Daddy on the back of your trailers. But it will work great on the back of the self-powered RVs & Class B Van Campers/RVs, your regular Cars/Vans/SUVs/CUVs etc. for better rear hatch/door or trunk access & clearance, on your TVs when not hitched (or maybe with one of those over-under double receivers when hitched - but then you may have more than ideal distance hitch to TV-rear-wheels that Andy T. talks about).

Note that the Swing Daddy is not an inexpensive rack (mine was $170 IIRC), nor are the AS & Fiamma racks either!

Cheers!
Tom
///////
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Old 06-30-2016, 01:08 PM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RareStream View Post

Now, you MUST secure the top of the rack and bikes to the midline of the trailer so they absolutely cannot move whatsoever. You MUST do this. This is the cantilever action that will not only lead to sway but ALSO rear end separation.
I would recommend caution in attachments to the AS/other trailer body halfway or whatever up, since the frame for the body is much lighter weight, than is the main steel tube or "C" section frame below the floor & extending to the bumper.

While you can stabilize somewhat at the body mid-line, you really should have securing tie-backs down to the bumper &/or main frame extensions holding the bumper. I've seen typical webbed-belt cargo tie-down straps around or hooked to the main frame itself, & up to the top of the bike rack & bikes, successfully used for this purpose.

Be Safe,
Tom
///////
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Old 06-30-2016, 01:19 PM   #119
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This has worked for over 15 years. The secret is the clips on the window sill. The bumper can carry the vertical load but not the rotational load. That load is carried by the straps to the window sill.
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Old 06-30-2016, 02:35 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_T View Post
I would recommend caution in attachments to the AS/other trailer body halfway or whatever up, since the frame for the body is much lighter weight, than is the main steel tube or "C" section frame below the floor & extending to the bumper.

While you can stabilize somewhat at the body mid-line, you really should have securing tie-backs down to the bumper &/or main frame extensions holding the bumper. I've seen typical webbed-belt cargo tie-down straps around or hooked to the main frame itself, & up to the top of the bike rack & bikes, successfully used for this purpose.

Be Safe,
Tom
///////
While your advice is sound, it doesn't necessarily apply the same way to an Airstream as it does to other trailers.

The point of securing the bikes to the structural ribs at the mid-line is to take some of the load OFF of the frame, to prevent oscillations and dynamic movement which over time will rip the shell FROM the frame.

Securing EVERYTHING to the frame alone is going to contribute to the problem.

That's why the Fiamma rack is designed the way it is; the two upper anchors (that sadly break in half) are secured to two vertical support ribs on the back of the trailer to keep the dynamic forces from being SOLELY tied to the frame itself.

Howie in the post above this one has the RIGHT idea.
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Old 06-30-2016, 09:35 PM   #121
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Team,

So I measured how much I can shorten the shank: 3.5"

I am scheduled to take it to the shop Tue, July 5.
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Old 07-01-2016, 11:19 AM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RareStream View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_T
I would recommend caution in attachments to the AS/other trailer body halfway or whatever up, since the frame for the body is much lighter weight, than is the main steel tube or "C" section frame below the floor & extending to the bumper.

While you can stabilize somewhat at the body mid-line, you really should have securing tie-backs down to the bumper &/or main frame extensions holding the bumper. I've seen typical webbed-belt cargo tie-down straps around or hooked to the main frame itself, & up to the top of the bike rack & bikes, successfully used for this purpose.

Be Safe,
Tom
///////


While your advice is sound, it doesn't necessarily apply the same way to an Airstream as it does to other trailers.

The point of securing the bikes to the structural ribs at the mid-line is to take some of the load OFF of the frame, to prevent oscillations and dynamic movement which over time will rip the shell FROM the frame.

Securing EVERYTHING to the frame alone is going to contribute to the problem.

That's why the Fiamma rack is designed the way it is; the two upper anchors (that sadly break in half) are secured to two vertical support ribs on the back of the trailer to keep the dynamic forces from being SOLELY tied to the frame itself.

Howie in the post above this one has the RIGHT idea.
Just to be clear, I was saying to use the diagonal straps or braces down to the bumper or frame extensions in addition to the mid-body brace/attachment.

As you say above, the mid-body bracing prevents torsion, while the bike rack mount to the bumper carries vertical wt., & then the diagonal braces/straps prevent the L-to-R swaying which can happen - especially on single post types of racks like Caz is using.

The diagonals are in the same plane as the rack vertical(s) - so they do little or nothing for stopping the torsional or rotational movement.

Thanx for pointing that out.

Cheers!
Tom
////////
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Old 07-01-2016, 11:30 AM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cazual6 View Post
Team,

So I measured how much I can shorten the shank: 3.5"

I am scheduled to take it to the shop Tue, July 5.
Caz -

You may not need to cut the shank at all, & cut into the powder coating, etc. back there. You may be able to just drill the holes through the shank further back towards the rack upright braces, in order to mount the rack closer to the back of your AS.

To check this weekend - drill the new outer securing pin thru holes on the shank 1st - the placement at 3.5" or whatever distance will still work for your bikes' clearance to the body at further into the bumper mounted receiver's 2"sq hole, then measure the shank to see if it will still clear your trailer body/frame/bumper parts underneath there first, with it pushed further in to the new 2nd hitch mounting pin hole.

You can also measure or mock it up with paper or chipboard/cardboard too, to check that clearance.

Let me know about the Sherline HW scale offer from my PM whenever works.

Good Luck Caz, & Have a Great 4th All!
Tom
///////
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Old 07-01-2016, 11:35 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cazual6 View Post
Team,

So I measured how much I can shorten the shank: 3.5"

I am scheduled to take it to the shop Tue, July 5.
"Team".

I think that's kind of sweet.

It took him awhile, but he does seem to realize help is here.


Maggie
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Old 07-01-2016, 12:47 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_T View Post
Just to be clear, I was saying to use the diagonal straps or braces down to the bumper or frame extensions in addition to the mid-body brace/attachment.

As you say above, the mid-body bracing prevents torsion, while the bike rack mount to the bumper carries vertical wt., & then the diagonal braces/straps prevent the L-to-R swaying which can happen - especially on single post types of racks like Caz is using.

The diagonals are in the same plane as the rack vertical(s) - so they do little or nothing for stopping the torsional or rotational movement.

Thanx for pointing that out.

Cheers!
Tom
////////
Well THAT makes sense then, Tom!!!

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Old 07-01-2016, 08:19 PM   #126
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Tom, I had to shave 1/16 of an inch just to get it to where it is now. The shank can't go in more without cutting the shank.

I also had created anchor points before to prevent the mount from having any play Left to Right. That was before I purchased that hitch mount tightener to remove any play. Anchor points were at the sides of the bumper storage.
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